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The doghouse

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Original poster

I'm ready for a flaming but why are breeders so badly thought of

79 replies

cedmonds · 31/10/2011 14:41

HI
I have lurked on here for a while and have had a few posts as well.
What I want to know is why are breeders so badly thought of.
I understand back yard breeders etc but when people are breeding responsibly and to improve line etc what is the problem with it.
I am also know that there are lots of unwanted dogs etc but that is not ever breeders fault.
We do everything we can for our pups in making sure they have a good start in life and go to the bet possible homes be it working homes or pet homes.
All the bitches and pups have all the testing required and more. The pups are vet checked.They are breed in the home not in kennels and they are well socialized and used to house hold noise etc.

We will grill anyone who comes to see the pups and if we could we would do home check as well. We also will not let anyone have a puppy untill they have been to see the litter a few times.

All puppies have a contract stating that if they do need to be re homed at any time they must contact us first and we will have the pup back.They also have endorsements stating that they can not be breed from untill we have seen proof of testing and what stud dog/ bitch they want to use. 9 times out of ten we say no!!

We advise people to neuter etc but obviously we can not make them do it .
So what is so wrong with what we are doing we do not make any money out of it and its bloody hard work.

OP posts:

DogsBeastFiend · 31/10/2011 20:50

Now do me a favour please. All of you, especially the OP. Take a quick read of this. It will only take 5 minutes.

Then tell me how the feck you can justify even THINKING about breeding yet more GSD, especially working line ones.

I can verify every word of the write up on that dog and guarantee you that it is entirely accurate.

I know, because I wrote it.

Original poster

cedmonds · 31/10/2011 20:56

I see it already as help in a local rescue!! As i have i said we have had only a few littters and out of one of those a bitch only had 3 pups and i kept one one died and the other a freind had. If i could have a bigger house i would have rescuse dogs as well but people dont only have dogs for pets and when you see the 1000s of dogs at crufts etc it is not only me that thinks that. At the show at the weekend there were 400 collies.
If the regulations said that un reg dogs could be shown than i would also have more recused dogs to show. I think just becasue they have not got a piece of paper they can not show is crap. It would just need to be important to know lines etc.

OP posts:

EdlessAllenPoe · 31/10/2011 20:57

iirc DBF is one of your GSDs really gorgeous?

hopes other one doesn't take offence

bumpybecky · 31/10/2011 20:58

can I ask a question too?

how legally binding are clauses in contracts that say you can't breed from the animal / have to check the stud dog or bitch / have to rehome back to the breeder

I've been wondering how that all works - how would anyone know if someone did breed a dog they promised they wouldn't breed from? (hope that makes sense!)

oh and I'm not thinking of breeding anything before you ask - all adult mammals (apart from me!) in the house have been dealt with thanks!

notmeagain · 31/10/2011 21:00

Well if you see if already then why are you not trying to stop it?

This thread can't be about you because even if you are a "responsible" breeder there are so many that are not. The facts show that with all the unwanted dogs and all the dogs in rescue.

Showing dogs is another can of worms! Dogs breed just to show .......don't get me started

Original poster

cedmonds · 31/10/2011 21:01

I know DBF that is yet another reason why i have not had any litters and i am thinking twice and prob wont breed any more!
Why people have to be so shit is beond me. When i said working lines i meant obedience sorry my mistake.

OP posts:

EdlessAllenPoe · 31/10/2011 21:02

how legally binding are clauses in contracts that say you can't breed from the animal / have to check the stud dog or bitch / have to rehome back to the breeder

if the contract of sale is properly signed and witnessed, it would stand up in a court of law. easier, of course, to sell to people who are really, really unlikely to do that to you.

DogsBeastFiend · 31/10/2011 21:02

EAP both my GSD are gorgeous! Cheeky mare! :o

But I think you mean my rescued 8 yo long haired white GSD boy? Tell you what, pretty as he is, my also rescued 5yo, whom I have had since a pup, is FAR better behaved!

Becky, as far as I know, speaking wrt rescue, there has never been a test case to see how legally binding the return to rescue etc clauses are.

EdlessAllenPoe · 31/10/2011 21:05

ah, they're easier to forgive when they're beautiful....

notes loveliness of Hound of Poe

toboldlygo · 31/10/2011 21:06

Oh god DBF, that's just my sort of dog, if I didn't think my DP would leave me if I brought another one home I'd have him in a flash.

bumpyb, the progeny of a dog with endorsements on its papers (that haven't later been lifted by the breeder) cannot be registered with the KC which should be enough to put people off. There's nothing to stop them from breeding from the dog anyway, just that the pups won't be KC registered.

Original poster

cedmonds · 31/10/2011 21:12

I think they are only leaglly binding in such as they can not register any pup with the endorsments on. So if they were only breeding the dog for money they will not get the same amount and think twice.
My dogs are breed to be pets but we also enjoy showing etc and so do the dogs. Well i think they do with the manic barking a tail wagging etc when they know they are going to a show!! On the other hand i do not belive in the show kennels etc and i have been offtered well over a 1000 for a pup before but have said no. I do not agree in dogs being caged all there life.

OP posts:

DogsBeastFiend · 31/10/2011 21:12

Anyway OP, what's stopping you from going to your breed club/other dog forums tonight and ringing around your fellow breeders tomorrow morning, emailing breed club secretaries and starting a campaign to get a list of those willing to homecheck up and running?

We do it - through our contacts made via rescue, by just picking up the phone and asking another rescue if they'd be so kind and via animal rights email listings. It probably took time to get off the ground, I don't know, it was a system already in place when I got seriously involved in finding rescue places for unwanted/pound dogs some 6 or so years back, but it had to start somewhere and lucky for me and those dogs that SOMEONE got off their bum and started the ball rolling.

So... when will you be that someone?

KatharineClifton · 31/10/2011 21:13

cedmonds - I'm off now to to scare the kids with the Buffy episode called Hush. Have done a brilliant build up [hgrin]. Can I PM you a couple of training questions tomorrow?

I think everyone here wants the best for all dogs.

Original poster

cedmonds · 31/10/2011 21:14

Sorry also ment to say that the rescuse i help at we have a very good relationship and if any dog should end up in the resuce world that i have breed or has anything to do with the breed lines they let me know and i would have it back.

OP posts:

WitchesBrewIsMyFriend · 31/10/2011 21:15

toboldlygo I am replying to your 19:54 post.

I have always had GSDs and ONLY have working line dogs (and bitches) - the show dog is a hideous representation of the 'original' dog and to see them in the ring breaks my heart. That is not what they were bred for and when you see an old dog with hideous hip problems and it is so arthritic euch, its enough to make you weep.

There is now a non working line in English/German GSDs and they are trying to bring the square shape back, but sadly for a lot of dogs it is far too late.

My breeder homechecks, does much much more and is a fantastic example of a proper breeder. They dont breed every year and have actually retired my dogs Mum. She will be spayed and kept until the day she goes to rainbow bridge - along with their other dogs.

Original poster

cedmonds · 31/10/2011 21:15

Katharine yeah thats fine no probs

OP posts:

Original poster

cedmonds · 31/10/2011 21:18

Witches yes i know how people think it is ok to make a dog suffer like that is something i will never understand.
I will also get the dogs spayed when they have finshed/ cant breed anymore and they are all in the dog grave yard in our field when they are no longer with us.

OP posts:

Original poster

cedmonds · 31/10/2011 21:23

I have said to a few people about it.
When i have enough time (i have a very ill child ) i will email all the breed clubs in the country etc. Personally i think the kennel club need to do more and not to sit on the bum the whole time as a accredted breeder i get to tell them what i think they can do to improve and one of those things is to make home checking a must. They laughed and said it was not possiblle, because of the distance pups were sold etc.

OP posts:

Original poster

cedmonds · 31/10/2011 21:24

Shit sorry for the typos i normally spell check

OP posts:

DogsBeastFiend · 31/10/2011 21:40

The KC has a lot to answer for and frankly would be a joke if it wasn't so damaging to dog welfare IMHO. Bloody idiots! Not possible because of distance? I'll say it again... we manage it and despite that most GOOD breeders don't make a mint, I do accept that actually, they are generally a feck sight better off than we rescuers and so would achieve it with more ease than we do!
Sorry to hear of your ill child, I hope he or she makes a recovery very, very soon. :(

Original poster

cedmonds · 31/10/2011 21:51

I know what you mean. I have done local home checks . I have said the distance comment to the KC but i get the feeling that they do not agree with rescue dogs etc. But that is another thread.
Thanks for the good wishes for dd she will pull though she is such a fighter.
I also agree that breeders are better of but i also think that all though they are good breeders they are to wrapped up in themselves.
I would love to make a law that said people had to have some sort of training/test etc and regular checks to have any sort of pet. I am at the moment trying to find homes for lots of unwanted horses that were left to die in a field. but i am also aware that it will never happen. Even if hundreds of people are trying to make it happen.

OP posts:

thefirstMrsDeVeerie · 31/10/2011 21:56

Its been a very long time since I worked in rescue/animal welfare. I worked for the RSPCA (yes I KNOW! but we were all devoted, the organisation was pants though).

I remember thinking at the time how I wished everyone would just stop breeding and wait until every cross breed had a home. In those days cross, cross, cross breeds were more common than the seem now. I cant remember the last time I saw a Heinz 57, they all seem to be staffie x or JRT x now.

It was just so depressing to be drowning in beautiful dogs with nowhere for them to go and most of them in horrible states. The amount of stunted GSDs I saw , they were the Staffie of the early 80s and so many were kept on balconies. Then came the Dobies then the Rotties and then the Pits and Staffs.

I admit I am a mongrol fan and prefer them to any pedigree (sorry guys). At the moment I have a lovely Chi x Pom. He is a darling. I have seen lots of dogs that were sold as pure Chihauhaus to very young girls (always girls) and they paid £1000 for them. One look told me that they were yorkie/JRT/etc x.
I think its unlikely that those dogs will be kept as long term companions. They were so clearly fashion accessories.

Anyway that was a bit of a ramble

bemybebe · 31/10/2011 21:56

"I would love to make a law that said people had to have some sort of training/test etc and regular checks to have any sort of pet."

Completely unrealistic way to go about it imho.

Original poster

cedmonds · 31/10/2011 22:16

thats what i said!! People need to be educated what the needs etc are . They should not be able to get up in the morning and think i want a dog and go snd get one.Which happens.
Things need to change but i dont have a clue knowing how to help.
Maybe that is because i am a crap person.
What i do know is that is the wrong people breed dogs or any animal it can and most prob be a disater.

OP posts:

ChippingInAutumnLover · 01/11/2011 02:48

i also agree that there are to many unwanted dogs in the world and there is something that needs doing about

Well, you could do something yourself - stop breeding

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