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Telly addicts

Panorama Private ADHD clinics exposed

392 replies

Youdoyoubabe · 15/05/2023 20:46

Nothing surprising there really but good to highlight it on national television. Everyone has some characteristics of ADHD.

OP posts:
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Itwasnaeme · 15/05/2023 23:19

If someone is using disabling language or terminology, I will report it, and being told I'm "running to teacher" (like I give a shit about what some cool girls think) is not going to cause me any problem.

ArcticSkewer · 15/05/2023 23:21

Itwasnaeme · 15/05/2023 23:19

If someone is using disabling language or terminology, I will report it, and being told I'm "running to teacher" (like I give a shit about what some cool girls think) is not going to cause me any problem.

Shame you can't report the Guardian or Panorama as well isn't it. https://www.theguardian.com/society/2022/jun/02/tiktok-trends-or-the-pandemic-whats-behind-the-rise-in-adhd-diagnoses
Is trend a better word than fad?

TikTok trends or the pandemic? What’s behind the rise in ADHD diagnoses

By 2016, the reported incidence of adult ADHD rose by 123% in the US – increases in stimulant medication prescriptions suggest its rise continues

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2022/jun/02/tiktok-trends-or-the-pandemic-whats-behind-the-rise-in-adhd-diagnoses

ArcticSkewer · 15/05/2023 23:24

It's a disgrace that private companies are exploiting people as exposed by Panorama and I will continue to say that, regardless of other 'cool girl' opinion to the contrary.

wheresmymojo · 15/05/2023 23:30

@EmmaEmerald

I'm asking because I was diagnosed privately with ADHD. I didn't purchase medication from them (and it wasn't an option, had to go to Boots like everyone else).

I only needed one follow up appointment.

I don't see how that's a cash cow really.

GozerTheGozerian · 15/05/2023 23:32

The gaslighting is making out there is any equivalence between most people’s experiences of everyday life and those of people who live with ADHD. It is a daily, constant condition which causes serious issues in every aspect of your life. Not an occasional thing. Not something that can be cured.

And as well as dealing with it, you then have people minimising and waffling on about it being a fad. That’s the gaslighting and there has been plenty of talk on this thread and others that it isn’t that bad and everyone has a bit of ADHD. This is particularly damaging as it makes people feel they are wrong in some way because they find it all so much harder than everyone else when the truth is they have a neurodevelopmental disability. They can’t think their way out of it or try harder.

wheresmymojo · 15/05/2023 23:33

I have to say I didn't go to a specific ADHD clinic though.

I went to a general private psychiatrist.

junebirthdaygirl · 15/05/2023 23:35

My ds has ADHD only diagnosed in his 20s. He is also dyslexic so a lot of the symptoms were put down to this. But his life was going from one crisis to another and he was doing everything he could to get on top of it. He was diagnosed in a private clinic but it was a very thorough process with a psychiatrist and a psychologist.
I have done every test online and l have absolutely no signs of ADHD so l absolutely do not think anyone could be diagnosed. I couldn't be more opposite to my ds. But my dh ..his dad.. has all the signs ..every single symptom but never diagnosed and has struggled but has been successful with huge perseverance.
I haven't seen the programme but l thoroughly agree with the private clinic'sdiagnosis of my ds and it is no fad or following online nonsense. Its genuine and he needed that clinic as in lreland its impossible to get an assessment as an adult on the public system. Since going on the medical he has seen great improvements and is being closely monitored by the clinic. He is actually grieving over the struggles and disappointment he wasn't diagnosed sooner.

LovelyJublee · 15/05/2023 23:37

Youdoyoubabe · 15/05/2023 22:19

Try this quiz any and all of you. Everyone I know who does these get the result that they could have ADHD.

https://www.adhdcentre.co.uk/adhd-quiz/

SIL 9
Bil 10
Dh 10
Me 45

GruffalosGirl · 15/05/2023 23:37

I got my ADHD diagnosis years ago, after my son was diagnosed by the nhs, when the consultant paediatrician advised I get assessed too. My psychiatrist that diagnosed me is the same one I would see under nhs, just without the five year wait in adult services, and I was referred by my GP, as my psychiatrist will only take patients that meet the NHS referral requirements, and the NHS fill my prescriptions. My standard of care is much better than what ds gets as a NHS patient and my assessment was much more thorough. There are good private services out there, but the poor ones make it harder for patients to be believed. That's not panorama's fault, but these kind of programmes really don't help an already disbelieved patient group.

We are currently paying for assessment only for DD for adhd, while we wait for her to work her way through the nhs pathway. The camhs waiting list she is on is 40 weeks minimum, and the adhd pathway is even longer. We can't get the right support in place until we know if it's adhd or anxiety and it's destroying her mental health in the meantime. I'd much rather just wait for the NHS, but services are at breaking point. We waited over a year more than five years ago for ds's diagnosis, the waits now are much longer. Parents are desperate and will turn anywhere they think can help their kids. Clinics that don't meet nice guidelines need investigation, but the NHS is failing families so they're bound to sprout up. If they want this to stop they need to invest in services.

Whatevercanbedone · 15/05/2023 23:44

@ArcticSkewer
Yes 3 year wait. No issue at all. What happens to a teen with cancer who has to wait 3 years for diagnosis and treatment ?
Better wait and see then find out quick right?

The wait for assessment for us had devastating consequences to academic progress, mental health and well being. (Not just for the child either, the whole family had serious decline in our well being). I personally was severely sleep deprived until we finally got melatonin prescription. We had 2 more years wait after this point before we paid privately.

Child now has support in education (I was told a diagnosis won't change anything, child should be supported in education based on need and the LA saying child doesn't need support as no diagnosis.
Child had more than 1 diagnosis but also many things that were found not to have, which was also helpful.
We also got a ton of recommendations and info.

We have a child who no longer school refuses, self harm has decreased.

But yes we should just wait it out until child or family member was harmed

ArcticSkewer · 15/05/2023 23:44

LovelyJublee · 15/05/2023 23:37

SIL 9
Bil 10
Dh 10
Me 45

34

ArcticSkewer · 15/05/2023 23:48

Whatevercanbedone · 15/05/2023 23:44

@ArcticSkewer
Yes 3 year wait. No issue at all. What happens to a teen with cancer who has to wait 3 years for diagnosis and treatment ?
Better wait and see then find out quick right?

The wait for assessment for us had devastating consequences to academic progress, mental health and well being. (Not just for the child either, the whole family had serious decline in our well being). I personally was severely sleep deprived until we finally got melatonin prescription. We had 2 more years wait after this point before we paid privately.

Child now has support in education (I was told a diagnosis won't change anything, child should be supported in education based on need and the LA saying child doesn't need support as no diagnosis.
Child had more than 1 diagnosis but also many things that were found not to have, which was also helpful.
We also got a ton of recommendations and info.

We have a child who no longer school refuses, self harm has decreased.

But yes we should just wait it out until child or family member was harmed

God can you imagine. You don't have cancer but hey try this chemo - saves you a three year wait for a more accurate diagnosis. Nothing to lose, right? Says dodgy private company making millions diagnosing every customer with cancer. I mran, if you have cancer, sure it's better but if you don't? Is it really okay?

The issue is misdiagnosis. That is an absolutely huge issue. Then add in possible deliberate misdiagnosis for profit. You cannot ethically defend that.

ArcticSkewer · 15/05/2023 23:52

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-65534449

The article is very sad, really. This man saw his sister die in front of him and is probably suffering from long term complex trauma. He isn't making up his symptoms for the TV. He is a vulnerable person with mental health problems who needs treatment that matches his actual problem.
The other woman in the article was so traumatised by her assessment with that adhd clinic that she was subsequently off work for four months.

Harm is being done here. For profit.
How any of you can defend it is an utter mystery to me.

Rory Carson

I don't have ADHD, but three private clinics say I do

A BBC journalist was told "You do not have ADHD" by an NHS doctor - but private clinics said otherwise.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-65534449

Itwasnaeme · 15/05/2023 23:56

Exa

Itwasnaeme · 15/05/2023 23:56

Exactly, Gruffalo's girl. What su

Itwasnaeme · 15/05/2023 23:57

Phone has gone a bit strange...

Oxfordblue · 16/05/2023 00:00

and the differences between someone who does have a diagnosis and who does not, are the levels and whether they meet the threshold.

Whatevercanbedone · 16/05/2023 00:01

@ArcticSkewer

The point being that people pay private because the NHS isn't able to assess in any acceptable time frame.
A child waiting for an medical assessment to find out what's wrong will likely due if it's cancer and they have to wait over 3 years for an assessment. If my child was sick and I would pay for private tests to find out why rather than watch them deteriorate and die (as much as I could afford).

Prior to our private Ed psych and ND assessments my child was high risk. We were lucky to be in a financial position to do this.

What do you think happens to children in crisis that are left waitingn too long for assessments (that are needed to ensure right meds, right support can be put in place etc)

They self harm, their mental health deteriorates fast and faster. They harm others, they kell themselves.

Wednesdaysotherchild · 16/05/2023 00:19

GozerTheGozerian · 15/05/2023 23:32

The gaslighting is making out there is any equivalence between most people’s experiences of everyday life and those of people who live with ADHD. It is a daily, constant condition which causes serious issues in every aspect of your life. Not an occasional thing. Not something that can be cured.

And as well as dealing with it, you then have people minimising and waffling on about it being a fad. That’s the gaslighting and there has been plenty of talk on this thread and others that it isn’t that bad and everyone has a bit of ADHD. This is particularly damaging as it makes people feel they are wrong in some way because they find it all so much harder than everyone else when the truth is they have a neurodevelopmental disability. They can’t think their way out of it or try harder.

This.

RedToothBrush · 16/05/2023 00:25

Youdoyoubabe · 15/05/2023 22:16

What a strange view. Do you really think such investigative journalism is pointless?

Granted there are plenty of other areas of life and specifically healthcare to investigate but I thought this was interesting and highlighted potential sharp practices in this area of medical business.

I find the economics of medicine fascinating, not pointless.

I think this 'investigative journalism' is sensationalist crap, not investigative journalism.

It asks the wrong questions and in doing so creates a narrative that's harmful in its own right.

I just can't help but think that the BBC are coming at this subject from the wrong angle.

Why? Well here's a few reasons.

If you want a diagnosis through the NHS it's a total lottery in its own right. It's a total lottery as to whether you have a GP who 'believes' in ADHD or not. Lots of people, particularly women, struggle to get taken seriously even at the first stage. Unfortunately there are far too many doctors with outdated ideas about who has ADHD and are ignorant about how it manifests in women and girls.

Even at school, every local authority seems to have a separate system for assessing kids. One of my good friends is a teacher in the next council over (a whole two miles) and my other friend works at DSs school. The system in both areas is different. It's a farce and there's no consistency and little oversight.

There is a clear problem which is hitting women particularly badly. And it's women who are most likely to be negatively impacted by private misdiagnosis. And the stigma from now having an 'unreliable' private diagnosis. And be put off trying to get a private or NHS diagnosis.

I'm really quite upset and don't think it's responsible journalism on the basis of what the BBC news article has put out. There's too many ommisions which are crucial here to understanding whats going on in full.

Typically women go through a process of being diagnosed with different mental health conditions before getting 'the right one'. Many go for decades like this.

That's your scandal.

And as such many will have been on various medications that don't work and give dreadful side effects for years before looking at ADHD as a possibility.

The impact of late diagnosis is increased problems with comorbid issues such as anxiety, depression and eating disorders. It can therefore potentially be fatal in rare cases.

The programme talks about people getting unnecessary medication - but doesn't talk about whether they were on other medication previously or getting medication for the first time. This is relevant for context purposes.

Being on the wrong medication because of misdiagnosis and inability to access an assessment through the NHS FOR YEARS, is no less of a scandal than overdiagnosis and medication of ADHD.

People don't fork out hundreds of pounds on a diagnosis on the basis that they saw something on social media. There has to be something fundamentally 'wrong' in their life thats having a significant impact to their daily lives, to go through the process.

This bloke rocking up with a few thousand pounds without thought, isn't reflective of the real world.

If you are going down the private route, chances are there is a sense of getting desperate for appropriate support for SOMETHING.

Also the BBC article is based on the example of one male getting misdiagnosed privately. It doesn't talk about who is seeking diagnosis by private assessment. If there is a heavy basis to a certain demographic - for example adult women are particularly over represented in seeking a private diagnosis there may be other issues at play. For example we know that the autism diagnositic tools favour diagnosis of boys because girls present differently and the science is only just begining to catch up on that. It could be that the NHS is behind the curve on diagnosis in girls / women and the criteria they are using is no longer fit for purpose and not matching what we know about ADHD in women. See my comments about GPs being ignorant. There's plenty of misgyonistic GPs who arrogantly don't listen to a word women say and pretty much tell women it's all in their head.

In using a male for the programme, I also worry whether the effect of the programme will further disportionally affect women who were much more likely to be underdiagnosed in the first place.

It going to add to the stigma and make it harder for the very people who most need a diagnosis because they really do have life limiting issues due to ADHD.

My son is currently going through the process with school. My plan was to get somewhere with him before looking into it for me as it would add weight to my case. I have a history of problems and ultimately had two breakdowns directly related to being unable to cope at work. I just 'burnout' despite being able. At school I had meltdowns but only at home. It affects my day to day life. I've had a diagnosis in the past of social anxiety which my friends actively laugh at.

This programme just makes it more daunting, more frightening and the whole process more distressing to even think about. It's overwhelming.

All on the less than scientific basis of one bloke doing this in a rather biased way.

The questions it should ask is why so many people are going private, who are they, what's their history, why are they coming forward now, how consistent is the system within the NHS itself in comparison with the private sector, are schools and GPS actively advising people to go private and what are their recommendations (and do they have conflicts of interest in recommending a private route), are schools being too much of a gatekeeper on this expecting teachers to understand spotting ADHD in the classroom?

If you now have a private diagnosis, will that be taken seriously? (Keep in mind who is often actively telling people to go private - whether it's recognised by schools, local authorities and GPs matters - and it can be the schools and GPs saying to go private in the first place). If you've spent a grand on a diagnosis are you now going to have to demonstrate its a sound diagnosis? Even if it's had a life-changing effect.

This is actively adding to the stigma and ignorant comments about ADHD... That doesn't help anyone.

RedToothBrush · 16/05/2023 00:31

Harm is being done here. For profit.
How any of you can defend it is an utter mystery to me.

It's not a neutral thing though. Not attempting to go private has it's own list of potential harms. The 'do nothing' school of thought is also problematic.

It's teachers and GPs that are actively encouraging people to go down the private route because the NHS isn't fit for purpose either.

The programme encourages us to trust the NHS as having gold standards on this matter. It uses it as the standard to be held to. This is problematic. It should be critical of the NHS too and see why it's left people resorting to paying what they can't afford to do so.

sandgrown · 16/05/2023 00:32

You may find this hard to believe but some parents want their child labelling so they can claim disability benefits. They can soon recoup the £1000 fee for a private diagnosis.

Return2thebasic · 16/05/2023 00:38

ljb23 · 15/05/2023 22:24

I watched it. It was the worst documentary I've ever seen. Totally biased. The 'investigator' told the NHS doctor he was from panorama, where as he didn't tell the private clinics this.

Most Psychiatrists work in the NHS AND private clinics. They are the same clinicians.

The 'investigator' also lied to the private clinics and pretended he had ADHD to get a diagnosis and then was saying this wasn't correct when he got one, even though he was pretending to have ADHD.

Most people who go to clinics for ADHD already think they have ADHD and expect a diagnosis.

Disclaim: I didn't watch the program but I read the article.

That's not the point. I don't think we should dismiss the purpose and the importance of disclosing these money making practice of some private clinics.

I honestly don't care how he was questioned and how he answered, if he told the NHS doctor but not the private ones. What I can see straight is that no other professionals other than psychiatrists are qualified to diagnose. So the third practice is completely on the wrong, full stop. The second one is arguably saying the psychiatrist diagnosed on the basis of the psychologist 's opinion. That's cheeky, isn't it? Not without any self-purposed intention on the back, it's not something that helps in any sense.

I saw this from a different angle. I saw it's highlighting the bad and irresponsible practice by some private clinics which are trying to profit from the vulnerable. Why so many people here jump up bashing the investigation is beyond my understanding. (It's not to say NHS is the solution. It's not to say people who got the diagnosis are illegitimate. It's not to say the investigators method is perfectly balanced.)

There needs to have push to realign the quality and accountability of those private services providers. I saw that as the purpose of the program.

For whatever that's relevant, I have ADHD and so does my DC. And my diagnosis by NHS many years ago was a year waiting and just one appointment with forms filled upfront by DH and myself. The appointment probably lasted only over one hour and the psychiatrist was quite certain very quickly that I have the condition. My DC was diagnosed last year privately. I searched up and down before deciding to go with a psychiatrist who's one of the top experts of this field. Very expensive, but I wanted be sure that making money was not his primary purpose ( he's well regarded in the field and not short of patients).

Return2thebasic · 16/05/2023 00:40

RedToothBrush · 16/05/2023 00:31

Harm is being done here. For profit.
How any of you can defend it is an utter mystery to me.

It's not a neutral thing though. Not attempting to go private has it's own list of potential harms. The 'do nothing' school of thought is also problematic.

It's teachers and GPs that are actively encouraging people to go down the private route because the NHS isn't fit for purpose either.

The programme encourages us to trust the NHS as having gold standards on this matter. It uses it as the standard to be held to. This is problematic. It should be critical of the NHS too and see why it's left people resorting to paying what they can't afford to do so.

I confess I didn't watch the program but only read the article.

Did they indeed promote NHS and telling people not to trust private service providers? Or they actually wanted to alarm people who intend to go down this path and push for more scrutiny in this sector??

suburbophobe · 16/05/2023 00:44

Everyone has some characteristics of ADHD.

Not true. I'm late 60's.

Swipe left for the next trending thread