Panorama Private ADHD clinics exposed

[Youdoyoubabe]

Nothing surprising there really but good to highlight it on national television. Everyone has some characteristics of ADHD.

This 'everyone's got a bit of ADHD' 'we're all somewhere on the spectrum' crap really concerns me, because it minimises the very real affect on the lives of those who actually have it.

This

What has alarmed me this week is a friend of DHs has a son with pretty severe autism and ADHD.

He didn't watch the programme. He read the BBC article. Then started spouting off shit to DH about how awful private clinics are and how all these people were faking.

DH had to really hammer it home to him, just how flawed the programme was, how inaccurate some of the ADHD crap he was saying was and how this was particularly affecting adult women. He knows the situation with our son and does think DS has ADHD (after looking after our son without us being around) and knows the barriers we are being told we are going to come across and why it's so fucking unfair. He knows my history too.

DH was so angry that his mate who really should be informed was doing the whole 'im alright jack' routine and actually reinforcing the stigmas and bullshit out there (which are also not in the interests of his own son)

If the article (not even the programme - cos he couldn't be bothered to watch that) has that much of an impact on someone who is supposed to be informed it's utterly appalling.

Speed from dodgy Dave doesn't get you adjustments at school, uni and work. Doesn't get you deemed to be disabled and entitled to DWP benefits including PIP.

There are more benefits to a diagnosis than medication.

@MerlinBirds you’ve got to be joking? People with ADHD have to fight and fight for PIP and prove/evidence absolutely every single thing they say about how it affects them. There’s really no way an NT could fake that.

How many people diagnosed with adhd are entitled to benefits? Not anyone I know

Is there not?

You do realise there are sites and support groups where tips are given on how to evidence for PIP applications? For everybody, not just for specific conditions.

And you do realise 'proof and evidence' is entirely based on self-reporting right? A PIP assessor isn't following anyone around to see if what they said is true.

Why are posters here so insistent that there is no possible reason that anyone without ADHD could ever want a diagnosis of ADHD?

And that there are zero benefits of having a diagnosis of ADHD?

And that there isn't a social media 'trend' around ADHD?

And that it just isn't true that some private providers are doing crappy assessments?

Talk about protesting too much..

I don't have ADHD and could put together a solid argument that I do. And fill in a PIP form and get it awarded. Even if not at first try, I'd ask for mandatory reconsideration then go to appeal if necessary.

It's a diagnosis that can't be proven or disproven as there is no objective test for it.

Try me on some PIP questions if you like, I'll be convincing.

It's classed as a disability so that comes with an entitlement to disability benefits including PIP.

https://www.benefitsandwork.co.uk/news/claiming-pip-for-adults-with-add-adhd

Here's some highlights:

"One of the most visited threads on the Benefits and Work forum is a six year old one about claiming PIP for adults with Attention Deficit Hyperactivity Disorder (ADHD)'

"In total, there are 37,784 PIP claimants with ADD/ADHD listed as their main disabling condition according to the DWP’s own statistics"

"The average success rate for all assessed claims for PIP is 53%.

For ADD/ADHD the success rate is 49%.

So, a little bit lower than average, but still almost half of all claimants with ADD/ADHD get an award."

"Almost everyone who gets PIP for ADD/ADHD gets an award of the daily living component and two thirds get an award of the mobility component.

34% get the enhanced rates of both components.

Enhanced daily living 26,699 (71%)
Standard daily living 10,200 (27%)
Enhanced mobility 14,030 (37%)
Standard mobility 11,502 (31%)"

And here's some tips on how to get awarded PIP for ADHD:

"There are no statistics which show which activities and descriptors PIP claimants with ADD/ADHD scored points for.

But, because PIP is awarded not because of your condition, but because of the way it affects your daily living and mobility then every claim will be different in any case.

The best way to establish whether you might be eligible for PIP on the basis of ADD/ADHD is to look through this list of PIP activities and think about the ways that your condition affects your ability to carry them out.

Preparing food
Taking nutrition
Managing therapy or monitoring a health condition
Washing and bathing
Managing toilet needs or incontinence
Dressing and undressing
Communicating verbally
Reading and understanding signs, symbols and words
Engaging with other people face-to-face
Making budgeting decisions
Planning and following journeys
Moving around
Remember that you need to be able to complete the activities

to a reasonable standard,
safely,
repeatedly
no more than twice as long as it would take a person without a health condition.
Below are some examples of the issues that you might have.

Being easily distracted, a tendency to procrastinate and difficulties with organizing tasks may cause problems in relation to preparing food, washing and bathing and dressing and undressing. Tasks may not get started, you may start but not complete them or they may take you more than twice as long as people without a health condition.

A tendency to hyperfocus may affect activities like taking nutrition, if you become so engrossed in things that you forget to eat.

Forgetfulness and disorganization may cause problems with managing medication or therapy.

Being impulsive may make budgeting a real problem.

Engaging with other people may be a challenge because of difficulties with turn taking, maintaining concentration and keeping to a topic during conversations.

Planning and following journeys may be challenging because of impulsivity, poor concentration and anxiety"

Those are the stats for the people who actually applied for PIP. You have no idea what proportion of people with ADHD even apply for it.

Having a diagnosis of ADHD alone makes bugger all difference to a PIP assessment. It’s all about how the condition affects you in relation to the criteria.

I have ADHD but I don’t qualify for PIP. Not because the condition doesn’t have a profound effect on my life, but because I am able to function in ways that exceed the very high thresholds set in PIP.

I haven't read the full thread yet but I did this quiz and it gave me a positive diagnosis of ADHD. I'm really shocked because I am absolutely sure I don't. My mood swings, for example, are more likely to be hormonal. It's shocking that people might be diagnosed in this way.

You seem to feel quite strongly about it, that’s for sure!

I think you’re wrong though.

Which is to say that of the population of people with ADHD, some unknown proportion of people determine that they are sufficiently functionally impaired to put themselves through the process of applying for PIP. it’s an awful process that people don’t generally want to put themselves through.

Of that unknown proportion (there is no way of knowing how many people have an ADHD diagnosis - that data isn’t held anywhere), nearly half are assessed as not being eligible to receive any element of it. The having a diagnosis isn’t part of it. You can apply for PIP without the diagnosis.

That’s not evidence of an epidemic of chancers buying diagnoses to take it in on disability benefits.

Did you even read the information on the page.

That’s not a diagnosis.

This is what that page actually says about the quiz.

The site also says 'Your answers to this test are consistent with a positive diagnosis of ADHD and further investigation would be recommended'. I'm 99.9% sure I don't and I have no intention of taking it further. But there will be some people who read this as a positive diagnosis.

They'd be wrong then.

it would be of no benefit to them anyway as no one would accept it as a diagnosis.

No, but I expect they'd be happy to take my money to do an unnecessary diagnosis. And that's what Panorama was exposing.

That’s not a diagnosis.

It says that your answers to a quiz that “will give an indication as to wether you are experiencing the most common symptoms of ADHD” were consistent with a positive diagnosis so further investigation is recommended.

It doesn’t say you will be positively diagnosed. That’s why a proper assessment is required. Various other tests. Information from people
about your performance now and in childhood. An evaluation by a psychiatrist to bring all that together.

The quiz “cannot replace a full assessment nor should be used to self-diagnose or decide upon a treatment plan”. It just tells you that the answers you provided to simple, multiple choice questions about the most common symptom are consistent with ADHD diagnosis and that it might be worth getting someone who knows what they’re doing to investigate properly.

the actual investigation is not a short online quiz.

sadly reading comprehension is dire in the general population.

anyone claiming that’s a diagnosis has totally misunderstood.

They don’t ‘do a diagnosis’.

They carry out an assessment. The outcome of this is that the psychiatrist may, if appropriate, diagnose ADHD. They will use their professional judgement to do so following clinical guidelines.

If you look at their team, the vast majority of clinical staff are psychiatrists. Actual, NHS-trained (many of them still practising within the NHS alongside private work). They are proper doctors who’ve specialised in psychiatry. If you’d been lucky enough to get an NHS referral, it may well be one of those people
doing that assessment too.

There are other staff members, who presumably deliver their ADHD coaching (as treatment) service and things like that. But the diagnosis looks like
its done by psychiatrists who, one
would assume, care quite a lot about standards and professional reputation and doing the right thing for patients.

Well, that would be down to you for pursuing a diagnosis for something you are 99.9% sure you don't have.

I just wonder where this leaves the poor kids with ADHD, either waiting for years on the NHS or with a private diagnosis that now everyone will think is a joke.

I don't have ADHD and could put together a solid argument that I do. And fill in a PIP form and get it awarded. Even if not at first try, I'd ask for mandatory reconsideration then go to appeal if necessary.

You could say this about myriad conditions. There are much easier conditions than ADHD to make up or exaggerate if you were going to attempt to fraudulently claim PIP. And you do realise how rigorous the assessments are, and how much evidence you need to provide, right? It’s not just about making a ‘solid argument’, there had to be a significant amount of clinical evidence to back it up. And in if you’re awarded PIP, you have to attend regular reviews.

You do realise there are sites and support groups where tips are given on how to evidence for PIP applications?

Thank goodness for that. Have you ever seen a PIP application? Do you know how many people making applications suffer from cognitive impairments and have difficulty filling out forms? Do you not think these people deserve to have support?

You are incredibly ignorant.

No I don't. And didn't claim to.

I'm responding to all the posters doubling down on all the claims that no-one without ADHD would ever pursue a diagnosis because there are literally no benefits to a diagnosis or meds if you don't really have it

And that it's completely impossible to get a diagnosis if you don't really have it.

When this programme demonstrated that it isn't difficult at all with some private providers.

I tell you what @MerlinBirds, why don’t you try applying for PIP with your solid argument, as an experiment? Looking forward to your update with the outcome.