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Telly addicts

Trainwreck: Woodstock 99 on Netflix

151 replies

NorthFaceofthelaundrypile · 04/08/2022 17:05

Has anyone watched this as yet? I watched it yesterday, and found it so disturbing. I’d have hated to have been in the midst of it.

OP posts:
SequinsandStilettos · 10/08/2022 11:34

In fairness, according to the HBO doc, they were handed out earlier that day by anti-gun petitioners, PAX, who wanted a candlelit vigil for Columbine.
I thought they did look beautiful, until it all went to hell in a handbasket. Kiedis insists Fire as an encore was a pre-planned tribute.

Sonnex · 10/08/2022 11:45

Yeah that stupid promoter guy and the stupid Woodstock guy were just so arrogant and superior and out of touch with modern youth culture weren't they?

I mean who would put Bush on after Korn? They were almost guaranteeing riots with the weird line up order. They could surely have calmed it down as well by speaking with the acts and telling them what was going on. I mean Limp Biskit at the time wouldn't have given a damn of course and as you say it was well known what their moshputs were like, but they could have isolated that a bit better, had more secuirity. Korn, Chilli Peppers and Fat Boy Slim at least listened a bit tho, again, those bands has reputations for intense lives shows and I can imagine that they wouldn't want to 'riin their image' unless they were told that people were really getting hurt, which it doesnt appear they did.

Any who puts Jewel and Sheryl Crow on same line up as Korn and Limp Biskit (sp?) - that was just insane.

sashagabadon · 10/08/2022 11:58

Fat boy slim looked completely out of his depth 😬
not exactly a happy well behaved crowd on Brighton beach

sashagabadon · 10/08/2022 12:00

What happened with jewel. It was clear she was upset and closed her set early but glossed over what occurred. I am guessing general sexist shouting at her and throwing bottles?

Onandupw · 10/08/2022 12:03

The Bush lead singer was hilarious! You could tell he was like what the fuck! I have to go out in front of THAT with our soft rock!

I got the sense that in retrospect the Korn singer was aware of how awful it was and would have taken further steps if properly communicated. Fat Boy Slim is a really lovely man and no way he would have supported that kind of stuff.

the limp man though - awful - totally aware of the mood he was creating and encouraging it.

oh god and poor Jewel!!

at the end of the day though the producers were just totally and utterly negligent. The only one with a clue was that 21 year old guy that they all ignored.

awful stuff.

MrsKeats · 10/08/2022 12:05

The idea of giving candles out was insane-what did they think would happen?
The whole thing was utterly grim and the way the idiot promoters tried to put a spin on it made me furious.

Cadot · 10/08/2022 12:21

Qlorex · 09/08/2022 17:49

Again, playing devils advocate, they did also talk about what sounded more like voluntary group sex in the rave hangar (probably under the influence of E) and I remember seeing that at raves quite often in the early/mid 90s.

It was for sure a different decade - and because it was pre SM and pre camera phones I think a lot of it was kept in the dark to most people.

The way the women were pawed was disgusting though and remember this was all before the idea of consent was much of a thing so I am sure (and I saw) girls so under the influence having sex that they clearly couldn't have consented.

The way the promoter guy victim-blamed them in the here and now was terrible though and shows there's still a long way to go.

I think the person describing that was presenting it as if it were consensual, but the scene was a woman face first against a wall and a queue of men behind her waiting their turn. I really doubt that was a consensual act.

Onandupw · 10/08/2022 12:30

@Cadot i agree. Consent in that god awful context VERY dubious.

horrific

I’m. It sure I can articulate it properly - and whilst they did give notable time to the sexual assault issue - overall I very much was left feeling that it was very much presented as through the prism of the male experience.

ive said up thread that I’m the narrative was all about what people were doing - rather than men. And I can’t fault them for including female interviews etc. but I just got this overall sense that I’d told from a predominantly female experience/perspective would have been different.

there must have been thousands of women who were simply terrified especially on those last days - but I don’t think that was really communicated somehow. But I can’t put my finger on what was missing.

Binkybix · 10/08/2022 14:24

Yes, I feel the same as you @Onandupw

Sonnex · 10/08/2022 14:42

Cadot · 10/08/2022 12:21

I think the person describing that was presenting it as if it were consensual, but the scene was a woman face first against a wall and a queue of men behind her waiting their turn. I really doubt that was a consensual act.

He didn't specify the sex of the people lined up though and I've seen both in this situation at raves back in the day. But that doesn't take away from the fact that the people lined up against the wall were very likely under the influence of Ecstacy, alcohol and other drugs so the issue of consent and being fit to consent remains. Nonetheless, this was common at raves and gay clubs in the 90s (and possibly still is, I wouldn't know).

Hopefully the idea of consent has moved forward. I know my teens are taught about consent at secondary school now and being fit to consent and not taking it as implied consent if you're not sure or the person is drunk etc and I don't remember anyone asking me for consent in those days so hopefully things have improved. I think if nothing else, with the advent of camera phones and SM surely men are more hesitant in case it is recorded?

ThickCutSteakChips · 10/08/2022 14:58

I'm going to watch this as everyone is talking about it.

I don't remember it at the time at all though? Was it in the news etc?

PriamFarrl · 10/08/2022 15:13

DillonPanthersTexas · 08/08/2022 13:23

The “lads mag” culture and sense of entitlement was magnified 100 times at Woodstock.

I think the most insidious aspects of the lad mag culture in the 90s was the promotion of the 'laddette'.

"You go girl, you too can drink pints, go to the footie and swear loudly...........if you are really cool you can get your tits out for the lads as well"

This program made me think about that time and the ladette culture.

It strikes me that in the late 90s (when I was in my early 20s) women were being told that we could do anything, we were as good as men. But to be as good as men we had to be like men. Hence the whole drinking and getting your tits out culture. The men however hadn’t been told any of this, remember this was a time when many work places had training on how not to sexually harass women. So women were feeling all empowered etc but men were still feeling all entitled.

PriamFarrl · 10/08/2022 15:20

ThickCutSteakChips · 10/08/2022 14:58

I'm going to watch this as everyone is talking about it.

I don't remember it at the time at all though? Was it in the news etc?

I don’t remember it at the time but they do show a clip of BBC news covering it.

Sonnex · 10/08/2022 16:58

Totally agree with and remember this and was a similar age.

It's quite refreshing now I finally no longer feel the need to 'keep up with the blokes' in my workplace - where I am STILL the only woman since the ninetie! Across about 10 companies!

Anyway, different times. Lot of fun times but a lot wrong when you look back. Mind you at least women could act like men and men could wear skirts and eyeliner without feeling the need to try say they actually were the opposite sex.

newnamethanks · 10/08/2022 17:30

Ah, the Ladettes. No matter how often I see Zoe Ball presenting a cosy family cooking programme or, her current incarnation, guiding us around beautiful gardens, I can't adjust to her new grown up persona. I know I'm being irrational but it just feels wrong.

NutellaEllaElla · 10/08/2022 18:21

I watched this today full of horror. From near the beginning I thought this was a dangerous place for women. And the pathetic men organisers blaming individuals. It was a lot of "individuals" wasn't it.

Whataboutno · 10/08/2022 23:10

Watching now! Been to a lot of festivals and never felt unsafe, it's shocking!

Is Frat culture still a thing in the US? I read something recently about the actor John Hamm being involved in some incident in his college years.

CuteOrangeElephant · 11/08/2022 14:00

Just watched all 3 episodes. Shocking.

Can I just say though, Gavin Rossdale back in those days. What a god 😍.

ThisIsAddiction · 11/08/2022 14:36

I raised an eyebrow at the guy complaining Korn riled the crowd from the start when Jonathan Davies came out and shouted "Are you ready?"
It's literally the first line of the song they open with.

I remain amazed that Lang attempted a Woodstock in 2019. You'd have thought he'd have learned.

Bringon2023 · 11/08/2022 14:43

I was so engrossed I watched it all in one night. It's my worst nightmare being crushed in a huge crowd, with no drinking water in a heatwave and no toilets! And that's before the violence/drugs/rape. People actually died as a result but the documentary didn't really mention it?!

Onandupw · 11/08/2022 14:49

Oh I actually took outbid it that no one died! But you’re right - someone died from heat exhaustion!! And lord of others in hospital

they totally should have mentioned thst

Fritilleries · 12/08/2022 12:14

The only person I respected was the bespectacled and bearded chap who clearly understood the music/cultural factors at play with the line up. The management figures seem totally oblivious and Lang gave the impression of being completed stoned/unrepentant. The then 14 year old girl with a very clean t-shirt really irritated me.

Fritilleries · 12/08/2022 12:18

Jeeeeez, just watched Scher talk his way out of responding to the rape allegations. Utterly vile.

Snooks1971 · 12/08/2022 20:34

CuteOrangeElephant · 11/08/2022 14:00

Just watched all 3 episodes. Shocking.

Can I just say though, Gavin Rossdale back in those days. What a god 😍.

Yes to both your points!

DFOD · 13/08/2022 08:34

I was surprised by the 99% white (middle class?) male attendance. It was the US in the 90’s and the culture there for that cohort and music doesn’t translate or really mirror the music or youth culture scene in the UK at the time as don’t think we have a frat boy thing - unless it’s university rugby clubs or other dubious societies - Bullingdon - but they are not so pervasive or large in numbers to have such an impact.

The only thing I could vaguely see is maybe a boozed fuelled England football team international away game which is / was 3 alcohol fuelled days of all white males.

There was the “show us your tits” chants and signs from early doors so that misogyny was acceptable and normal from the off.

Like others have said the line-up was an acceleration but it comes down to treating people like pigs and you can expect many to behave like pigs…when fuelled with alcohol.

It’s also a quite disturbing that they can get the contributors to be all positive and reminiscent when talking about the lead up and early days just to
ramp up the viewers excitement and then seemingly appear with regret / in tears (maybe that was just one woman) taking about the end.

I totally agree about the male lens of sexual violence - I also questioned Fat Boy Slim when he made the throw away comment about people lining up to have sex against the wall - it was as if he thought this ness great and a sign of a great night out? Maybe he had seen that many times before as PP say it was a thing at raves in the 90s.

The conditions they were exposed to - all of the attendees, the victims and the aggressors (explains it doesn’t excuse it) were shocking.

Did it explain if they ever made any profit? What happened with the clear up? Who’s property / vehicles were destroyed.

The sexual violence is always just under the surface.

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