Page 11 | THE THIEF, HIS WIFE AND THE CANOE - ITV 9pm - EASTER SUNDAY TO WEDNESDAY. TV PACE. NO SPOILERS

Blondeshavemorefun · 2022-04-15T16:39:58+00:00

Real life story John a former teacher and prison officer fakes his own death in 2002 via a canoe - with the help of Ann his wife to claim Life insurance and avoid bankruptcy It is based on an unpublished manuscript by reporter David , he was the first one to find and interview ann after a boot of the couple was seen 5yrs later in 2007 Ann knew but not the sons who believes their dad was dead

BedknobsNoBroomsticks · 21/04/2022 22:06

Thunderpunt · 21/04/2022 19:16

And my takeaway from this was, that police officer was bloody Karl Pilkington from Ricky Gervais series years ago.... I did have to Google to be sure. Who knew he'd turned his hand to acting (instead of just moaning incessantly)

I knew I recognised him but couldn't figure out who he was. I skip the credits so didn't see his name.

GrandTheftWalrus · 21/04/2022 22:39

I'm just watching the documentary now.

Fizbosshoes · 21/04/2022 23:21

I watched the itv documentary this eve.
I felt like John Darwin was trying to illicit sympathy, listing everything he had lost - well duh. Yeah. Of his own making.
It was quite a weird interview him sitting at a dinner table with the interviewer almost as if they were on a date

GrandTheftWalrus · 21/04/2022 23:49

He seemed to not care and was most annoyed when he got caught. If he hadn't came home he'd have probably got away with it

GrasssInPocket · 22/04/2022 00:45

One thing that puzzles me - how did he get his fake passport application countersigned? It has to be done by someone "of standing" who had to have known "John Jones" for a number of years. The countersignatory has to provide their own passport number, which is cross-checked by the passport office. I'm sure there's something of a trade in fake passports, but it looks as though he was trying to do it all himself by researchng and creating the new identity, etc. Getting a passport isn't just a matter of the birth certificate!

GrandTheftWalrus · 22/04/2022 01:47

GrasssInPocket · 22/04/2022 00:45

One thing that puzzles me - how did he get his fake passport application countersigned? It has to be done by someone "of standing" who had to have known "John Jones" for a number of years. The countersignatory has to provide their own passport number, which is cross-checked by the passport office. I'm sure there's something of a trade in fake passports, but it looks as though he was trying to do it all himself by researchng and creating the new identity, etc. Getting a passport isn't just a matter of the birth certificate!

I was wondering about that as well but I think in 2002 it was different to get a passport. I remember I went abroad in 1998/1999 on my dad's passport. Then when we went to Cyprus in 2000 I got my own as my friend had hers.

Fizbosshoes · 22/04/2022 07:08

GrasssInPocket · 22/04/2022 00:45

One thing that puzzles me - how did he get his fake passport application countersigned? It has to be done by someone "of standing" who had to have known "John Jones" for a number of years. The countersignatory has to provide their own passport number, which is cross-checked by the passport office. I'm sure there's something of a trade in fake passports, but it looks as though he was trying to do it all himself by researchng and creating the new identity, etc. Getting a passport isn't just a matter of the birth certificate!

Oh wow I hadn't thought of that! I think it was a thing in 2002, I'm pretty sure a friend asked DH to sign a passport around that time.
I was going to say maybe he got Anne to countersign it, (as she wouldn't be related to "John jones" ) but he used the same address....

CaptainMyCaptain · 22/04/2022 07:30

As a teacher I've signed many passports and never had the Passport Office contact me but some colleagues had phone calls to check on them. He would have known this and just took the chance. As PP said Anne Darwin wouldn't have been related to 'John Jones' so might not have ring any bells. The passport application for adults was the same then regarding counter signatories (apart from doing it online obviously) but under 16s used to be included on a parent's passport, I think it changed around that time. Before that (until the 80s maybe?) a married woman could be included on her husband's. passport.

CaptainMyCaptain · 22/04/2022 07:32

Meant to add - no 4 next door was bedsits so she could have signed a passport for a tenant. It wouldn't have been suspicious.

Original poster

Blondeshavemorefun · 22/04/2022 07:45

Thunderpunt · 21/04/2022 19:16

And my takeaway from this was, that police officer was bloody Karl Pilkington from Ricky Gervais series years ago.... I did have to Google to be sure. Who knew he'd turned his hand to acting (instead of just moaning incessantly)

He was in Derek

I worked last night so Havnt Seen itv documentary yet

OP posts:

IbizaToTheNorfolkBroads · 22/04/2022 08:05

I agree, the passport app could have been countersigned by Anne. Not officially related, and they had loads of houses/addresses. She was. Doctor’s receptionist, that could well be a suitable occupation.

IbizaToTheNorfolkBroads · 22/04/2022 08:11

Also, re:passport, British passports weren’t digitised until a few years later. The effort to x ref the referee’s name/passport number/employer/PP office to contact them would have been pretty laborious. I’ve been a countersignatory since the mid 1990s. I used to get contacted about maybe 10% of applications; now it’s nearer 1/3. I don’t think it’s because I’ve got dodgier - I think it’s because electronic databases and mobile phones make it so much easier. He could have just lucked out, but I think he must have used Anne. No different to me countersigning my next door neighbour’s passport, as I did a couple of years ago.

the80sweregreat · 22/04/2022 09:17

It was strange that he was happy to obtain a birth certificate and passport by deceit but when they wanted the documents signed in Panama etc he immediately decided it was better to just pretend he had amnesia rather than look at how he could get around this problem. I think that deep down he was fed up with pretending all the time and thought everyone would just forgive them.
It was the photo with the estate agent that did for them really. After getting away with all this for so long they were becoming a bit complacent.
If that hadn't happened they might have been alright. The lies they both told were incredible though , she was as bad changing her story all the time and trying to worm her way out of things.
On a different note, scanning my own passport at Gatwick coming home from abroad I was shocked that it took a photo of me.
The tech these days is much more reliable I think.

MuchuseasaChocolateTeapot · 22/04/2022 09:44

I remember being surprised it was for a relatively small amount? £250,000? Not much money for the lengths they went to and the damage it did to their sons. I’m amazed their kids have any contact with them at all

the80sweregreat · 22/04/2022 09:48

They had debts of £ 700,000 originally ( I read this in the guardian ) 250 k was their way out of the mire ( according to him anyway )
I would put money on them both still being richer than me at the moment though !

IbizaToTheNorfolkBroads · 22/04/2022 09:53

the80sweregreat · 22/04/2022 09:17

It was strange that he was happy to obtain a birth certificate and passport by deceit but when they wanted the documents signed in Panama etc he immediately decided it was better to just pretend he had amnesia rather than look at how he could get around this problem. I think that deep down he was fed up with pretending all the time and thought everyone would just forgive them.
It was the photo with the estate agent that did for them really. After getting away with all this for so long they were becoming a bit complacent.
If that hadn't happened they might have been alright. The lies they both told were incredible though , she was as bad changing her story all the time and trying to worm her way out of things.
On a different note, scanning my own passport at Gatwick coming home from abroad I was shocked that it took a photo of me.
The tech these days is much more reliable I think.

All the deceit up to that point had only involved him and his wife in person, and she appears to have been easily coerced*. The need to be ID’ed in person by the British police would have introduced a far more stringent authority which he couldn’t influence.

Fulmine · 22/04/2022 10:49

Player456 · 19/04/2022 23:11

@Blondeshavemorefun according to his wife - Mercy, he is heading to Ukraine to fight the Russians, and does indeed have good life insurance

I'm sure that's what he's told his wife. The chances of it actually being true, however, are zero. I hope for her sake he's made a will in her favour.

Fulmine · 22/04/2022 10:57

She seems a simple wee soul and I was cheering when she eventually got enough confidence to leave him.

Not sure that she was that simple. She managed to lie very convincingly to an awful lot of people, including her own sons and the police, for a very long time.

Fulmine · 22/04/2022 10:58

GrasssInPocket · 17/04/2022 23:00

Why did the police search the house after finding the canoe? Looking in the toilets and everything - it's as though they suspected something was going on!

Maybe they were looking for weapons or poison in case his wife had done him in?

the80sweregreat · 22/04/2022 11:44

I'm sure that the authorities in Panama might have been able to be paid off somehow? No idea though.
They were quick enough to take their money for the new apartment , then said ' oh , you need this and this now !' Which was obviously a shock to them both
Plus the internet wasn't as accessible as it is now , so they couldn't do their homework about living abroad and what they need as you would now. When I lived in an European country for a while in the early 00s ( with work ) we had to go to have our fingerprints taken after we had lived there for a few months plus other bits and pieces etc, I had no idea about this and it was nerve racking tbh ( I've nothing to hide either ! ) it makes me wonder how the old criminals who moved abroad for the sun were able to get round all these checks ? They all liked to buy properties as well etc. Probably with 'dodgy ' money ( maybe ?) no idea, but I'm sure he could have done something?
( sounds like I'm on his side , I'm not :(
Just musings !

MichaelAndEagle · 22/04/2022 20:44

I also thought he was just fed up of it by the end.
The problem seemed to be he couldn't get residency in Panama. Couldn't the business etc just be registered with Ann and he be a regular visitor? Going away for 2 months a year elsewhere or something?
I was in two minds about Ann. She was definitely controlled by him, and very weak after years of it. But I think she was actually happy in Panama and if it had gone OK she'd have been able to live with it and never owned up.
Her sons were grown up, when they came to her house the first time she could have said 'he's made me do this terrible thing, he's not dead, it's all a lie'. They seemed decent men, they'd have looked after her.

WhiteFire · 22/04/2022 21:22

toomuchlaundry · 18/04/2022 21:27

Can’t believe his poor Dad was alive

Was his Dad mentioned?

I can't decide if I want to watch it or not. I clearly remember the day he 'turned up', I knew he had previously gone missing, so it was amazing news at first, and then obviously it just developed from there.

the80sweregreat · 22/04/2022 21:32

I doubt his dad is alive now, but back when he showed up with ' amnesia' his dad was still alive and in his 90s

WhiteFire · 22/04/2022 23:35

His Dad has since passed away, iirc from newspaper reports it wasn't that long after.

BedknobsNoBroomsticks · 23/04/2022 06:24

This is a bit of a far out theory. I wonder if John knew that Anne was happy in Panama and that he was scared that she may leave him so he went back to the UK as a way of controlling her. He exposed them and made her vulnerable and then gave her a whole story to learn, making her relient on him.

He came across as someone who thought he could worm his way out of anything. He probably didn't think that they would get found out and thought that he could move back to the UK, continue living his live and using the threat of exposure to keep Anne in check.