Louise Woodward The Killer Nanny. did she do it?

[HeckinMiffed]

This was such a huge case when I was younger. Anyone else watching?
I always thought she didnt deliberately kill the baby.

@roosk I think it was quite clear the point of my post was not to compare Gary Allen to Louise Woodward, (I did say unrelated documentary.) but to share a valued an insightful point I heard a psychologist make about criminals.

@HeyGirlHeyBoy

He was 8m old (wasn't he?) so the idea of him having a fall doesn't stack up.

Only a fall from where he may have been placed, off the bed, or sofa presumably. Or been dropped. Not falling from walking.

@Sparklingbrook

I din't think the laughing was actually laughing. We discussed this upthread though.

That maybe so, but I'm still entitled to my own opinion about it

Im like a dog with a bone over this point, but I just cannot fathom how the Dr parents didnt notice the injuries that were old. Even if it was LW who caused them, how did they not?

That maybe so, but I'm still entitled to my own opinion about it

Yes, as am I and everyone else on this thread, it's fine.

@StellaGibson118

Im like a dog with a bone over this point, but I just cannot fathom how the Dr parents didnt notice the injuries that were old. Even if it was LW who caused them, how did they not?

Something else that was never explained. Was the whole case televised or was there loads of questions we are unaware of?

@HeyGirlHeyBoy

Do we know it wasn't just the 3 x8h days the mum worked? That's not excessive surely, though hard work at the same time. She said that when they were home they were adoring parents. I'm very sure she'd have said it if there was any question they were short tempered, rough etc.

I wondered about the 3 days, they always talked like it was more than that, the way they talked about the parents being home early to put the children to bed on alternate nights seemed odd because presumably the mother would have been there for 4 days anyway. It didn't seem that clear.

I don't think a doctors shift is necessarily 8 hrs but I'm going on doctors I know in UK so it might be different, even so if you work an 8 hr day you will need someone to be with them for more than 8 hrs so I suppose that will depend on the commute.

@StellaGibson118

Im like a dog with a bone over this point, but I just cannot fathom how the Dr parents didnt notice the injuries that were old. Even if it was LW who caused them, how did they not?

When my 3 year old broke his arm I didn't notice until I tried to hold his hand and he said he couldn't lift his arm up. It was only a couple of hours but I felt awful, as I was explaining at the hospital the doctor told me not to worry and that one of his colleagues hadn't noticed his child had a broken leg for 3 days.

I suppose some injuries are more obvious than others.

@HeyGirlHeyBoy

He was 8m old (wasn't he?) so the idea of him having a fall doesn't stack up.

One of my kids was walking at 8 months, unusual but it does happen. They could also have a fall when crawling, say if they are upstairs and crawl to the top of the stairs and fall. Some kids are adventurous.

@Neurodiversitydoctor

That is the reality of being an au pair. It is thankless, lonely and v poorly paid work. The sort of people who employ au pairs fancy themselves as somehow deserving of slave labour yet cannot actually afford appropriate employees, they are the worst kind of people to work for

I was cared for by au pairs as a school aged child. I hope they were happy, we were invited as a family to 2 of their weddings. I exchanged with one of thier cousins (we had 3 sisters in series from the same family). We met their parents and stayed with them in the summer, my parents recently went to a funeral for my au pair's mother.

My other (Swedish) au pair taught me to ice skate and took he to the zoo (her boyfriend was a zoo keeper !).

I loved my job/family as an au pair! We are still in touch nearly 30 years later, I've visited them several times and consider them good friends. But they didn't exploit me, they required of me only what was in my contract, they were kind and friendly and treated me as a member of their family for the six months I was with them. That's how an au pair experience SHOULD be.

[quote GruffaloSolja]@roosk I think it was quite clear the point of my post was not to compare Gary Allen to Louise Woodward, (I did say unrelated documentary.) but to share a valued an insightful point I heard a psychologist make about criminals.[/quote]
But in so doing, you suggested that an insight from a psychologist about 'clever criminals' admitting to minimal involvement in a crime but not taking responsibility for it was relevant to Louise Woodward.

Very true wrt falling down a stairs. Again, surely that would /should have been said, on either side. Perhaps LW didn't say, thinking all OK immediately afterwards? We can't know. DE worked minutes away so no commute and as an ophthalmologist perhaps more definite hours. As others have said, the lack of detail is v apparent!

The description of 3 x 8h days was definitely given, that's not my take. I'm jist wondering if that was it for childcare.

@HeyGirlHeyBoy

He was 8m old (wasn't he?) so the idea of him having a fall doesn't stack up.

Yes but some 8 month olds are very mobile ,before he could crawl or walk my oldest used to roll across the floor from one side of the room to another!

Yes, I guess that would have come out unless he fell when lw was in the loo but I'd assume the older one would have seen

Where was the older child when all this was allegedly happening?

Good question. Unless at pre school?

@Sparklingbrook

Where was the older child when all this was allegedly happening?

I don't they ever said ,and LW said he was quite intelligent and you could hold a conversation with him .

Yes, yet another missing piece of this jigsaw. I wonder if the jury were allowed to ask that sort of thing?

When my two were babies and toddlers we lived in a ground floor flat so I never had too worry about stairs ,plus I was only ever meters away from them even if I had to go into another room.

You'd think he'd have been a witness

If the older child was in the house at the time, you would think he would have been with LW and Matthew, not on his own somewhere. But he may have been napping or something. I imagine he wouldn't be at daycare if they employed an au pair, that wouldn't make sense.

@9ofpentangles

Yes, I guess that would have come out unless he fell when lw was in the loo but I'd assume the older one would have seen

IIRC The Eeapens asked LW to do the kids laundry in the evening after she finished work as the washing machine and tumble drier were in the basement. LW didn’t want to (not unreasonable) so was quickly going down into the basement to do the washing.

As the previous au pair left as she felt that the situation wasn’t safe, it’s possible that the older child hit the baby with something when LW was in the basement?

Oh, I didn't know that. Was that in the documentary (if so missed that bit) or did you read it somewhere?

The older child apparently told his larents LW hurt Matty... But yes surely correct and sensitive questioning of him at the time would have been appropriate. He is a doctor himself now I think.