Louise Woodward The Killer Nanny. did she do it?

[HeckinMiffed]

This was such a huge case when I was younger. Anyone else watching?
I always thought she didnt deliberately kill the baby.

But presumably American teens? Not teens from the UK. You have to wonder how much research was done by the Eappens before hiring LW, or a British nanny full stop. Why did they not hire an American teen if they are more experienced generally.

@Sparklingbrook
In the years before British tv became popular in America, before streaming services, before the internet, people on both sides of the Atlantic knew almost nothing about each other. People had very few points of reference and most didn't know what they didn't know. There were lots of assumptions on both sides.

They presumably made the mistake of thinking a British teen would have had the many years of babysitting under her belt that an American teen would at that age, and would have assumed from her application for the job that she had an interest in babies and young children and enjoyed looking after them. They would assume that if she didn't have an interest or found it boring or stressful, she would get work in a different area, which is what American teens would do. By 19, American teens who preferred not to work with children would have been working in offices or shops.

Also, the preference for an English speaking nanny might have played a part in their decision. Someone speaking standard English fluently may have been preferable to someone who didn't speak standard English as a first language, and it might have been hard to find someone perceived to have the youth/energy and interest plus fluency in English to provide the sort of childcare they needed for the hours they were looking at. Yes, there may have been older and more experienced nannies available, but maybe they would have families and homes of their own, maybe not willing to live in, and maybe not speaking English at the level they wished their children to be exposed to.

@mathanxiety
That’s really interesting. Same language. Culturally so different.

It is interesting you called LW a nanny. She really wasn’t. She was an au pair. Au pairs in the U.K., in Europe as well and I imagine further afield are expected to look after children for short periods of time eg feed the children breakfast, send them off to school, give them a light evening meal, perhaps some light household duties. They are supposed to work a maximum of 30 hours and to be treated somewhat as a member of the family and elder sibling. Definitely not de facto childcare for long hours. That word be a nanny.

I note that there is an anomaly of a maximum of 45 hours for au pairs in the U.S., which I find shocking considering the money paid. I have no idea if this was the same or advertised as such back then. It is extremely likely a British 19 yo with little experience of life or caring for very young children will have understood au pair to be the same as me (I’m older than LW). In any case, I would not have understood the true implications of parental expectations nor would I have been able to look after these kids.

It seems there was a lot of cultural misunderstanding back then. Hopefully this is no longer the case.

@x2boys
It definitely wasn’t common in my circles to baby sit.

@MrsMariaReynolds, my DDs all did summer babysitting (start of June to late August) for school age children and usually 2-4 nights a week throughout the school year, more around Christmas, for multiple families, from about age 13-14. My older DCs had the advantage of being the oldest in larger families, therefore perceived as being used to babies and toddlers and probably sensible. They used to joke with their friends in similar positions that they had our area carved up. Older siblings passed families down to younger ones. Families liked to use babysitters from the same family because they felt they had some idea who they were, whether they would return calls promptly, show up on time, etc. We inherited some families and all their contacts and friends when the two oldest girls in another family moved away from the area.

Would there not have been child care facilities at the hospital they worked at? ,the certainly was at UK hospital,s I worked at when I was a nurse ,although granted it was expensive ,I get they would have been working crazy hours ,the junior Doctors in the UK I worked with in the 90,s worked even crazier hours than then they do now ,,we had to try and rotate our shifts around each other when my boys were babies .

I don't get the English language thing. American teens speak English what would be the advantage of having a UK teen for that? Would they hope that the children would start speaking with a Liverpudlian accent? I could understand it more if the family were not fluent English speaking.

Yes, it does sound like assumptions were made when employing LW sadly. It wasn't working out prior to the death of Matthew either, the parents had had to have words about late nights etc and the time on the phone etc.

Au pairs have set terms of employment and specific visas in the US, including work hours, rate of pay (and room and board are provided so that factors into the pay equation). Au pairing is generally seen as a cultural exchange programme, with agencies providing cultural immersion experiences, language class enrollment in local colleges. I know people who hired a series of au pairs when their girls were young so that they could speak the dad's first language daily. The au pairs all stayed for one year.

Louise didn't seem to have any of that - no agency, no cultural immersion - so I would call her a nanny.

@MrsMariaReynolds

In this case, I think the Eappens would have done well to put off having children until they were more financially secure. Instead they overstretched themselves with a large family home, worked ridiculously long hours and exploited a teenager, who they’d employed to be an au pair.

I don't get the English language thing. American teens speak English what would be the advantage of having a UK teen for that?

@Sparklingbrook
To put it bluntly, American middle class parents wouldn't have wanted their children speaking ghetto English.

American teens speaking good English wouldn't have been available for full time live in work (nobody cares about a Scouse accent in the US; it would be considered excellent English).

American teens speaking good English would be in university or working elsewhere with health insurance and other benefits.

If available, they would have been unemployable.

To put it bluntly, American middle class parents wouldn't have wanted their children speaking ghetto English

Louise had a very clear Liverpudlian accent so i guess that was deemed ok?

@mathanxiety

Au pairs have set terms of employment and specific visas in the US, including work hours, rate of pay (and room and board are provided so that factors into the pay equation). Au pairing is generally seen as a cultural exchange programme, with agencies providing cultural immersion experiences, language class enrollment in local colleges. I know people who hired a series of au pairs when their girls were young so that they could speak the dad's first language daily. The au pairs all stayed for one year.

Louise didn't seem to have any of that - no agency, no cultural immersion - so I would call her a nanny.

Louise was hired by an au pair agency ,they paid for her legal feels intially .

The company that LW went out to Boston with was Education First, they are still running and on their website describe them as 'Au pairs'. Saying 'experience America as an Au Pair'.

@mathanxiety
LW was employed through the EF au pair agency. Just checked. Definitely not a nanny.

www.ef.co.uk/

@mathanxiety

Yes, the Eappens were doctors and people assume they should have been able to afford better qualified childcare---but the Boston area is insanely expensive and depending on how many years out Med school they were, they would have been shouldering a tremendous amount of student debt.

YY to this. They would also have been working all sorts of crazy hours, including being on call on a rotating basis.

The mother was supposed to be a part time opthalmologist. Would her hours have been that crazy?

The Eappens appear to have had two more children following Matthew's death. I wonder how they juggled everything with 3 children.

I watched the documentary that was on ITV months back. The baby’s mother seemed really weird.

On the Eappen Foundation home page Deborah Eappen refers to LW as 'our childcare provider' rather than nanny/au pair which is interesting.

1984 was my first babysitting job at 14, a neighbour's kids,there were 4 under 9. That was a baptism of fire I can tell you. I them went on to babysit for lots of other families as did my friends, very common back then as were holiday jobs. Now it seems teens are very lucky if they get a holiday job under 16.

The Eappons used an British au pair as it was a cheap option. Appalling.

Yes, the Eappens were doctors and people assume they should have been able to afford better qualified childcare---but the Boston area is insanely expensive and depending on how many years out Med school they were, they would have been shouldering a tremendous amount of student debt.

@MrsMariaReynolds. That may well have been the case and it drives me mad that children are supposed to be the most precious beings in our lives and we often don’t factor in or want to spend on good childcare. These parents had excellent earning potential and had spent a lot on their education so why not on childcare for the most precious and vulnerable people in their lives?

@Sparklingbrook

To put it bluntly, American middle class parents wouldn't have wanted their children speaking ghetto English

Louise had a very clear Liverpudlian accent so i guess that was deemed ok?

Americans don't often differentiate different English accents in the way we do, and also usually miss the class inflections as well. They seem to find most English accents charming. And a lot of people there love English accents - when I was studying there 30 years ago I supplemented my uni job with babysitting and earned top money for it because of the way I spoke.

For those people talking about young girls looking after kids and how unsuitable that is - what about all the au pairs in London? Or is that not a thing any more? London was full of them in the 90s.

I find it bit strange how people say she was young, too young to look after a child etc yet she was an adult by law and could have been a parent herself. I had assumed she was about 14 before I read the case.

@Wheresmywoolyjumpers. I know people who’ve had au pairs, but not working long hours with very young children. Either the children were older (3 upwards) or one parent was around a fair amount. Definitely not alone with a baby and toddler for hours.

Aupairs are only supposed to work about 4 hours a day. Hence the low rate of pay. They're really aimed at doing the school drop-off and collection and looking after the children till mum and dad come home, plus a bit of baby sitting. And not looking after very young children.

@Storminamu

Aupairs are only supposed to work about 4 hours a day. Hence the low rate of pay. They're really aimed at doing the school drop-off and collection and looking after the children till mum and dad come home, plus a bit of baby sitting. And not looking after very young children.

Yeah I went to visit my friend in Boston who was an aupair a week after LW got out of prison ,her charges were 7and 10,and she mainly did school drop offs and pickups,driving them to activities ,keeping them entertained untill their parents got home ,sometimes making snacks etc .

@StellaGibson118

I find it bit strange how people say she was young, too young to look after a child etc yet she was an adult by law and could have been a parent herself. I had assumed she was about 14 before I read the case.

As a parent myself ,I don't think I would want a very young ,girl ,who couldn't get up in the morning,and spent hours on the phone whilst she was supposed to be watching my very young children ,looking after my baby and toddler for very long hours ,i imagine a lot of au pairs do it for the experience of living abroad ,if LW had any great love of child care ,she could have done a NNEB or NVQ in childcare and got a job in a local nursery.