The Baby Has Landed

[Sotiredsomuch]

Anyone watching?

I love stuff like this.

Plenty of babies come out of their birth mother and don't have anywhere near the love and care that those two dad's will give them though.

Basic human nature means that a newborn should be with their mother and she should be with her baby.

Basic human nature means that a newborn should have breast milk. And get it until they’re around 4 years old. But many (most?) don’t get that. Do you feel sad for babies that are bottle fed?

Yes the most natural and optimal scenario is baby staying with mum but that doesn’t mean those that don’t are sentenced to a life of being unable to bond or form healthy relationships. They aren’t being removed from her and left in cots to cry, they’re being cuddled skin to skin by the two people who will be their parents. The only parents they will know and who will clearly love and care for them just like any other couple. It’s no different than a baby being born and handed to dad instead of mum while she passes the placenta. These babies are lucky girls with two loving parents. There’s nothing to be sad about here. Plenty of babies never get what these two will have.

I didn’t say anything about breastfeeding. If you can’t understand that a newborn baby and its mother should be together I’m not going to waste my time with you.

It’s hard to put my finger on it but it felt wrong seeing them parted so quickly from their mum after being born.

I agree completely @NoSauce

Poor wee babies, they seemed too passive.

Women have wombs and breasts for reason.

I didn't breastfeed.....just didn't work out but little baby snuggled into me.

I certainly didn't try to change a 2 week old baby in a cot and use foul language.

I must admit I cried seeing them walk out of the hospital with the two babies leaving the surrogate behind, I know I could never do it.

I’d have thought they’d want to know who’s fathered which child for the birth certificates or does the birth certificate work differently when there’s a surrogate involved?

I really felt for the father of five, he looked so miserable and it was clear he wanted to be anywhere but in his own house. I don’t know how they can afford it, I just had to buy dd (3yo) shoes from Clark’s today and thinking of that x 5 makes me wince, imagine the cost of 5 teenagers or 5 at uni in a row, I hope they’ve got some money behind them because they don’t really look as though they do.

I didn’t say anything about breastfeeding.

No, I did- to make a point. That has clearly gone right over your head.

If you can’t understand that a newborn baby and its mother should be together I’m not going to waste my time with you.

And like I said, that is the optimum scenario, of course. But that doesn’t meant anything other than that is sad. Or something to pity the babies for. If they were being left in an orphanage, to cry all day then of course it’s sad, but in this case they are being cared for by their parents. Those two dads are all they will ever know and have known since birth. They went straight to their dads’ bare chests when they were born. I know it’s an emotive subject and I’m not actually comfortable with surrogacy myself but this particular aspect of their situation isn’t something I think warrants pity.

I wonder if the surrogates husband will have had to be named as father on the birth certificates and then the two dads have to adopt them.

wonder if the surrogates husband will have had to be named as father on the birth certificates and then the two dads have to adopt them huh, if the surrogate had had a biological child with another man through cheating her husband wouldn’t be the father. Her husband has zero claim.

that is the optimum scenario yes a baby with its birth mother is the optimum scenario, yes there are situations which are far from perfect, mums die, Mums leave etc. But these two
Men orchestrated this scenario for their own selfish wants and that’s what makes people sad for those twins. A man decided their wants trumped the babies needs.

Something vague in the back of my mind about the husband having to be named as father on birth certificate because he’s married to the mother. I’ve probably imagined that.

Basic human nature means that a newborn should have breast milk

Says who?

Do you feel sad for babies that are bottle fed?

No of course not, why would I? A bottle fed baby still has the opportunity to be and feel close to its mother, bond with her, recognise her smell and voice.

A baby will lean in to the breast. Fact, imprinted biology. Sometimes it works well, other times not so well.

hardly comparable to 2 men demanding fatherhood and somebody renting out her womb.

Says who?

Really? umm nature- that’s the food nature provides for human newborns. You’re talking about basic human nature.

Many women choose not to breastfeed or can’t. They still form a secure attachment with their baby. They still have the chance to bond with it. You’re being obtuse I believe.

I couldn't breast feed. After a traumatic emergency section, it just didn't work out. I think we formed a good attachment and though it can seem rather weird to an adolescent (!) there must be something profoundly important about knowing where you came from.......literally.

IWorkAtTheCheesecakeFactory I think this is the case for the US- I recall when Kim k was still married to kris humphries they reported he’d be the father of Kanyes baby

Many women choose not to breastfeed or can’t.

Exactly- but we don’t pity their babies for it! Because formula is a perfectly good substitute.

They still form a secure attachment with their baby. They still have the chance to bond with it.

Just like these two dads will with their babies. Mel isn’t their mother- she didn’t want to bond with them. The babies will have a secure attachment with their parents. Just because both those parents are Male doesn’t mean their bond is any less. Do you pity babies who are adopted at birth into a hetero parent family?

I think we formed a good attachment

Exactly!

there must be something profoundly important about knowing where you came from.......literally.

Agree with this. I think the dads are probably going to tell their daughters where they’re from (if not- going on TV was a big mistake!) and possibly keep involved with Mel as she works with one of them.

I think this is the case for the US- I recall when Kim k was still married to kris humphries they reported he’d be the father of Kanyes baby hmm

AHHH!! Maybe that’s where I’ve gotten that from. It is bonkers if true!

In England and Wales you can only be paid reasonable expenses for being a surrogate. So it's very cheap rent especially as she could have turned around and refused to give them the babies.

Anyway it explained on a previous episode why she offered to be a surrogate for them.

Also as they are twins who their strongest bond is to.

Mel sure as hell is their mother and it will come back to haunt her.

I think that there's a bit of homophobia about. I can't imagine a widower attracting the same vitriol.

Just like these two dads will with their babies. Mel isn’t their mother- she didn’t want to bond with them.

And do you think the babies know that?

The babies will have a secure attachment with their parents. Just because both those parents are Male doesn’t mean their bond is any less. Do you pity babies who are adopted at birth into a hetero parent family?

Do you think a baby removed at birth and later adopted is the same as this situation then? Really.

we are less used to adoption nowadays.
i am not sure if mothers who gave up their baby for adoption breastfed either?

i can't imagine a widower attracting the same vitriol that’s not a choice! My mum died when I was young, shit happens. I would have felt worse had my mother walked out and never seen me again.