The Nights Watch: GAME OF THRONES SEASON 8 EPISODE 4. May 6th UK. SPOILERS AFTER 2 am.

[OneInAMillionYou]

Hail survivors of The Battle of Winterfell.

The 'mysterious' episode 4 premieres tonight.

Who will be with us at 2am?

I am desperate to find out if Arya's kill is openly discussed and acknowledged, or does Bran take the credit, or does it remain a mystery.

Given Emilia Clarke has said Episode 5 is the one for which we will need 'bigger television screens' what will lead up to it?

Yes yara. It has to be a woman as all the women are getting punished now.

It doesn't really look like it's a prisoner tbh, the figure is walking away from the army towards the keep by the looks of it. It will be Jaime or Arya in disguise.

Having actually looked at I think you’re right.

I reckon it’s Jaime.

Benjens dead he died saving Bran or Jon from whites

Read this morning that the episode had to be cut so the scene with doggo had to be short and simple. So while I was hopeful he will appear again I really think that’s it. A rushed, crap ending for the wolf and for Tormund.

Everywhere I read now is annoyed at the crap writing and rushed ending, that I really fear that the twist and clever ending we’re all after is not going to happen.

The scene with Cersei having all her enemies in one place could have been another red wedding moment, an episode where I sat open mouthed in shock. She also wiped out everyone in the sept, so she is ruthless enough to kill everyone but she didn’t. Why not? Is that just another example of crap writing?

Why not? Is that just another example of crap writing?
I expected that to happen too, I would have if I was her. The only reason I can think of is that she was scared of Drogon getting to her before the scorpions could take him out. To do something like that she would have to be away in the Red Keep so she couldn't be harmed.
Or it's just purely because they all had to survive/bad writing.

Although that was the best possible chance she had at killing Drogon. He was on the ground chilling and we all know a dragon with no rider will always get killed.

In the books Tyrion strangles Shay because she has shagged his Dad, making him realise she doesn't care about him and will sleep with anyone (er, hello, she is a prostitute, it is her job). He's pissed because he had deluded himself that she actually loved him. His vanity was hurt, that's all.

I predict Jon will kill Mad Dany and his punishment will be to 'take the Black' which is all he's ever really wanted. Tyrion & Sansa on the Iron Throne. Arya heads off to Essos to have adventures. Jaime murders Cersei but also dies in the process. Brienne made Warden of the North.

Dany’s arc is tragic in that she had a real chance to make a difference in Essos and rebuild that continent to be a better place, but she totally abandoned it to seize a throne in a foreign country she knows nothing about and who don’t really need her or want her at all. This must be what GRRM is going to hammer home in the books as well.

Benjen is long gone. He was actually killed before the first book started and turned into the pseudo- wight 'Cold Hands' who helps Bran and Sam get through the wall. It's never explained why he's dead but still cognent and 'good'? He then 'dies' a 2nd time helping Jon escape other wights. It's all a bit confusing and vague.

I predict the ending will be quite straightforward with no epic plot twist, sadly.

This must be what GRRM is going to hammer home in the books as well.

Yes, exactly. Dany’s story is somewhat autobiographical, and GRRM has said this on numerous occasions.

His family ran a successful business and were wealthy but lost it all in the depression. He grew up in the projects of New York in a penniless family. Every day he would walk past the house with the red door that used to belong to his family and feel somewhat bitter and resentful about losing what was ‘his’ (hence the house with the red door in Braavos for book readers).

He wrote the character to be someone who grows up feeling bitter and unhappy that their birthright has been taken from them, but it is not in his nature as a writer to have that character successfully take it back. Dany ending up on the throne has always, to me, felt like it wasn’t where he was trying to go with her.

Is taking the black still a thing now the wall has a massive hole in it and the NK is dead?

I agree it would have been risky for Cersei to open fire with drogon there

I didn't know that about GRRM - interesting, thanks @SweetSummerchild

Buy what claim could either Tyrion or Sansa have to the Iron Throne?

He's not even Cerceis heir. Jaime is.

buy what claim could either Tyrion or Sansa have to the Iron Throne?

They have none. But neither did half the others originally, they got it by conquest.

I don't think Dany is "mad", but rather rash and foolish which is not the same. I think she'll die but I really hope Jon doesn't kill her.

He's not even Cerceis heir. Jaime is.

But if Jamie dies (and let's face it, if he kills Cersei then he'll also kill himself) then Tyrion becomes her heir.

I don't think anyone's official claim will stand for much at the end. The Targaryen's had no claim to rule over the 7 kingdoms, they just could because they had dragons.

Honestly I'm not ready to accept Jamie's a goner.

Not out of any great love for him (though his character arc has been extraordinary to watch) but because I'd be so scared of Brienne never loving again! Nooooo! I couldn't take it!

millythepink thanks, I can see
why they changed it for the show. I still like book Tyrion but his behaviour with women is, as the kids say, problematic. Understandable in a way, but problematic.

Very interesting about GRRM and the inspiration for Dany.

Totally agree ElspethFlashman I just want brienne to be happy or heroically dead

Oh God, me too @elspethflashman. I am keeping everything crossed that somehow Jaime survives and there's a final shot of him riding into Winterfell and Brienne breaking out into the biggest grin but that is so not gonna happen

Great thread everyone!
I thought episode 4 was very patchy. The Bronn scene was weird, it felt as if they just shoehorned it in because they remembered that nothing had happened with that storyline! If he wanted to kill Jaime and Tyrion he could have done it there and then. I actually don't think he'll kill either of them.
I really like Sansa! Totally get her suspicion of Dany and her animosity towards her. That scene in episode 2 where she asked Dany "what about the North?" and didn't get an answer showed why Sansa dislikes her. Sansa knows that Jon is blinded by his feelings for Dany and is going to make poor decisions as a result
Wtf was going on with the battle plans?? Take exhausted and depleted troops straight off the King's Landing with no strategy and then have Dany fly about with her dragons over the water filled with Iron fleet and Golden Company ships, both renowned and respected navies!! Absolute madness and very stupid. I think it shows that Dany is losing the plot.
I think Jaime is going to kill Cersei not save her.
I still see Tyrion and Sansa getting together and Gendry is going to be significant in the end. He has an even better claim now that he's a lord doesn't he? I think that was a daft thing for Dany to do.
Await next episode with interest....

Did anyone notice Vary's reaction to Dany's 'root and stem' speech? He twisted round to stare at her, looking shocked. He described his castration as 'root and stem' and there's the unexplained thing with Melisandre (I think it was Melisandre, anyway) talking about the voice he heard in the fire.

I think Varys is going to have a big part to play in however this pans out.

I rather liked the Jaime and Brienne scene. It was so straightforward and unromantic in some ways, which made it more heartfelt. Although when Jaime said he'd never slept with a knight, I did rather want her to point out that he'd never actually slept with anyone who wasn't his sister!

Re: the mad queen vs mad queen idea, I always thought we were heading for a battle of the 5 queens, since there was a battle of the 5 kings. I thought Sansa in the north, Yara in the Iron Islands, Danaerys, Cersei, and then either Olenna Tyrell as Queen of Thorns or whatserface in Dorne. We've still got 4 of them left, but not sure there's a viable 5th, unless someone else pops out of the woodwork.

Everywhere I read now is annoyed at the crap writing and rushed ending, that I really fear that the twist and clever ending we’re all after is not going to happen

The scene with Cersei having all her enemies in one place could have been another red wedding moment, an episode where I sat open mouthed in shock. She also wiped out everyone in the sept, so she is ruthless enough to kill everyone but she didn’t. Why not? Is that just another example of crap writing?

Absolutely

Whoever suggested Bronn took a hostage in Winterfell to give to Cersei and it could be Sansa - that would really give the Bronn scene purpose. It would pit Jon and Dany against each other as he would do anything to get Sansa back and Dany would probably let her die. If Cersei murders Sansa that would be a shock along Red Wedding lines - in that it would be unexpected and horrible. And it would bring poor Sansa full circle, after everything she has been through and how much she has grown, to be back in Cersei’s clutches in the capital whilst the North rebels and her brother leads an army south...

Everywhere I read now is annoyed at the crap writing

I’m surprised it’s taken this long. The writing has been crap since season 5 and dire since season 7.

The mission to capture a wight last season was an utter joke. The basis for it was a joke - it was all done to get the wall to fall and give the night king a dragon.

Remember the awful scene with Ed Sheeran?

Remember Bad Pussy?

@kungfupanda I did wonder about that turn of phrase when Varys was in the room! I wonder if we'll ever find out what the voice from the flames said to him? I suspect the writers have forgotten all about it by now.