The handmaids tale-thread 6

[SisterNotCisTerf]

Let’s get June out of there!

The second Offlgen was a prostitute too (I don't think we ever learn her real name). Early on she said how she no longer has to have sex behind a dumpster to buy drugs and food, and has a safe place to live with nice people. So that's just two of the handmaids (very few of whom we actually meet) who Fred and the other commanders would consider as being better off, and they'll use this as justification for their actions. The handmaids like June immediately consider themselves worse off because they've had their comfortable lives, husbands, careers and children taken away from them (whereas the prostitutes didn't have a comfortable life and would likely have the children taken away into care anyway - not the rich families they now go to in Gilead). So it takes something bad happening to make them realise it's not all it's cracked up to be. Then you have all the econowives types who don't have their children taken away and don't get raped, and although they have to live in fear of the guardians and the eyes, they live relatively peaceful lives with a place to live and no worries about where their next meal comes from. Depending on their previous situation and their normal views on women's rights (some will already be against working mothers, sex outside marriage, abortion etc), there would be a good split of those who hate the new regime and those who think it's better despite the horrific aspects we see. I'd really like to see an episode where they show a few different perspectives from these different women. I think if Gilead had been ruled by the wives rather then the husbands, with religion and male ego taken out of it, it probably could have succeeded. Women voluntarily being artificially insemonated to act as surrogates (as some do now) whilst being allowed to keep their previous children and husbands. Women allowed to read and write and have useful jobs. No poverty and very little crime. The "ideal" society almost. But then the men come in and ruin everything

Just checked and we learn Ofglen 2's name afterwards when the bombing is announced on TV in little America. She was Lillie Fuller. But the handmaids never know it.

Anybody wish they’d developed the relationship and household of Emily and her new commander? I was taken above by her killing Aunt Lydia and then being smuggled out.

Aback not above!

I do lumpy we've seen commanders having affairs with handmaids this breaking the 'rules'.

It would have been interesting to see that from another perspective.

One thing that always resonates with me is in series one when Fred said "better doesn't always mean better for everyone, it's always worse for some".

I think it would have been interesting to see more of those who are better off under Gilead, or at least believe they are. I know it's the handmaids tale, so we are seeing it from the handmaids perspective.

Yes definitely Lumpy76. I did feel like the AL stabbing was plot armour just used so Emily would be in the van to receive the baby. CL obviously designed the Gilead economy but isn't interested in the religious/fertility side of things and probably regrets ever getting involved, because the lunatics are now running the asylum he helped build. That doesn't make him a good man though, perhaps just a slightly less worse one. In the same way that Mayday are anti-Gilead but that doesn't make them pro-handmaid (the Martha's being both). Mayday only want to bring down Gilead not rescue oppressed women. I think CL will be a key player in S3 but it's frustrating we didn't learn more about him in S2.

Possible book spoiler

In the book wasn't Aunt Lydia stabbed between the shoulder blades by Moira when she escaped the Red Centre? I'm just thinking in terms of the stabbing not just being thought up by the writers of series 2, but having provenance in the novel.

I can't quite recall what Moira and June did to AL when they escaped the Red Centre during series one. Did they just gag her and tie her up?

I can't quite recall what Moira and June did to AL when they escaped the Red Centre during series one. Did they just gag her and tie her up?

It was a different Aunt, wasn't it? But yes, she was gagged & tied up.

Actually we don’t know AL is definitely dead do we?

No, we don't know that AL is dead.

Is it wrong of me to think "nooooooooo" when Emily stabbed Aunt Lydia as she is a brilliant character and want to see more of her?

Sorry if I’ve missed this but how do women get to be econowives as opposed to handmaidens or marthas?

Economies are married women. I'd be an econowife, as I am on first marriage and have living husband. Marthas are widowed or unmarried and infertile for some reason.actually, maybe they've had children. I thought infertile women were 'unwomen' and sent to the colonies.

I am not sure ofglen2 was the prostitute.. If she felt safer, or had better circumstances under gilead why become a suicide bomber?

She should have gone

Just googled it.. Your right ofglen2 was the hm who said 'I'm clean now, I've got a safe place to sleep at night and I have people who are nice to me. And I want to keep it that way'

Slightly odd they then made her suicide bomber?

I know they cut out her tongue.. After she spoke out about stoning janine
But still think its a jump to make her a suicide bomber

I didn't think it was ofglen 2. I thought the ex prostitute was there at the same time as Emily/ ofglen 1

It was after Emily became ofsteven... And Lillie became ofglen2

I wonder if we'll see a flashback to how Lillie (Ofglen 2) went through the process from loyal and grateful handmaiden to suicide bomber. The attempted stoning of Janine and the fact she had her tongue cut out would obviously be strong motivators, but HOW did it come about? Was CL involved? I hope they don't leave that unanswered.

The econowives and husbands are just the normal every day families from before. Gilead-approved married people with kids, so proven fertile. Or the newly married couples like Eden and Nick. Their children weren't taken, and the women weren't forced to be handmaids unless they did wrong. The handmaids were women who had been proven fertile and were either single or their marriage was not Gilead-approved. Unmarried and infertile women were either made Martha's or sent to the colonies. Most of which were not toxic watelands, but rather farmland for producing food. Still a life of hard labour but not life threatening. Criminals were killed outright or went straight to toxic cleanup duty. Prostitutes and gay women (and some others of unsuitable standing, lawyers and scientists etc) were given the choice between Jezabels and the colonies. Emily should have been one of these but due to the shortage of fertile females she was 'allowed' to be a handmaid instead. Then you have the commanders wives who are just wives from before. Some infertile, some not. Again, if they misbehave they are at risk of becoming handmaids or sent away. That's my understanding anyway.

Sorry that should have said married but infertile women were made Marthas. If they were appropriately married and fertile they would have been econowives. If they were fertile but unmarried they would be handmaids. If they were not respectable married women AND were infertile, then it's the colonies for older ones (like June's mother) or the attractive ones might have been given the choice of Jezabels.

With regards to the race of Marthas, the shows writer confirmed that they deliberately used different races as they didn't want viewers to he influenced by the 'white washing' that was alluded to in the book. They wanted it to be about women's rights rather than the racial aspects.

It wasn't just jezebels or the colonies.. There were multiple purgings... The Boston globe staff, homosexuals, doctors who'd undertaken abortions.. All killed.

I am sure as well that in epilogue in book, they mention that in middle period they had to tighten rules to keep a flow of handmaids. Something about women who had not attended the right church?

Yes, in the middle period I would have been a,handmaid, as I wasn't married in a church.

Yes I think the Marthas were basically considered respectable (married, right religion) but were not fertile (either through infertility or age). So they're trusted to help raise the children of Gilead. Saying that, CL's martha had an eye missing and didn't seem so respectable, so are there different levels of Martha like there are guardians? I do wonder what happened to the Marthas' husbands. Made guardians maybe? The ones we see all seemed younger. Or have they become workers perhaps, like the butcher? Gardeners etc?

I wonder what Gilead would do with adopted children.

Or married couples who had their children before they got married, like me and dh had children first then got married.

Or first marriages but those with children from previous relationships but not marriages.

I wonder if what happened to Luke's wife? If Luke hadn't escaped would Gilead have forced them back together if only first marriages count?