18 kids and counting C4 tonight (9pm 10/12/2015)

[seasidesally]

new episode shall we have a thread about it ??

if that kind have stuff had been said to someone over the Internet or through texting or people who weren't living together so it was all conversation it would be considered all very sinister.

but because these people are married and appear to he "happy" it's all over looked.

Sue does drive, she has said she passed her test at age 18.

finding I thought that too, there must be day's she just wants to flop on the couch and forget about doing washing and cleaning but if she does skip a day it would be a nightmare trying to catch up.

Could you imagine coming home with a newborn to that chao's

For people who've said that Noel seems to do more than his fair share, could this be because she's spent so long being pregnant that he's had to step in if she's had a difficult pregnancy and found it tough to manage and that's now their routine.

I remember seeing footage of them on a camping trip to France. It looked like chaos and about as far from fun and relaxing as you could get. They couldn't afford to take the children on day trips and were cooped up in tents while the weather was bad.

Well then that's a good reason to stop isn't it.

he actually looked really rough. unshaven, greasy, red/blotchy, he looked on his way to being ill. while sue swanned about in a dressing gown or pushed a hoover around.

He also has the mental burden of doing all the budgeting. I'm amazed the man can still function.

What happens to families when they split or someone dies and the lone parent can't physically cope?

that's an enormous pressure to live with isn't it. I mean if the reality is their split could mean they loose their children into the care system, I can't imagine how sick they must feel all the time that they have to stay together.

And I just thought, with all the benefit cuts and the bedroom tax thing. of ever they were unemployed they'd not receive enough to live.

publicity wouldn't be so good or so positive if they were lie the other families the mail tries to shame. being on benefits would loose them all the interest from people.

(not benefit bashing at all ok. it can and does happen to anyone of us but the forums and articles are all based on them not claiming them. I doubt anyone's going to want their story if it changes)

Sue said on babycentre once that her and Noel had difficulty in abstaining from each other. They deserve a prize on that merit alone.

But why do they have to abstain. they cab be together and not have kids.

It was after a miscarriage, they didn't want to use contraception for whatever reason.

I might be reading too much into it, but in the closing scene in this episode Noel said he was glad they had so many children "to keep us where we are at". It did make me wonder if they would have been happy to stay with each other if they didn't have so many.

I'm really not sure why people keep saying Sue seems to have LD? That nervous giggle thing that she does they all seem to have. They say a statement, giggle, other person says something, giggle, repeat. It must be a regional thing.

She just seems a bit,,,, well ...... slow. she never seems to know what she's doing and what's next to do. she looks confused all the time.

she seems more like a child. the new prams like new toys. she just doesn't seem the full ticket.

I'm not saying g that as a negative thing. more that I do wonder of she is fully in understanding of the situation.

take the babies out the equation she doesn't know what to do witg herself. or what to talk about

like Michelle dugger. spaced out was the term used. I think she's the same. seems to need her husband to think fir her and organise things fir her.

It could just be that circumstances have dictated that Sue hasn't had the opportunity to broaden her horizons beyond rearing her own children?

possibly. but she seems very overwhelmed all the time.

too dependant on her husband and only seems happy when she's pregnant.

I do admittedly find it hard to believe that a woman in full possession of her mental capacities would go through it all. these large families are usually extreme religious nuts who want to keep the children cut off from society so they home school and grow their own everything (not that doing so makes you a religious nut but it is something done by them. it's obviously not a defining characteristic though as many people do it)

can it really be normal for an NT woman to be so reliant on a husband to the point of appearing not to cope when they weren't around and for things to fall apart without someone else to carry some of the responsibility

or normal. without some degree of coercion or brain washing or controlling behaviour

I read Michelle Duggar's book and she frankly says that she spent long periods of time crying when her children were small. Physically, emotionally drained and overwhelmed. She felt obligated to keep them coming though. It was only when her eldest girls started to take over camp that things improved. Michelle plans a lot, but does very little with her kids. She seems quite distant from them and the children go to their "buddies" (older sibling assigned to them) for comfort. You never see Michelle pushing a hoover around. Her daughters even chart her ovulation for her!

I think when you have that many children you have to either be on medication or have the ability to zone out in order to survive.

I find the Duggars general goody-two-shoes attitude a little creepy tbh.

I don't get that same creepy feeling with the Radfords.

Well it is hard not to get creeper out when women are not allowed to talk to a man and their dad/husband is practically pissing up the legs.

thing is with the religious nuts like them, so much can be shown and explained away as faith/moral etc grounds. they could probably sacrifice a goat on camera and it be allowed as part of their beliefs.

you couldn't show or talk about any where near the same things without it.

so perhaps why you don't get the sake feelings.

I'm more sad for them tbh. there's nothing baby 18 brings that the 17 befire didn't. and they clearly have massive mental health issues that haven't been addressed. if I was there parents I'd be terrified for their future. physically with the burn out issue and financially. the world and his wife are opening cafes and baking cakes. that bakery won't be around forever. and then what..

and sue, well she's a 14 yr old girl in a 40 yr olds body. she can't possibly know any different no matter what she says. 26 years of babies.

it would he hard fir a person who dropped out of school at 14 to hold a conversation with adults the same age when instead of social lives and jobs it was babies babies and babies.

I also never saw any evidence of learning difficulties! The laugh thing - I had it(more lije a short giggle) and I was barely aware of it until my annoyed teenager pointed it out to me and I had to pay attention and wean myself off it. (Not 100% successfully). It only happened when I was out of my comfort zone or I was trying to entertain someone and it felt like hard work. What I used to have before the laugh, was a cough, like a throat clearing thing, to fill out pauses in the conversation - that i eventually realised myself and tried to stop, evidently at some point it was replaced by the giggle. My husband does the laugh when he is trying to be entertaining and is constantly coming out with quips, then laughs, to apparently create this jolly atmosphere, though I'm sure he himself is not aware of it. Lots of people have it.

I also thought that Sue seemed a little slow. I can't put my finger on anything specific but it was the general impression I got.

Sue didn't drop out of school at 14 btw and I know it because in this discussion it was mentioned a few times that her Mum looked after the baby so she could finish school. If someone left school and went into childcare professionally and all their life would be babies-babies-babies (say they didn't have many interests or aspirations outside their work - and a lot of people don't!), would they be scorned or declared immature? And we don't know that Sue doesn't have outside interests or aspirations...but even if she didn't, I think raising children in a caring way is one of the best contributions to society you can do.

But then anyway, I suspect Noel is the driving force of endless reproducing. There was a moment in the previous programme, when she miscarried under 12 weeks and sat there unhappy and said something to the effect "I don't want/wouldn't risk any more", and he looked at her startled, like " you don't? I do!" It was quite surprising to see.

I do understand that Sue until the miscarriages was bewilderingly blasé, it looked like she was lured into false security by her track record of healthy normal children and very easy pregnancies, and I did wonder if they ever thought about the risk of genetic abnormalities increasing with age etc, and if they didn't it does appear slightly reckless(though maybe they did but thewere just prepared to terminate if doctors said baby was unhealthy?) but I just feel the need to balance out this thread a little bit in their defence.

I'm not casting any negatives on what it means to raise children. .nor do I believe it renders her unable to do anything else.

but I've been on maternity leave twice and even after what is effectively a very short time it's hard going back because the world has changed so much in the time you have been gone. it's hard to be on an equal footing with people. even in basic jobs like retail being out of it six months feels like a lifetime and I never got that sense of "belonging or achievement" back. so I can't imagine what 26 years of it must be like. I can absolutely believe the children are a comfort zone.

but she does remind me alot of a couple of I went to college with. who were a bit slow on the uptake, very easily lead/persuaded , struggled with the responsibility of looking after themselves a bit. they were nice people, in fact they were my friends we all spent alot of time together.

but something isn't quite right.

and I do think its only natural to be concerned when people make such life altering decisions when your not totally sure they are in a position to know exactly what they are doing, or be able to make a decision for themselves and stuck to it and not be persuaded otherwise.

there is something about him. I can't put my finger on it.

but I don't think, and I could be wrong, she grasps the enormity of it.

we won't ever know though will we.

Maybe they're both not very emotionally aware? It's like there's something missing with both of them .. They seem to see children as a practical/ physical task/ process and there's no 1-2-1 connection or tlc to the children from them.

And the children know that, that's why they don't request time/ a bond/ hugs as they know they won't get it

And that could be why the 'enormity of the task' doesn't bother either of them. As for them it's just clothes, food, get to school from age 4-16. That's what they're offering each baby. Nothing more.

Michelle Duggars children chart her ovulation for her??

They are one weird family.

I am guessing Jill organised her wedding day around her ovulation.