Jonathan Strange anticipation thread

[lucysnowe]

Thought I would start one as have just watched the full trailer here. Am so very exciting now!! Anyone else??

The only thing Crimson Petal was good for was to draw attention to the sad reality that even the most interesting & intellectual woman becomes dull as dishwater when domesticated & put in charge of children

Anyway, enough about that on this thread but if you care to read my thoughts on CP & The W, here it is.

That's a really good point, Lucy. I think because I love the book so much I've never really looked at it with a more critical eye. But yes, Lady Pole and Stephen and Childermass and Vinculus even - you never really get to know what they are thinking, and that's clearly deliberate in Clarke's part.

I'm going to get the Audible version, I've heard it's fantastic. The show is picking up on aspects I hadn't noticed so I do want to read it again with these different ideas in mind.

Re the history of the Raven King, I do think the series would have benefited from a scene setting out the background to English magic right at the start.

You could have had the faerie horde arriving in 1200 (was it then-ish?) and getting the girls to dance, or perhaps the young unnamed human boy in the faery kitchen, and then have a voice over briefly explaining it all - one day an unknown human ruled the faeries and northern England, and magic and travel between the worlds was common, but then he just left and magic died out etc.

I really don't think it would have taken more than 2-3 mins out of the first episode and would have set the scene really well. After all, Clarke really does set the scene very well in the books through the footnotes.

Why would you need that, Thurlow? Wouldn't you know enough about fairy stories to understand the underpinning themes?

Thank you, Cote, I will save that and read it tomorrow. I'm sure it will render me shewed the difference between a homage and a clumsy pastiche.

I agree with thurlow and cote on this one - I think it really needed some sense of that background, which was incredibly powerful. And agree with thurlow as to how it could have been done.

I do think sepia flashbacks would have been tedious, though - and, they are basically the same level of subtlety as 'shewed', aren't they? They'd have been dull and heavy-handed. What they really needed was an imaginative approach to what the footnotes were doing, not just the information they provided. To me, they worked because they created a sense of that period, not just because they gave information. It was that sense of slightly pedantic attitudes, which Norell embodies. So, perhaps his internal monologue could have been used? After all, he clearly knows a huge amount of the history those footnotes mention, and that would also explain why he feels both this very strong sense that he wants to participate in the renewal of magic, and, simultaneously, struggles with it when it exists outside his own narrow context.

I LOVE Thurlow's idea of a LOTR-style scene setting thing about the relations between men and faeries over the centuries. But it might make us expect quite an epic story instead of the drawing-room drama we get (kind of). But I am just imagining it and it would be so cool, ESP if you saw the Gentleman in medieval times etc, it would make his character easier to understand.

I loved CP&W but wow it so different from JS. I didn't the TV version so much tho as so much of the pleasure was in the narration.

Has anyone read The Quincunx? It is also kind-of-subversive pastiche. Awesome but probably impossible to adapt.

Quincunx sounds like an attempt at a faux-middle-English word for women's parts...

A Lord of the Rings style initial pre-credits (Isildur's battle, Smeagol finding the ring, etc) woud have been lovely.

They left out the joke about the bleak, dispair-inducing wilderness where they get the moss oak being Scotland

I'm so relieved that Peter Jackson never got his hands on JS&MrN. I like the Isildur and Smeagol bits but overall I hate what he's done to the books. I stopped watching the first of The Hobbits movies halfway through, it made me so angry.

at quincunx.

This is a nice post on the history, btw, cote and others. blog.oup.com/2015/06/jonathan-strange-mr-norrell-magic/

The Quincunx was amazing and yes, impossible to film, I think. So complex I really couldn't tell the story-line to anyone - and wasn't the ending totally ambiguous? It's like trying to remember a dream now!

Quincunx

Last night's episode was amazing. The King's Roads... wow, just wow. Exactly how I imagined them. Ditto Strange walking through the mirrors (very happy they kept in Mrs Bulworth's lists of ridiculous injuries) and the final parting of Strange and Norrell.

I'm loving the humour too. They've not managed to keep many lines from the book, as a lot of the humour comes from thoughts etc that are hard to transpose onto screen, but they've certainly kept the feel of the humour.

Particular favourite's last night were Strange pausing to take his leave of Mrs Bulworth before sprinting after Drawlight, and that fantastic scene (with the always great Jamie Parker) with Grant and the other officer desperately pretending not to be in the room when Arabella and Strange have their argument.

Though I really hope they manage to keep in my very favourite line, from the very end of the book, where Mr Norrell makes that comment about "if nothing else, this is a very good example of the need for precision in spells"

Quincunx starts off quite genreish but gets more and more subversive as it goes on IIRC Clawdy and the ending is very vague. Impossible to film yes but an amazing book.

This was a nice episode but I found Jonathan's ranting about the Raven King a bit repetitive. It is interesting that they are going back to Waterloo because I remember in the book thinking it was part of the Peninsula bit and wondering why it was a bit later on. I hope we get the scene when (SPOILER) Strange looks into the future, it's very chilling.

Did anybody else hope Childermass would knee Lascelles on the way out of the room?
I loved that episode.

another good episode! It does seemed to have veered off from the book though. On tumblr some people were complaining that Strange actually killed someone rather than coming near it in the book. The Arabella stuff is different too. I am a bit worried the writers are taking bits from the book which kind of don't make sense when looked at too closely (ie why Strange didn't try to revive Arabella) and are overexplaining it. Also he seems to be pretty mad already, which makes the actual search for madness stuff less striking.

Things are hotting up now tho, I love all the Venice stuff.

Have only watched the first three episodes, so have just read the first four pages of this thread to avoid spoilers.

I must admit that until I saw the third episode, I thought that the Gentleman was the Raven King.

I have to confess that although I think it's brilliantly done - superb acting, visually stunning - it creeps me out in some strange way. I mean, really, really creeps me out. It's so sinister. I started reading the book (have been meaning to read it for ages, kept putting it off) and that creeps me out too. I don't know what's wrong with me.

Not sure what to do about the remaining episodes - DP is loving it so I may have to continue!

I was leaning towards the screen shouting "Hit him! Hit him! HIT HIM, FOR GOD'S SAKE!!!!"

I didn't hate Lascelles quite so much in the book, at least not until near the end. Destest him on screen, which is good.

I had a horrible feeling at the end of this episode that maybe they are going to rewrite it and the next episode won't be a field trip with the Greysteeles? I do hope not. Some of the best stuff is happens there.

The pacing was a bit off for me this week, though possibly just because as sad as it is the Bell dies, it's sandwiched between some really good stuff and I just wanted it to move on to the good stuff. The probable cliffhanger that ends next week's episode is one of my favourite scenes in any book, I turned the page that quickly I nearly ripped it. Can't wait to see it.

The only bit that saddens me at the moment (though let me be clear I've never loved an adaptation as much as this and I can't believe they have done it as well as they have) is that they've increased Arabella and Lady Pole's roles, understandably, at the expense of a bit of Vinculus's stuff but, most importantly, Stephen's. Stephen is less sympathetic in this, which is a bit of a loss.

Loved Childermass hiding in the shadows. He's just awesome. I'm hopelessly in love.

Though on a very shallow note, is anyone else finding Bertie Carvel more and more attractive as each episode continues?

I haven't read the books, never heard of them and am transfixed.

And shallowly finding Bertie Carvel increasingly attractive. Childermass - blimey.

I've found my people!

Childermass - phwoar. Mr Cilenti, you have never been so beautiful.

Carvel & Marsan, ace, obv.

Marc Warren!!! Dreadful! Why is there zero light and shade in his performance? It's all on one level. Wonder whether that's the director's fault, or whether he just isn't that great an actor.

I don't like the fact that they have made Arabella unaware of her kidnap. In the book she was fully aware of having been stolen and actively sought out Lady Poles company. Or at least that is how I remember it happening anyway.
And yes, Marc Warren totally fails to get over the belief that he is doing everyone a favour.

I don't understand your last sentence, Arabella.

I wanted Childermass to hurt Lascelles but otoh I think his selfpossession is one of his attractive qualities. I want him to play Sirius Black should there be an (unlikely) remake of HP with the current crop of actors. I loved him coming out of the shadows and I loved Jonathan Strange going through the mirror to go to Norrell's house, that were very good special effects.
Lascelles is so annoying, I think, because he is such a floppy-haired whiny little prat, how did Norrell become so dependent on him, gah.
Bertie Carvel is a discovery for me. I only ever saw him in that cameo in The Wrong Mans. I think he is great.

And yes, Marc Warren totally fails to get over the belief that he is doing everyone a favour.

This might refer to something that I said (or others may also have said it).

In the books, the Gentleman acts as if he fully believes that what he is doing is the best for everyone, and that they should be entirely grateful for the chance to come and dance at his wonderful balls - or Stephen should be very pleased that the king might be killed to make way for him.

He knows that other people have feelings, but since this makes HIM happy he imagines that it makes EVERYONE happy.

Isn't it wonderful, you get to come dance at my fantastic balls

In the show he's more hahaha I got one over on the magician

I am so impressed with Bertie Carvel's acting - I'd only seen him as the weasly Finn in Babylon so for him to be heroic (and actually fanciable) is a revelation!

Only two more episodes (sob)