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Telly addicts

Baby p the untold story

164 replies

thoughtsbecomethings · 27/10/2014 21:51

What are people's thoughts on this program ??

OP posts:
LineRunner · 28/10/2014 19:50

The Leader of the Council resigned - and the Cabinet Member I think - plenty of failings on swords.

Nanadookdookdook · 29/10/2014 07:09

We don't know their names do we (have just looked them up) whereas SShoesmith is well and truly branded in our minds. One is a college governor so presumably accepted back in to public life. The other would have been retirement age I think.

GingerSkin · 29/10/2014 08:10

What did the judge say who ruled it an unfair dismissal?

XpertHR editor comment is here. She was most definitely treated unfairly and working in HR myself, I clearly remember thinking at the time of the public dismissal, she would win a case because procedurally they (the Council) didn't do what they should have done (even taking the level of detail aside).

It appears she didn't win the main ET, but won her appeal. I can only imagine, because of the complexity of the case, how hard it must have been to try and clear your name (as in clear it of having 'blood on her hands')

I am unsure how accurate the reports are, but it is alleged she had around £550,000 pay out, made up of salary, loss of earnings and pension contributions. I question if she will work again in a similar role again.

I'd be interested to understand if the Director of HR at the Council stood up for her, or wasn't able to. I'd also be interested to understand if GOSH took appropriate action within their HR teams / management on failing to recruit properly in the clinic at St Anne's. At what point did a HR professional and a manager think it was ok to recruit the doctor with no clinical experience of child protection cases? Sure that was the essential criteria in the job description. So many failings at so many levels, which in private sector businesses, normally have a consequence of costs / loss of profit, but in this case, life is in danger and failings like this cannot happen.

amyhamster · 29/10/2014 08:14

Yes they didnt adhere to her contract which said 3 months notice & they just stopped her salary & pension
Shocking really

Mumzy · 29/10/2014 08:43

I suspect more experienced Docs fron UK were in the know re: the problems at the St Anne's clinic and wouldn't have touched it with a barge pole hence why they recruited the dr that did. A lot of paediatricians IME now shy away from areas where there is a large of child protection because it's horrendous and thankless. I was involved in a few CP CSEs in the past and some of them traumatized me and there was no support from the NHS trusts involved.

Mumzy · 29/10/2014 08:44

Cases not CSES

smokeandfluff · 29/10/2014 20:55

Nancy-I can't get my head around that the hospital staff and social workers knew he was being beaten but he was still was sent home. What does someone have to do for their child to be placed with someone else? ?
Felt so sorry for the paediatrician. Ridiculous she was in the clinic by herself with no nurse to help weigh or height the baby

WestmorlandSausage · 29/10/2014 21:33

They didn't know he was being beaten smokeandfluff

Nancy66 · 30/10/2014 10:18

Westmoreland - he was considered a child 'a risk' and there was a part of the documentary where the social worker made an unannounced visit and found Baby P with bad facial bruising. the mother's excuse seemed implausible. the examining doctor agreed it was an injury caused by an adult. That should have been enough.

IPityThePontipines · 30/10/2014 13:20

That shamefully, managers in other areas of the NHS and social services are able to preside over appalling standards of services and get away with it, is no reason for Sharon Shoesmith to have kept her job and avoided any censure. Though, she should have been dismissed following the proper protocols.

Had Haringey been a centre of excellence for child protection practice, I am certain she would have taken full credit, therefore the converse must apply.

Sadly I don't have it to hand, but there are some very good analyses of the case by SW/CP staff explaining exactly what went wrong. Peter Conolly was failed by those who were meant to protect him. While tabloid hysteria is not a suitable response to that, nor his describing his fate as inevitable.

natalex123 · 17/02/2015 20:30

I have started researching into looking at what was missed by the professionals involved with the tragic case of baby P, to try and get an understanding of how things could have been done differently. Without blaming or judging any one of the individuals and professionals involved I am questioning why the warning signs and clear signs of abuse were missed or overlooked. Below is one summary of the report by the Mail online:

“I watched it too. I found it very chilling that he sat there kissing Baby Peter in the mobile phone clip....when it was later found out that he'd beat, abuse & torture him, treat him like a dog (making him sit on floor with his head down for 20 minutes then click for him to get up), cause him to lose part of his finger, withhold food from him, leave him in his cot for hours, break his ribs. It makes me so sick that anyone could be so evil. Peter looked like a lost soul in that video, he looked scared, he eyes looked hollow and that was his 1st birthday. He looked confused that he was being kissed and cuddled......looked like he was expecting him to switch and do something to hurt him.

I also found it very disturbing that the Social Worker didnt even pick up on her 'loved up' body language that was so evident in the interview, when she spoke of her 'new friend' and accepted her word that he was just a friend not a boyfriend!!! Anyone involved in the childs life has to be investigated. Its protocol when children are on the at risk register!!! And this Social worker failed to see it!!!

Alarm bells were first rang when Peter 'apparently' fell down the stairs at age 8 months. His mother would say he was accident prone, clumsy & had a high pain tolerance, took him to the doctors alot to get various injuries/infections looked at and drugs for him (clear signs of munchausen by proxy). And then was seen by the same doctor again a month later with even more injuries!!! He was referred to a specialist the next day that contacted Social services. He was taken into care then and shouldn’t have gone home!!!
Its disgusting that Baby P was taken into care for that 6 weeks then returned home without a 'proper in depth investigation'. The person who cared for him said he would scratch, bite & headbutt (bearing in mind he was only 9 months old - this is very worrying behaviour). This alone would indicate something wasnt right at home and should have been enough for Harringay to keep him in care.

He was failed by everyone involved....His mother, his father, his mothers partner, his grandmother, his HV, the hospital, SS, childminder, neighbours etc.”

The Mail Online reports:

“Social worker Maria Ward - Appointed as the allocated social worker for Baby P on February 2, 2007, making her first visit to the child 20 days later. Baby P’s mother reassured her that she was “back on track” and insisted that the child should not be on the at-risk register. When Ms Ward spotted bruising on the child’s face the mother told her that he had squabbled with an older child. Four days before Baby P died the caseworker said that she visited the house for a prearranged meeting. She found the boy in his pushchair, his bruises covered up with chocolate. “He had eaten a chocolate biscuit and there was chocolate over his face,” she told the court. “He had chocolate on his hands and face.” She said that she asked the mother to wipe his face before they went out and the mother started cleaning him. Miss Ward noted that the boy had an infected scalp, which was covered in white cream, and an ear infection.

The social worker failed to report and identify clear signs of abuse /neglect.
WHY was this not reported?
• Was the Social worker so overloaded with her volume of caseloads and administration that she overlooked this?
• Had she become so desensitized through the volume and pressure of cases she had in her care that she became on automatic pilot- and did not see the obvious abuse that is so clear to a majority of us.

In the second serious case review the report states Baby p was seen by the consultant paediatrician who saw him in A&E two days before he died and failed to notice a broken back and eight broken ribs; she fell short of expected standards and could face a "fitness to practise" hearing at the General Medical Council.

The Consultant Paediatrician who saw Baby P just two days before his death failed to pick up on fatal injuries – again why? Over worked/ long hours /volume of caseload? Inadequate Child protection training?

These are just two examples of missed opportunities to report incidents, the police also failed to take action and prosecute, along with other professionals. I am concerned this is just one family we have heard about- how many more do not hit the headlines but are just as serious and a cause for concern.

Through the subsequent reports and investigations we know WHAT happened and what mistakes have been made with baby P, as listed in an independent report by Ed Balls, but do we know WHY.
Children's Secretary Ed Balls said the shortcomings included:
• Failure to identify children at immediate risk of harm and to act on evidence. This included a failure to talk to children believed to be at risk
• Agencies acting in isolation from one another without effective co-ordination
• Poor gathering, recording and sharing of information
• Insufficient supervision by senior management
• Insufficient challenge by the Safeguarding Children Board to council members and frontline staff
• Over-dependence on performance data which was not always accurate
• Poor child protection plans
• Failure to implement the recommendations of the Victoria Climbie inquiry, which heavily criticised it five years ago.

My question is…WHAT NEEDS TO BE DONE DIFFERENTLY TO AVOID THIS HAPPENING AGAIN, AND HOW?

Finally, below is another extract from the second serious case review which states how Social workers found themselves facing increased administrative tasks – so, was all the admin. work that had to be completed at the expense of having direct contact with the children and families and being “hands on” and vigilant to the incidents such as what baby P experienced?

“There was a reorganisation of Haringey’s Children and Young People’s Service’s Children’s Teams in December 2006. Its overall aim was to move towards specialist teams. Social workers considered that the amount of administrative support to them had decreased over the years, and the introduction of the new case recording system, Framework I, had been responsible for many new Administrative tasks. The caseload of the social worker responsible for leading on the child protection plan for child A had almost doubled from January 2007 to July 2007 and was 50% above the caseload Recommended by Lord Laming in the Report of the Public Inquiry into The death of Victoria Climbie. The social worker described her caseload as made up of various ‘types of case and categories of registration’ and that ‘it was a lot of work’ and that she ‘never had time to do everything.’

Both social workers were regarded as well qualified to be the allocated social workers on a case like that of child A. Their social work knowledge, skills and experience were thought to be matched to the complexity of the case. “

In my research to improve the way services can be run I would like to hear from anyone who has had experience of our public services – have they let you down, and if so how? What happened – what do you think could or should have been done differently, how was it handled? Have you had a positive experience when a situation was handled well – if so what happened?

I would value your thoughts and would like to hear from you- my aim is to provide an efficient, thorough, safe service to protect and safeguard children and prevent the tragic loss of vulnerable children like Victoria Climbie and Baby P from happening again.

If Peter Connelly is to have any legacy at all it's that children are safer”

Thisismyfirsttime · 17/02/2015 21:21

Baby P had siblings. (Quite rightly,) The general public will never know the real 'untold story' as those siblings survived. I am always surprised when threads like this come up that no-one seems to realise that a large part of this case/ cases were held behind closed doors and cannot be reported on by the media and cannot be discussed by those who know. So perhaps what you think you know about it doesn't even scratch the surface.

natalex123 · 18/02/2015 07:39

Thank you for your message. I agree with your comments, quite rightly the privacy of the siblings should be maintained, respected and protected.
As mentioned in my original post my concern and priority is not to point fingers, judge or blame. My motive is to simply understand, and to move forward with that fresh perspective.
I want change – to provide a service and this includes remaining authentic, transparent, safe and rigorous. I realise that to do this I need to scratch deeper than the surface, to hear the truth, as this is the place where I can start to build from the beginning and learn first hand.
So my question is… if I don’t get to know what happened and scratch under the surface a little, then how will we (I) know how things could have been done differently, when we (I) only get to hear and see as much as the media, government etc. want us to know? This is too limiting, blinkered and biased, and for me it is restricting and futile. Whilst respecting and maintaining the privacy of all directly and indirectly involved If I don’t get to understand just a little of the underlying truth about what happened with how incidents were missed and other events which I am not even aware of –with Baby P and other people’s experiences of similar nature – and to learn from them, then I will be re creating a service set to fail, as the system will not change and the same mistakes will continue to happen.

Even the serious case reviews have been criticized.

It is sometimes difficult for change to happen and transparency is needed – to work on a level deeper than what we are sometimes usually permitted and takes us outside of our comfort zone. I am committed to see this change happen and looking with a fresh perspective, open mind, and no judgements being made, with the focus on moving forward not lingering in the past, other than to learn from it.

natalex123 · 01/03/2015 12:52

Hi
I started watching Baby P The Untold Story BBC Documentary 2014 on 'you tube' last week and got half way through watching it - I went back on to it today to watch the rest and it has been edited! does anyone know why! or where I can see it ?

Thanks

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