Make me a German, BBC 2

[ImperialBlether]

Anyone watching this? I wondered how long they were staying for, given that they are leaving their elder two children in the UK.

No, more about what they think of how other nationalities live and their contribution to German society.

Oh ok.

This is making me realise how little team work there is in the UK too. In a lot of companies I've worked in, if someone works hard it makes others think they can do less. It's something I've found a problem in lots of places I've worked.

Hmm, about the FB at work thing, it'd have been interesting to see what actually happens in offices where staff have access to their mobiles - more impractical to do this whilst doing a more manual job. FB is banned where I work

I visited Germany once - didn't like it at all. But their general 'attitude' towards each other does seem much better than ours.

I think that was brought home by the complaint about the noise on a Sunday and the British couple having no inkling that they had been annoying people. Just symptomatic of the lack of thought that people give to other people over here.

I really dislike seeing people working in offices with ipods in. Apart from that they can't hear the phone so you end up answering all the bloody phones. That's not team work.

There just seems to be a general lac of respect in the UK. I attended night school classes where most of my class mates were 18 - 25ish. They would be texting away with their phones under the desk - some even openly while the lecturer tried to explain a point. I thought that was bloody rude.

So do the women have careers and then just stop? And do they go back to work when the children leave home? And if they can afford to stay at home/get cheap childcare abd good benefits why do they have so few children? Not judging it is just so different!

They're much more a rule-led society though aren't they? And yes, they were in a factory, but I didn't get the impression that FB would be allowed normally. The girl who was at their meal who'd been to the UK couldn't believe how it was allowed/used here.

A very very sweeping generalisation but I think we think less about the concept of society here than they do in Germany. I remember when I was with my German dp and we debated about where we should live. He said he could never live in the UK because of our attitude to recycling (all we did then was to recycle paper). I laughed but soon realised he was deadly serious

This is really making me think of all that's wrong here, though. It's not that I'm thinking it's all great there, but there are so many things that are so obviously wrong here.

I personally could not live in such a regulated society.

I feel that, too, squoosh. There are a lot of advantages, though. When the guy was late for work he was told quite firmly that wasn't allowed - that is such a big problem here.

Same here - I've just finished a book about living in Bearn in France, which made the UK seem a very dog-eat-dog place.

I once spoke with an American who was living over here,. She said she was amazed at how "brutal" the UK was. Always remember that word as it seemed quite appropriate.

I'm half an hour late with it, so it's still on, but I'm laughing that you can't use a drill or have children playing loudly, but you can still do housework. That poor woman!

I think it used to be called 'consideration' (for others).

The UK was like this 40 odd years ago.

Imperial I think loud housework was out on a Sunday so no hoovering, not sure about the washing machine or dishwasher.

Bisjo, when you think of the fly tipping here in some areas, and the way some people dump rubbish bags in their front garden with no intention at all of clearing it up, a sense of society is a really good thing. Your German DP would die of shock if he saw that!

I thought this was a series. Is this it?

I agree and I think that Margaret Thatcher was spot on when she said that there was no such thing as society. When she said it there wasn't and I'm not sure there is much now. I certainly see no evidence of Cameron's supposed 'big society'.

He told them no drilling and she perked up asking about housework but he said, No, housework is okay....

Google ravenmother.

It's not consideration it's obeying the rules.

Yes, it's obeying rules but those rules were made for the consideration of other people.

Yes, over here if someone worked six days a week, we'd understand him/her having to drill on a Sunday afternoon. There has to be leeway. However, some rules are good - I think there's a section of British society that thinks none of the rules apply to them.

I wouldn't call it 'consideration' either. I call it being expected to fall in line and do as you're told. None of your individualism here thanks.

I've spent this evening racking my brains trying to think if I know any professional German women who have children. I know lots but cannot think of any who do have children (and they are of an age where they would have decided either not to have dcs or been unable to have them, rather than simply deferring it to a later time). I'm shocked by that.

Interestingly contrast that with Turkey where I know plenty of women who successfully combine high powered careers with having children. I reckon if I gave two scenarios and asked people to guess which countries I was referring to most people would reverse Germany and Turkey.

I think in German society 'consideration' equals 'control'.