Not having a smartphone

[aNameyName]

Thinking ahead a year or two to having a teenager: My child is already in a small minority in not yet having their own smartphone, and since reading 'The Anxious Generation' by Jonathan Haidt, I'm minded to hold out against giving my child a smartphone until they can get one themselves, if they want to because the massive developmental opportunity costs were shocking when laid out so plainly.

If you have teenage children with a dumb phone or no personal phone at all, what are the worst negative impacts for your teen of not having a smartphone? Has your position on smartphones affected your relationship with your child? At what age / event do you intend to give your child a smartphone, if at all? What other factors should I consider in weighing up if / when to give them a smartphone?

Actually yes, they're difficult to use well. If they weren't nobody would worry about giving them to their kids. Isn't that what this thread is about?

I gave my kids smart phones as they left primary. They had strict rules and I checked their phones. No phones in the bedroom, nothing after 9pm etc. I wanted them to learn responsible use of phones. Thankfully they then went to a school that continued in that vein.

Interestingly, while their school welcomed phones, they weren't allowed to use them at breaks so that they could be sociable.

I think they have been well trained in using a phone and are not glued to them now.

Mine both have phones but I use family link to control apps and screen time. I also have life 360 with tracks the phone just incase it's mislaid. Also just peace of mind for them/me. The family link is great as I set times the phone is active/inactive. I have said no to snap chat (as I don't trust disappearing messages).

I would agree that my children use it to access school schedules, research etc so it isn't just used socially. They are both very responsible. We have an agreement that I can check the phone anytime. I do a sim only plan which works out at £8 a month for 50Gb of data and unlimited calls and texts. Perfect for listening to music away from home.

I got my daughters phone from very and did the introductory discount and then paid it off. It doesn't have to be crazy expensive.

Also make sure they have a screen protector just in case :)

Yip I don't think kids are given freedom to grow up.
And isolating them from peers isn't going to help.

I do think 13 is young to have complete free reign over the Internet but I don't honestly believe parents who say they hang over their kids shoulders when they are on line.
Who wants to listen to kids playing Minecraft or Fortnite on a console?
Who wants to be forced to do homework with someone breathing down your neck?

It's really easy to block safari and all sorts of apps and websites via the family/screen time on the iPhone and iPad . You can switch the entire thing off at certain times and days if you want to!

I really liked being able to see where my teen was so I didn't have to keep texting him if he was a bit late, I could see him on the train coming home. Just makes life all a bit easier to be honest.

6 years is a lifetime ago.

Yes, it is @Needanewname42. I probably worded it clumsily. It was really to illustrate how much the use of technology has moved on.

Massive assumption that everyone used Apple products.

Android household here 😀

Whether those choices are seen by a majority as balanced or not depends where the Overton window is at that point in time. It doesn't matter how others see anyone else's parenting or what is mainstream. Peer pressure is not my guiding compass and I teach my kids to walk their own path too. What matters is our own parenting, how responsive and involved we are and how our dc experience it, whatever the political climate and whatever parenting ideas are in or out of fashion. Some dc cannot manage things that others can, why follow societal trends? Harmful ideas and practices can be firmly within the 'Overton window', which you mentioned, I trust my own judgmental and competency as a parent and citizen.

This is a really interesting perspective.

Conversely my 15 yr-old son is a fairly typical teenage smartphone user but his life skills are pretty decent.

We have just returned from a holiday in Germany and he was brilliant at knowing his way around and navigating public transport and yes, some apps helped with that. Makes me confident about him taking his own trips abroad in the future.

That's not to say smartphones are the reasons for his confidence and abilities but that there are multiple factors that influence teenage behaviour, both positive and negative and parents are best advised to tailor their approaches based on their specific family and environmental needs.

My DC secondary uses smart phone at school. It's part of their lessons to use their phone for blooket. Her girl guiding unit has also used it for treasure trails, what three words and photography. This is in addition to their class whatsapp group. It's an expected thing that they all have smart phones.

@RampantIvy you can do it on android too!

I wasn't assuming anything, it's just my personal experience.

Holding out until your child is old enough to get one themselves would be a disaster, given they can't get a contract until 18. It would be very unfair as they wouldn't be able to communicate with friends. I've rarely seen my 16 year old talking on the phone, it's always messages in Snapchat and Whatsapp. So many other things he uses it for - banking, which he's been using for a few years, maps, look at school timetable etc.

In my experience, having 2 teen boys and having been a teen myself, if you deny a child something which everyone else has or is using they will find a way to circumvent your rules to fit in with their peers.

Mind you I am not one of those parents who think smart phones are the devil, in fact I find it baffling that people think this.

A smart phone is a tool, it is up to the child and parent to learn to use it safely.

If you child cant use it safely then as a parent you have to address that, not ban them from using them before you even know how they will cope

That’s awful for families who can’t afford smartphones for each child. What age do they start using WhatsApp in their class?

@Parker231 They don't use WhatsApp. That's something organised by the kids. But the school expect them to use blooket in class to do quizzes. Homework uses satchel one and they have emails via outlook. Regularly, they have research tasks needing youtube or website suggested by the teachers. The homework can be done with a laptop.

It's from Year 7. We are in a comprehensive in a 'leafy suburb'. DC has not mentioned anyone who hasn't got a smartphone. She has a iPhone SE and it's one of the crappiest phone in the class.

Kids are more likely to have smartphone than laptop.

One of my dd's friends didn't have one until 14, I know she felt left out.
She had to constantly borrow her friends phones so she could communicate properly with her group.
Setting boundaries and supporting your dc to use this technology safely is important and banning it doesn't actually do this.

The future is what people want it to be! Atm humanity controls technology and not the other way round. If we ( people in general) dont want children to use phones/apps for school work we can change that.

It ,is awful. Yes most families can provide their children with smartphones but that money may well be better spent on other things. Never before have schools expected parents to have to provide school equipment that costs the same as a phone and that has an ongoing cost as well!

It’s how kids communicate. Not giving them one cuts them off from conversations with friends, meeting arrangements, events, payments, etc. Even school comms/timetables/homework is on apps these days. Her friends will not be interested in using the landline to communicate with her. If she goes anywhere she’ll be using apps to pay, for example, bus/train fairs, in shops, activities, even buying an ice cream. Have strict controls about usage and permission settings, but by not letting her have one she is at risk of being excluded.

@DorisAndDot I bring up the Overton window to reflect that what's considered 'balanced' is subjective and can vary over time and culture and is not an objective thing. As for harmful practices being firmly in the Overton window; Haidt's book points to a lot of evidence of this, though IIRC without using the phrase 'Overton window'.

@FunnysInLaJardin

I don't believe in the devil.

A circular saw is another tool which my child isn't yet showing any interest in. Learning how to use the circular saw safely can deferred until they are older, stronger, have greater co-ordination and are better able to use it well. Put simply, I don't see the sense in them having a smartphone before they see a need for one themself, and in a couple of years they'll be able to get themselves one anyway. Do you think I should be trying to get them interested in using a smartphone regardless?

So is your dd 16 and hasn't got a phone?

I agree, but I would have thought that most of them might have access to one at home.

If you have teenage children with a dumb phone or no personal phone at all, what are the worst negative impacts for your teen of not having a smartphone?

@aNameyName I think you haven't had many answers to this specific question as most of us with teenagers or older are unable to answer it because they do have smartphones.

now you are being perverse @aNameyName

Your original OP talked about holding out for as long as possible. It that scenario one assumes that your DC is asking for a phone and you are refusing.

If a child doesn't want one of course you don't encourage them. If they get to secondary and actively don't want a phone all you need to do is point out their lives would be easier with one and leave it at that.

I’ve been a Governor at several schools where groups of children did not have their own phone or laptop - it’s not unusual (apart from Mn). These schools didn’t embarrass the children by making them stay after school to use school laptops for their homework and therefore limiting their ability to join after school sports clubs. Homework was available in paper and electronic format.

The pupils who were in the most trouble on a regular basis were those with smartphones where parents allowed them access to WhatsApp groups.