Is this a general thing now?

[RoseMartha]

So not to drip feed some background info.

I am a Christian. My exh and 2 teen dd's are not, exh and youngest dd 14 do believe in God and eldest dd 15 believes when it suits her. They did used to go to church with me when they were younger, but dont now. Because of being a Christian we have always had a no swear or blaspheme rule with me or at home and with close family friends and family, from when they were babies. (The girls know that I understand that they choose to swear with their mates or peer group or at their dad's). They both have asd and mh concerns.

I parent them with NVR techniques. I have consequences in place. However exh does not co parent, more counter parents and very disney dad with them.

But they still constantly swear at me and use emotional abuse tactics and put downs and tell me in aggressive abusive language what a bad parent I am. One of them told me today that all teens treat their parents like this and I am being unreasonable to think they should speak to me with respect. I did point out to them that when I have spoken to my friends who are mixed Christian and non Christian ( in case that is relevant) none of them have this from their teens multiple times a day if at all.

So is this normal from your teens to be spoken to like this?

The NVR support tells me to keep going with it which I am doing, it just feels like it will never end.

I have one of those!

Religion should have nothing to do with it your right to ask they speak to you with respect and have boundaries on swearing:

It's not normal.
We aren't a religious house and there might be swearing but it's not directed at someone. "shit" when you hurt yourself vs "you are a shit" which is very different.

What has your religion got to do with it all? Why do you keep mentioning it?

In any case no its not normal and not right.

I agree with everyone else that you seem to be bringing religion into a situation that has nothing to do with it.

I do think it sounds as if your children are being very rude and need to be told this is not ok. But, I am slightly concerned you say your children are using 'emotional abuse tactics'. Are you sure they're not just being teenagers?! Attributing that level of intent to them seems quite full-on.

I can't help feeling as if I'm missing something here.

It's normal for most teenagers to test boundaries: see where they are and what happens.

It's a parent's job to set those boundaries, explain why they're there and ensure there are consequences for over stepping them.

In this context your religious beliefs are irrelevant. Your DD should treat you with respect because you’re their mum, not because you’re a Christian. By bringing religion into it you’re confusing the issue especially as they don’t share your beliefs.

Teens can exhibit difficult and challenging behaviours. We are an atheist household. My teens swear with their friends but never in front of me and definitely never at me. However I have friends who are great parents whose children have gone through phases of being verbally abusive to them. So I don’t think it’s ‘normal’ but it isn’t all down to terrible parenting either.

I wrote the Christianity part of it because my siblings family are not Christians and will swear at each other when arguing and also my dd age 15 will use it against me. Mock me for believing. So I thought maybe that I was expecting too much of her.

But I live in this intense environment with SN teens and fitting in work, all my time and energy goes on supporting them, work and going to meetings with them or dropping them at meetings and attending meeting about supporting them. As well as daily contact with at least one teacher or staff at school with some issue kicking off. As time has gone on, my teenagers behaviour has isolated me a lot from my support network that I originally had with family and friends. Then you lose touch with what is acceptable and I live a life where their behaviour is very challenging and it is an effort to get through a day. The other day felt like a year and but was 24 hours.

There is more backstory but I would be posting this for a week to explain it all. It is complex.

Because of the situation there is a support worker in place. The consequences have to be in direct line with what happened.

I put a consequence in this week for my eldest and in response to that she has been worse. She had to hand something back that she should not have had in the first place. Because she didnt like this the verbal onslaught has been terrible.

I dont really want to repeat the words but the C word is used a lot with the F word. And other swear words are hurled at me as well as put downs.

I have always set a good example. I have not forced Christianity onto them. I accept it is their choice what to believe. I try my best to always be fair and do the right thing. They despise this and use this to hurl more insults.

With the NVR if they are physically violent I need to call the police for example. If it is verbal I tell my network contact eg a family friend and they speak to the teen and they say something positive to the teen, then say that they are concerned about their behaviour to me , then end on a positive note about the teen.

If the teen screams or meltdowns, I make sure they have safe space. Then afterwards I go and talk with them to help them regulate. Then the next day we talk about whatever set it off to help think about how it can be different next time. But it never is as eldest can not regulate. Younger one can self regulate better.

It is relentless and I am permanently exhausted and worn down.

After she told me it is normal and I need to accept that. I wondered perhaps if my expectations are too high and it is normal and hoped that you might all say yes it is or no its not.

I'm confused, your OP mentioned a lot about Christianity but never once said your teens have special needs and challenging behaviour.

You mention them being violent, in that context I really couldn't get worked up about swearing, even though it is not pleasant to be on the end of any kind of verbal abuse.

@TwigTheWonderKid
In my first post i said they had asd and mh concerns.

I was raised in a non-swearing household and I have raised DD the same and it goes both ways for adults and children. Religion is not involved in this decision.

My teen DD would never talk back to me or swear at me, it helps that she has ASD and doesn't like breaking rules. There is only the two of us and we get on well, she sees her dad but he's not in issue either on this topic at least as he was raised in a similar way. I have told her if she decides to swear outside the family home with her friends she is to be mindful of her surroundings and to not do it in front of children/older people.

Just read your update

your experience of teenagers with your daughters isn’t just “not the norm” it is downright disturbing and very extreme

Both girls sound like they are a danger to society let alone their mother

Erm no. Mind wouldn’t swear at me. I wouldn’t swear at them. There’s mutual respect there and I have no idea what you’re talking about in reference to the parenting technique you use. I parent on instinct and respect underlies that.

I'm sorry I missed that. To be honest, surely that should have been the main thrust of your post, not the religious stuff?

Given you’re Christian and divorced, I’m guessing the children saw some extreme behaviour growing up such as domestic violence? Have they had therapy?

With the NVR if they are physically violent I need to call the police for example. If it is verbal I tell my network contact eg a family friend and they speak to the teen and they say something positive to the teen, then say that they are concerned about their behaviour to me , then end on a positive note about the teen

Honestly, it sounds like you’re not parenting. Surely contacting a family friend and having them come over ages after the incident occurs isn’t effective? Why aren’t you dealing with the bad behaviour yourself, and at the time it happens?

Not sure the relevance of the Christian thing, no it is not normal

I don't see how parenting with a philosophy works, may work for some kids nor others so I just parent with the child I have

Raising children is about negotiating. Not just with the child but with your self. What is your absolute non negotiable behaviour. What can you overlook

I think you have to analyse what is setting off the extreme reactions.
Is it starting with your no swearing rule and escalating from there

Is the ASD diagnosed, if there are MH concerns are they diagnosed.

You also have to take on board that you are expecting children who don’t have to think about their words or behaviour with one parent then having to mask and behave a certain way with another parent.

They must feel like they are in a pressure cooker.

We’re an atheist/agnostic home. Both DH and I are a bit sweary at times (never to or at people but just for emphasis/humour in general conversation). Our 17 year-old swears in front of us but our 15 year-old doesn’t. None of us ever swear AT each other, or raise our voices at each other.

@PapadamPreach

Agree. These kids sound raging. There’s no parenting going on.

Leave the Christian/ blasphemy out of it. It’s making cursing at you even more attractive because it’s even more transgressive. Make it clear that cursing at a parent is completely unacceptable and ensure that there are consequences.

OP you go know that people who aren’t actively Christian aren’t all mindless yobs with no morals don’t you?

Because the standard of behaviour you are wanting from your dc is nothing to do with religion. It’s basic human decency.

and no, that’s not normal behaviour and wouldn’t be tolerated from teens or anyone at all in this atheist household .

No it's not a 'thing' for teenagers to behave this way. Your daughter to trying to manipulate you into accepting her bad behaviour.

@PapadamPreach
Yes they have had support and therapy, which is ongoing when they agree to go.
My youngest is much more accepting of support. The eldest thinks the world owes her a favour and the support workers can in her words f* right off.

Yes that was the case as it was a difficult decision for me to make. But I knew we could not continue to live like that. However he continues to do his best to control from afar via the girls. And yes unfortunately they saw how he treated me and learnt from that.

I have put everything I can into supporting them and parenting them in a positive way and trying to move forward from what was a traumatic time in our lives. The intense verbal abuse from the girls didn't really start until after we divorced and I would say started during puberty. I know when he saw them he would say bad things and lies about me. I think this still happens sometimes. Although their behaviours were challenging from age 2 or 3.

Sometimes it seems to me that no matter how much you parent in a positive way with boundaries it still falls apart.

When things are so intense you forget what a normal family life is like. And I wanted to know what you all feel is normal. The Christian part of my post is because as I said in my second post I get mocked for some of my Christian values and I wondered if i was unreasonable and whether other peoples teens do in-fact swear at them.

I haven’t a clue what NVR is. They just sound like spoiled kids that aren’t parented well.