Wild swimming.

[malificent7]

Dd (13) wants to go wild swimming with a group of mates in a well known local spot for swimming...very slow river.
Whilst on the surfave it seems like a lovely thing to do I am concerned for the following reasons;
It is a 25 min drive from our house in a rural village.
She dosn't want me or any other adults around which means if anything happens i will be out of reach.
She is a fair swimmer but the banks can be hard to get out of.

I told her no but there was a massive scene saying all the other parents are letting their kids go so why can't I.
I have let her go to a local town on the bus alone but i feel uneasy about a remote spot. There are always lots of swimmers there though.

Am I being over protective?
At what age can i let her go wild swimming with mates unsupervised as it is a lovely thing for kids to do but atm i feel she and her mates are too ditsy/ immature to handle a crisis?

I'd not be happy with this. I live in an area with several rivers and every summer there are at least 1 or 2 deaths. Usually teenagers.

A group of teens, banks that are hard to get out of and no adult supervision isn't a good combination.

Is there any other safer alternative? A specific swimming area, an outdoor lido or something similar? We have a lake with inflatables on it for a swimming obstacle course. It's properly run with life guards etc and a lot of fun for kids. Do you have anything like that?

I think just say yes as long as several adults present.

Wild swimming is lovely but can be dangerous.

You could always see if there is an open water swim location near you as an alternative? There are organised, the water is maintained to healthy levels and there is always a lifeguard present.

www.openwaterswimming.com/

I’m a regular river/lake swimmer (several times a week, year round), and I have taken my children (9, 12). I’m also trained in defensive swimming for my job, and I’ve had Weil’s disease.

My main concerns with river swimming:
1- locate where to get in
2 - locate where to get out
3- locate where to get out at a couple of pints further downstream in case you miss/are washed past your prefered exit point
4 - don’t swim near agricultural fields after rain (contaminated run off). There is only one river swimming spot in England (the Wharfe at Ilkley) where bathing water quality is monitored by the Environmeht Agency, and it’s not good!
5- don’t swim downstream of outfalls or sewage treatment works.
6 - don’t swim in water flows that you cannot swim against for a sustained period of time. The EA has level gauges around rivers in England (NRW in Wales). Google the name of your river and location and, if there is a gauge nearby, gov.uk should bring you up the gauge trace, showing river level and whether it us rising or falling - sometimes also a forecast (not always)
7- Even at this time of year, you can get very cold, very quickly. Stay in for 15 mins max, warm up slowly with layers and a warm drink. Search the videos about this on YouTube by Dr Mike Tipton.
8 - Tow floats are useful for visibility and storing things, especially mobile phones (I always put mine in a Tupperware box first).
9 - the best advice I have ever had. Leave your ego at the edge. I imagine this might be a hard one for teens!

There is also some good advice on the Outdoor Swim Society website.

The fact you feel she and her friends are currently too ditzy/immature to handle a crisis is reason enough that a large group of them should not be going unsupervised to a remote river to swim. I wouldn't put an age on when it might be appropriate for them to go wild swimming without an adult because it would be dependent upon maturity, how reliable others in the group are, how familiar they are with the water, provision/not of lifebelts/rings on the river bank.

I would also want to be sure that the landowner and/or locals were supportive of it as a wild swimming venue for teenagers. Just because there might be others swimming there, doesn't make it safe and if others swimming there have been causing a nuisance, it's possible that local people will be avoiding the area, feel intimidated or may switch off to the noise - even cries for help - as a result. I know of a private lake in Kent where lots of teenagers were dropped off by parents last summer. Others arrived by train and walked the couple of miles to get there. Whilst some teens seemed fairly happy and sensible jumping in and out of the lake, filming one another for TikTok, posing for photos etc., others drank a lot of alcohol, smoked weed and used nitrous oxide on the shore. Some were aggressive when challenged by the landowner and by the farmer of the fields they trampled through to gain access. Some threw glass bottles at anyone who challenged them, a number needed to be rescued from the lake after attempting to swim in it whilst under the influence. Even the perfectly pleasant teenagers I encountered whilst out on the lake (legitimately!) were completely oblivious to the dangers of attempting to swim across the lake, in front of boats that were racing and whose crew couldn't see the swimmers in the water (and weren't expecting them to be there). They had no idea the lake was an old gravel pit which is extremely deep and cold in parts or of the swimming routes used by the open water swimming groups. Very little of the 'wild swimming' was even reasonably safe because of the inexperience, lack of awareness and drugs/alcohol involved. Locals were upset and angry about what was happening and actively avoided the lake so much of the time, the only others who could be called on in the event of an emergency were other, inebriated teenagers.

Teenagers en masse are generally not the best at judging/reducing risk or at keeping within their limits. They can also be fiercely loyal and impulsive sometimes leading to fatal decisions i.e. jumping in to attempt to rescue a friend. If your DD wants to do something water-based with friends for her birthday, perhaps paying for her and a group to go paddleboarding, kayaking or similar might be a compromise. There would be an adult but it wouldn't be a parent.

Correction, it's Plas menai national outdoor centre that's running the sessions.

It's reassuring to see that they are referring to it as simply 'outdoor' swimming. No drama.

My dd probably wouldnt go to such lessons or wear floating aids..am i dping the right thing? Shes upset as everyone else is going apparently.

@malificent7, do you know the other parents? Can you ask them?

I have just texted another mum...awaiting an answer.

Dd goes mental each time i ask other parents...i think this is indicative of other issues

You're definitely doing the right thing. The 'everyone's going apart from me' is a claim most teenagers will make at some point but rarely is it the case. Often it's more likely to be 'everyone whose parent hasn't been given any information/hasn't been directly asked' is going.

Hell no, not at 13 without adult supervision. They’re children. There’s some great advice in the thread about safe swimming but they are just too young and immature to listen to that advice and follow it. It would be very uncool to be seen to be following safety protocols!

There is open water swimming in Salford Quay with some coached sessions if you're anywhere near. Lots of groups too.

There has been a fatality in Cheshire in the last 24 hours.

@malificent7

My dd probably wouldnt go to such lessons or wear floating aids..am i dping the right thing? Shes upset as everyone else is going apparently.

This would worry me.

(I'm a coach, not a parent of teenagers (yet) so slightly different perspective.)

Safety aids are UTTERLY essential. Even if not cool. They save lives.

In the lake I coach at most years there used to be at least 1 rescue a session due to cramp / fatigue etc. Since tow floats have been compulsory (the bag things you tie round your waist) there have been 2 rescues in the last 18 months.

(rescue meaning someone being assisted by the safety team and towed back to - usually due to cramp, fatigue, or panicing after swallowing water).

In rivers it is SO MUCH MORE IMPORTANT. swimmers are barely visible to boats. The flow can vary at different points of the river. The depth varies. having something visible and to hang onto to catch your breath is essential.

There's a lot to be aware of in river swimming , and lots of it only makes sense once contextualised to your specific river spot. Blogs/ videos are amzing, but no substitute to learning while being in the location.

If they're not likely to respect the dangers (most of which can be mitigated) I'd be worried.

And at 13, I'd DEFINTIELY want a parent nearby....

Where I coach - even in the river, for under 16's a parent has to be in the vicinity. not necessarily swimming, but contactable and within a 5 min drive. (often they go to a coffee shop in the local town which borders my bit of river, or enjoy the sunshine).
I reccomend the same even if not a coached session. Have an adult there, and ideally, able to throw a throw rope / intervene if necesary for safety.

(sorry, I thought she was older when I said previous post)

Just checked with other mum... her dd hasn't even asked her and its a definate No from her as she would be worried sick anyway.

Surprise, Surprise

Not. A. Chance. I live in an area where wild swimming is very easy to do. Sadly, over the last few years there have been several teenage drownings. You need to be a very strong and experienced swimmer for it to be in any way safe.

It would be an absolute No from me! A young teenager drowned near us recently in what I would have called a slow river. My dad also nearly died as a child, he only survived because my Aunt managed to pull him out. It is so dangerous when you don't know what you are doing.

It's so tricky as i want them to be able to handle themselves in water but 13 is too young.

@malificent7 I'm not surprised. It's easy to claim everyone's allowed to go before all the parents have been given a chance to say no!

@CrazyNeighbour some of the teens involved in the risky behaviour at the lake I wrote about further up were county/region squad swimmers. I suspect their competitive pool swimming is rather more impressive and safe-looking than their lake swimming. For me, being familiar with the particular hazards of the body of water they are swimming in is as important as technical swimming ability.

Every teenager in the world has friends whose parents let them do everything you say they can’t do - it’s a well known —lie—fact

No way in hell would I let my 13 year old go wild swimming like that. Far too dangerous and puts the awful onus on someone else to attempt a rescue if something went wrong, potentially putting that stranger in danger too.

Too you g and too immature.

Wild swimming requires preparation, planning and preferably someone present with lifeguard training who is willing to be bored rigid watching everyone else have fun.

Her attitude to you in this discussion should tell you all you need to know.

depends on the actual river... around here the rivers, ponds ,are wonderfully infested with unsupervised teens in summer. It doesn't feel remotely dangerous, but rarely more than 5' deep anyway.

@malificent7

Just checked with other mum... her dd hasn't even asked her and its a definate No from her as she would be worried sick anyway.

Having read the whole thread, I am now about to keel over and die from my total and utter lack of surprise at this.

I don’t have a teenager yet, so maybe that colours my view, but it would a hard no from me too.