Went shopping yesterday-we got the mens shirts & trousers, but I cried when we got to the boxer shorts

[Floundering]

.....they are for my 17 year old DD.

My gorgeous sassy funny not so little girl has confided in me that she feels she is a boy trapped in a woman's body. Gender Dysphoria is our new buzz phrase.

Since she told me 10 days ago we've had doctors appointments for me & her, to arrange counselling, talked long and tearfully (both of us) and gone shopping. She wants to cut off her beautiful glossy mane, bind her chest and eventually start hormones. Luckily she favour the baggy shirts & jeans look so no vast difference yet.

I can't bear it.

I'm in a fog, wanting to support her but also wanting to shake some sense into her.

(BTW not bothered about me, but have NC for this I did post a one off post on another thread the night it all happened but forgot to NC & got it pulled so if you saw that please don't out me for her sake. )

Since puberty she has had massive gynae issues, multiple A&E visits and admissions for various operations. Part of me wonders whether she has had such a shit time as a female that subconsciously she feels being male would be easier. But then I wonder if I'm in denial as I can't get my head round it. She says she is sure.

I have been researching transkids and it seems if they get to late teens and are sure then they rarely change back.

I am in so much pain at the thought of what she wants to do & the fact that the poor love is so mentally unhappy she is prepared to do it.

Not sure why I'm posting except I need to find someone who can share their experiences as the mum of a trans kid. I know the technical side of things, I worked on some of the first sex change ops back in the day and that makes things worse in a way.(although I know things have refined since then & yes its waaay down the line)

I'll stop now I'm waffling but please dear nest of vipers if you have any crumb of comfort bung it my way. This will be a long haul whichever way it goes.

Can't find the MN guidebook for this one

[piercedinkedscarred]

You're doing great through such a confusing time Floundering. Huge credit to your DD for donating her hair!

[BigArea]

Hi Floundering I've been wondering how you're getting on now?

[Floundering]

Hi BA

Thanks for checking in, funnily enough I was just logging on to post an update.

She is away with her Dad & siblings visiting family abroad. having a whale of a time & not ringing/skyping home much

I am having a few counselling sessions but really not much to discuss, until she has her CAMHS assessment we won't know how things will pan out.

I have almost forgotten about it all, I have been busy with work & enjoying having the time to myself to flop in the evenings. I am in denial I guess until I have to face up to it all, part of me hopes she comes home feeling better about herself and changes her mind but that's unlikely.

As long as it has helped her have some fun & build her up for the months ahead in terms of self esteem I will be OK.

Hope you are Ok?

[BigArea]

I don't think anyone wants their child to have to walk a more challenging path than the next person, do they? It sounds to me like you are more worried about that than anything else - how it will make her life harder. As you say hopefully the time away will give her some space and she will come home feeling more comfortable whatever direction she goes in, IYSWIM. If she sticks with being he, your support and acceptance will give her such a strong base which will help her enormously. As other posters have said uni is an excellent time to 'find yourself' in this way. I think you're doing really well - although you say you have almost forgotten about it I bet you are processing it all in the back of your mind.

I am well thank you for asking

[mathanxiety]

Any reason her dad isn't involved in the counselling right now?

[Floundering]

Math he doesn't know. This is DD's choice as the moment as it is all so new & she was afraid of spoiling their holiday away with the elephant in the room if she did. (See above )

I personally vacillated about telling him the basics myself, maybe hinting at gender confusion etc but it is not my secret to share & the reality is she would feel I had betrayed her confidence, and not share things with me again, which is important to me right now.

He doesn't "do" counselling anyway & sitting in the same room as me would not be an option he would choose, although I am happy to do it & I would like to think he would for her but we shall see.

[Floundering]

Another week/10 days of solitude before she returns.

I really want to see her & her sister feels like they've been away for aaaaages now! Have a had a few Skype chats to catch up but mostly they'e been too busy which is as it should be.

But part of me is dreading what is to come. So I am eating healthily and enjoying having some time to myself and putting my house in order while I have time to do so.

Feels like preparing for battle!

[BigArea]

Hello there. Sounds like you are being very sensible by looking after yourself at the moment. She has been away for ages! Is it 3 weeks altogether? Keep us updated.

[Floundering]

Hi BA

yes she's been gone over a month, combination of holidays with family & friends.

I'm ready to have them both back now, need my DD cuddles!!!

[NoodleOodle]

Wow, I believe you are doing incredibly well at being a supportive mother. I hope next week goes well for you and that the 'big reveal' with father isn't traumatic - is it likely that he will take it the same way you and your mother have, even though he's not the counselling type?

[Floundering]

ThanksNoodle . We have the CAMHS appt on the 29th and she is planning on telling her Dad after that when she knows what the plan is- he's a great one for rigid planning but it helps him feel in control.

I am hoping his love for his child will transcend his aversion for anything other than the heterosexual norm. My greatest fear is he will reject her, she adores him and it would really shatter her.

She plans to tell him (on her next access day) she has something important to discuss with him, but is unsure of how to say it so she will have written a letter. She says this will give her a chance to get her thoughts down in a logical unemotional way which is easier for her to write & him to process. She will ask him to read it through & then find her while she waits in the next room.

We have talked about how he might react and that if he becomes upset or unpleasant she can walk away, and that it will be him just dealing with his conflicting emotion in the same way I did. If needs be she knows she can say she will talk to him when he has had a chance to think it through and come back to mine.

With any luck he will come up trumps and just hug her & say he loves her whatever. I just wish I could talk to him about this as co-parents and I will try, but previous attempts at discussions have always ended with him shrugging his shoulders & refusing to engage.

[mathanxiety]

There is a huge amount of controlling or attempts to control going on here.

Your ex sounds like a 'difficult' character. How has that impacted your DD(DS)?

[Floundering]

If you mean am I trying to stop my life spinning out of control Math then yes I am. I have made no secret of the fact that I am having some very emotional and at times probably unreasonable reactions, hence my indulging in offloading on here to posters who have been very supportive & reflective. I am processing a lot here.

If you think I am trying to control my daughter then you are very much mistaken, we are both floundering (hence the NN) through a very difficult situation & obviously unchartered territory. But I cannot force her to do anything she doesn't want to or stop her doing what she wants ultimately to make her happy- nor would I want to. That doesn't mean its easy, what you think in theory or with other peoples kids does not apply when its your own.

My ex has been described as "difficult" yes and both our children have learnt to deal with him as they have grown older, they tease him (affectionately) about his almost obsessive need to plan everything down to the last minute detail, spontaneity is not allowed which can be difficult for impulsive teens but they love him and they know he loves them. Hopefully that will be enough.

[BigArea]

Floundering I could be wrong but I read Math's post as meaning the control issues as being around DD and her dad, not you.

[mathanxiety]

No sorry not on your part. On the part of your DD/S and her dad. BigArea is right.

Sorry not to be specific as to who I was talking about.

It is hard to live with someone who dominates. I wondered how this might have affected your DD as a child. Could she always tease her dad even as a child? Or is comfort with teasing a new thing? Do you think she associated femaleness with being dominated? Do you think she has ever felt able to be 'herself' even as a child with a dad who doesn't do spontaneity and needs to have everything planned minutely? Who got to make the plans?

[Floundering]

Thanks BA Sorry Math

I think the telling her Dad thing is a control issue. she feels the time has to be right, they are just finishing a 2 week holiday with him & didn't want there to be an "elephant in the room" whilst away for all concerned.

We've always been a teasing family both Ex I grew up in large families, so taking the piss has been the norm, on all sides. DD/s has a very quick tongue & she and her dad have a close relationship, despite the controlling. Her older sis less so she is growing away from him now she sees how he is with me, as as adult. I taught them from an early age how to stand up for themselves & they are both very big feminists.

When we were together, certainly while they were young his EA wasn't as evident, I made sure plans were made for us all as a family as he was working FT & I was initially a SAHM and we were a partnership parenting wise if not as spouses. Which makes it all the more ad now that the one person I should be able to talk to about our child is him.

[saintlyjimjams]

Hello, not much to add although I just wanted to let you know that after Priscilla this summer someone about to undergo a F2M sex change had a chat with me & ds2. He seemed to have travelled a long road but was very happy to have reached the final stages (having been living as a man for a number of years). When I think of the conversation the thing that strikes me is how happy he was. I hope that helps - in terms of whatever happens/ whatever your dd decides there can be happiness at the end of it xx

[Floundering]

awww Saintly thanks for that- it's what I cling on to, that whatever happens she needs to be happy, and she will be.

Just the process is so painful I suppose you lose sight of that. Once we have an idea of how things are moving forward it will help I always find I'm better once I know what I'm dealing with even if its tough.

[mathanxiety]

I am wondering if your DD/S fears losing her dad as a result of this. Despite the teasing, I am wondering if she really feels confident in her dad's feelings for her.

So far the elephant in the room is her own private elephant -- how nice a holiday can she really have had with all that bottled up inside?

EA is evident to very young children. Sometimes a child will identify with the dominator even if that parent isn't their same sex parent. It makes a child feel safer to be on the side of the dominator. Sometimes there will be internalised contempt for the parent who is getting the thin end of the wedge.

[Floundering]

Yes math I think she does possibly fear this as she fears losing anyone else close to her, so far she hasn't but she has to do what she feels is right to be happy, and we will deal with the consequences.

As far as the holiday goes, I don't know, I think she has bottled it all up for so long that a few more weeks wouldn't actually make a heap of difference & for her it was important not to spoil it for everyone else involved, he is a thoughtful girl.

interesting what you say about the EA I think there is an element of that with her.

[Floundering]

Well the holiday is over, feelings are the same, so onwards.

She wants to start binding her chest & is drafting out her letter to her Dad, we have talked about that & she cried knowing it will be the hardest thing she has ever done & because (in her words" knowing I'm going to turn his world upside down" )

Both looking forward to her CAMHS appt on Tues so we can get some idea of what happens next.

[Floundering]

Well that's something I never thought I'd be doing -helped measure him for his chest bindings last night. Found a service that does made to measure ones in the UK which don't work out much more than the original ones we found in the US.

Have decided to start using him/he in here as well as in RL, we have been practising all w/e, DD1 & I....she seems to be remembering better than I do but DS says I'm doing well despite the inevitable stumbling & slurring over the names as I mentally switch between old name/new name.

Just feel very sad.

Tomorrow we go for assessment with CAMHS- he got very frustrated at the generic pre assessment form, plastered with his female hospital labels, reinforcing how he is still labelled. I tried to explain how it's just a generic form, to help them see how he views himself and give the a heads up on the direction to take the discussion. Also gently warned him that there would be lots of these seemingly pointless forms & questions, it being the NHS & a loooong process. He is being a typically impatient 17 yr old.

[Blu]

OP, you might want to listen to Adjoa Andoh on R4 on Wednesday . She is an actor and writer and has recent supported her teen through F to M .

On the strength of the preview I heard and the blurb on R4 website it sounds a very interesting and uplifting programme.

[BigArea]

Floundering, you are amazing. I have nothing useful to add other than my support and admiration of you. DS and DD are lucky to have you as their mum.