In despair - can't go on

[minifingers]

:-(

Many posts on this board about dd.

She went to stay with my mum and sister for 6 weeks at the start of the academic year after some violent outbursts which ended in us getting the police involved.

Things had been a bit better since she got back, but the last few weeks she has started to become more and more difficult with me again, and started getting into trouble again at school.

The long and short of it is that she is verbally abusive to me pretty much every day at the moment and it's destroying me emotionally to the point where I'm starting to feel ill and unable to function as a parent to my other 2 younger dc's.

This morning she asked me to buy her a McDonalds for breakfast. I said no - there was bacon and eggs, bread, yogurt, porridge, flour for pancakes. I told her to make her own breakfast. This precipitated an hour of verbal abuse - I am tight fisted, poor, pathetic, a loser, friendless, lazy, my work is worthless, nobody likes me, I'm useless to everyone.

I try to detach and ignore, but she will follow me around insulting me.

She bullies me and shouts me down, refuses to comply with any requests, constantly reminds me that she can do what she likes when she like, and there is NOTHING dh and I can do about it. She often tells me to 'shut up', makes obscene comments (in the car on Wednesday she spent 10 minutes telling me how she had sucked 5 men's cocks and fucked 15 boys one after another - all rubbish but just said to disgust and distress me. I am pretty sure she is not having sex with 1 boy, let alone dozens), shoves past me in the hallway of the house.

She shouts at me and abuses me if her uniform isn't ready in the morning (if I haven't remembered to hang it out to dry after it has been through the washer), tells me my cooking is disgusting and that the house is disgusting because I'm lazy and useless. She berates me for not having a full-time job or much money, laughs at me, tries to play DH off against me. Says he could do much better than me and that I should just leave.

The abuse is pretty frequent and almost always starts in response to me saying 'no' to her - no you can't have a sleepover on a school night, no you can't have money for the kebab shop, or if I ask her to do something she doesn't feel like doing eg get up in the morning, do some homework, whatever.

She is aggressive, nasty and disrespectful to some of her teachers at school as well, and is currently facing a possible permanent exclusion for disrespectful and disruptive behaviour.

She has a rationale for it all: apparently I am abusive to her because I let her sleep on a new mattress on the floor for several months (was trying to sort all the children's beds out - new bunk beds for the little ones, and she didn't like her old bed frame as it is old fashioned, so I dismantled it ready for storage). She also until recently had no door on her bedroom - it had come of its hinges after she tried to slam it in DH's face a few months ago and he pushed it. Her room is at the end of a long hallway with no other rooms going off it so she still had some privacy. Plus her window is cracked after his cousin kicked a ball into it - not so that there are holes in it, but the glass is crazed in one of the 4 squares. Also took her curtains down to wash and haven't put them back up (no privacy issues, her room overlooks a private garden) and sometimes condensation goes a bit mouldy on her window frame. None of these things are great but the rest of the upstairs of the house is worse. It's a biggish Edwardian terrace and quite scruffy - there is so much to do that we feel overwhelmed by it. Never the less - her room is decent by the standards of the other bedrooms. We put new laminate flooring in about 2 years ago, all the (sadly single glazed) windows were refurbished 3 years ago

[minifingers]

By the way Artex - I never said that it was unreasonable for DD to complain about the state of her room. I do think its unreasonable though for her to use the state of her room as justification for treating me like the dirt on her shoe ESPECIALLY as both DH and I have acknowledged to her that the door, window pane and curtains need to be sorted but that we are overwhelmed with other chores and expenses at the moment.

[Xmas2013MN6233]

Artex domestic violence is never acceptable, regardless of who is the perpetrator and the impact on the younger DCs cannot be minimised either, its not about writing the girl off, she needs help and the OP walking out wont help her, she will be more out of control

[ivykaty44]

artex - you don't seem to have the answers to stopping this girl from being rude to her teachers to the point she is nearly at the stage of being excluded from school. Hardly blame her behaviour at school on her the state of her bedroom.

[minifingers]

Who's 'writing her off'?

We have tried everything.

We are a loving family pushed beyond what we're able to cope with. That's what this thread is about.

[MumOfTheMoos]

But it's not just one slammed door though, is it, Artex?

My point was that, I suppose, for those who have never experienced it, it seems inconceivable that it can be as bad as it is. I think you have to take Mini's word for it, that it's something more than just a slammed door.

And really, I too can't see what is wrong with putting up your own curtain. When I was 14 I redecorated my own room, all by myself - she's 14 not 4, she has a choice about how to behave.

[RandomMess]

Wondering out loud here - next time she starts on you with the insults what to you think would happen if you calmly/monatonely asked her to write down all her complaints as you don't have to time to take it all in at that moment in time?

Just curious if a completely different response would disarm her tirade or make her kick off more?

[UnexpectedItemInShaggingArea]

Mini, I remember your previous threads. Maryz is giving good information and advice I think. I just came on to post that this is not your fault in any way, I hop you find a way out

[Bahhhhhumbug]

Forgive me for asking but l don't think you have referred to your DH as her dad, just as your DH. Possibly irrelevant but is he her dad or stepdad?

[bringbacksideburns]

FFS. Unhelpful shitty smug comments help no one. Never heard a slammed door, writing off a teen?? That's not how i'm reading it. Fixating over a room and ignoring the crux?

It really is not helpful when people say things like that, unless it makes them feel better in some ways.

Hope you get the help and support for you all and her OP.

[custardo]

she stated he was her dad
minifingers Sat 14-Dec-13 21:17:49

[custardo]

i wouldn't wait for a referral to social services i would phone them up and tell them that you want her removed.

force action

the other thing i would do is give her a hug and tell her i love her

do both

[Bahhhhhumbug]

Oh right sorry, as you were!

I agree with those who say try not to give her the reaction she wants or expects but l also worry that might make her more angry short term.
When l am feeling really pissed off with somebody and want to have it out with them l find nothing more ups the ante quite like someone smiling sweetly at me and refusing to be drawn in. But then again long term it might work.

[FunnyFestiveTableRunner]

I thought that too earlier in the thread bah it wasn't clear from the original OP but Mini clarified.

Really mini I think you need to listen to the people who have been through this and use what they have learned. And for all of you with very challenging teens.

[TheGhostOfPortoPast]

I would tell her you love her.
Apologise for prioritising the younger ones.
Sort her room out so that it is somewhere suitable she can feel she can bring her friends.
Tell her very firmly that you will not be putting up with the behaviour any more. She is crying OUT for attention that you are not giving her Everything is negative.

[looknow]

This was one of my siblings many years ago. My dsis and I had our lives made hell by my db. He targeted my dm, very much like mini's dd does.

It damaged me immensely and I still resent to this day how his behaviour affected me and how that was ignored then and now.

From watching this unfold with the benefit of hindsight I would share what My analysis of the situation in my house was.

My db used my mum as his focus because she was safe and he knew she had seemingly limitless unconditional love for him. She also reacted, got upset and that seemed to satisfy him. I think he was deeply unhappy and projected that on to her. She was safe and she provided a reaction for his anger.

If that insight helps, and I hope it does, it might help to get to the bottom of all this anger that she is directing at you. I would hazard a guess that the anger stems from something or someone else.

Please don't underestimate the negative affect on her siblings who see her anger, breaking the rules and getting away with it. Years and years of coming last to my db tantrums, him spoiling all days out, treats and special days out. Not being allowed to have friends round and my whole childhood overshadowed by his bullshit selfishness has left me deeply damaged.

Put your other children first. Tell her you love her +++ but until she communicates her troubles to you effectively and appropriately you are done. Final. Full stop

Give her a date when you and her will spend x amount of hours together away from the house to spend special time and she can choose to discuss her life problems or not. But that is her last chance. You will dedicate that time for her and her alone.

Now is the time to look after her siblings, you are sorry if that offends. But tough shit. Enough is enough.

Good luck.

[minifingers]

She is given love and hugs and kisses. She has friends around. Including for sleepovers. Really the worst thing about her room is the fact that ALL her clothes are on the floor because she won't put them away. She's not neglected - emotionally or otherwise.

[Hohohowhatfuckeryitis]

Mini, my heart goes out to you. But remember, it is your home, your family, your dh, so why should you leave. Listen to those who have been through this, you have done your best. See her pastoral head of year, see your doctor, contact ss, say you are in fear of her. This situation is NOT sustainable, you are already suffering from stress and anxiety. Involve every agency you can, including police.

[RandomMess]

and hugs

[Xmas2013MN6233]

looknow is I think correct, I have seen a therapist and she said the same about mothers and conditionless love, she also said that even understanding a behaviour does not make it acceptable.

[theladyrainy]

I think the OP and her dd are well past the sit down and listen to the rules stage here.

I agree that op's dd seems to feel unloved. That doesn't mean that she is unloved, but it is her perception.

OP youngminds is a really good website. They will phone you back and do a confidential online consultation with you. dd may find it helpful to have a look through the site as well if she's willing.

Also go back to your GP and insist on a re-referral to CAMHS.

[theladyrainy]

youngminds

[Beastofburden]

Having read previous threads about this family, I think the OP is way ahead of all those who are suggesting more love and understanding. Been there, done that. It sounds on the few facts we have as if this child has something serious wrong, such as oppositional defiance disorder.

She has been given time out with her grandmother, but is now escalating this to demand that the mother should leave the home.

OP, I can understand that your self esteem is at rock bottom. But the younger children do not deserve to be forced from their home over this. They will learn a terrible lesson about reward of bullying and the insecurity of being a good decent person. They are behaving well, but they are suffering, while the 14 year old behaves appallingly and gets what she wants. I was very struck by that post from a sibling of a similar child, saying how awful it was for her.

Time for her to see that she does not have the option to force you out. Time to call her bluff and say, OK, you hate me, you can be brought up elsewhere then. Time for foster care, for the sake of the other children, as well as for you.

If things improve, she can always come home again.