How can I help my suicidal teen?

[Janstar]

My DD1 (almost 14) took an overdose a few weeks ago. She spent 3 days in hospital and is fully recovered physically but still depressed.

Her depression stems (I think) from a number of things. The main one is her dad. We split when she was 4 and she used to see him regularly. But last Sept she told me he had a porno business on the internet. She had known for 2 years and discovered this when he sent her emails - accidentally or on purpose we do not know.

Subsequently we stopped both daughters from seeing him. He took us to court and last week we finally reached the end of the legal process with contact being denied. This is what she wanted, but she does not seem to accept that grief is a natural part of this.

She has been under a great deal of stress for various other reason recently - looking after me and DD2 and DS when I broke my leg in January, and various arguments with her friends. Eventually she developed a tendency to faint and vomit so often that she missed a lot of school. We went through all the medical checks with the GP and she was referred to a paediatrician. Before the appointment came up she took the overdose. Subsequently she saw the paediactrician and also a psychiatrist. Both recommended psychotherapy but she refuses to participate.

I have tried and tried to get her to talk to me but I think she just can't. I don't want to force her to a therapist as I was advised that it might do more harm than good. But I feel helpless because I don't have the training to know how to get her started with talking to me.

She bumbles along as best she can but I often find her crying. She can never explain why. We try to include lots of fun things in our life. She gets out quite a bit, with us and her friends. She helps at home and we do lots of things together.

Her physical symptoms have disappeared since the overdose but now she is suffering with sleeplessness.

I have a history of depression myself although I am over it now. But I really do understand and sympathise with her. However, I found talking was what I needed to do to heal. This evidently isn't something she is ready for, but I don't really know how to help her. I am terrified that she will try to take her own life again. Any advice or ideas would be gratefully received.

Actually I'm okay, I'm getting so used to crises now I am a bit hardened off to it. On auto pilot.

I just want my little girl to feel more valuable than this. She is beautiful and clever and kind, but she sees something different when she looks in the mirror.

We did not force her to counselling as we were advised that it might do more harm than good. But in the light of this development we may have to force her to go. I'm just terrified that the pressure of being forced into it will make her feel suicidal again.

Janstar I think you may have to take her as you said it is one crisis after another.

Could she be rebelling against the situation with her dad as he was into running internet porn ( please corrcet me if I am wrong) Could she maybe feeling closer to him if she engages in that sort of activity? These questions are just thoughts on a whole as to me it seems she is very confused about her disinvolvement her with dad. Could she be feeling guilty now because she refuses to see him?

Wow, Janstar, she really is acting out, isn't she?

Maybe you can be (somewhat) grateful it's virtual sex and not real sex?

She sounds angry to me. Why would she be so angry? Very frustrated in life?

Janstar - I really feel for you. Getting to what is behind the depression is a tricky one, but dealing with some of the symptoms is maybe easier.

Exercise as a treatment for depression is as helpful or more so than medication - that's what a lot of recent studies have shown.

I think that regular exercise will improve her sleep and general physical health, and promote relaxation and a positive self image. Is your dd getting a lot of exercise anyway?

IMO routines and discipline help children to feel secure and loved, so I wouldn't try to bend too many rules for her all the time. Being there to listen means listening at the time she wants to talk rather than when you wnat to listen, so watching for the opportunity is important, but it is very possible that your dd will not want to give the role of listener to you anyway.

Having an adult to talk to who is not a parent is a valuable resource for any teenager, so if there is anything you can do to engineer this then do it! Doesn't need to be someone geographically close necessarily - my own soneone was my aunt, hundreds of miles away.

Good luck, you will all come through this
Scoobysnax
xxx

Believe me, I am grateful it is only virtual. At least these men (boys?) don't know where she is or anything. And she has not been actually touched.

But how self-destructive and self-hating this practice is. She seems to be trying to damage herself. Guilt comes into it, I am sure, although she has been reassured countless times that what happened with her father was not her fault, I think she can't accept that. She is very insular and it is often like trying to get blood out of a stone to try and get her to talk.

I might get a clearer idea of whether or not she felt a release by doing this once I have talked to her. I am waiting to gather my thoughts and read some advice first.

She is definitely confused about the whole issue of sex. She has often complained about a babysitter we used to have, an older teenage girl, because she sometimes used to surf the satellite TV and peek at the freeviews on the porn channels. DD professed to be utterly disgusted about this. We just said it was pretty normal to be curious. She has also expressed disgust at her father's behaviour. It all points to her being terribly confused and possibly can't even understand her own behaviour.

Thanks scooby. She doesn't do a lot of exercise, she does a lot of teenage larding. The fact that I have cartilage damage after breaking my ankle months ago means that I cannot take her to tennis and squash as I used to. I must try and offer something she can attend without me.

We've just spent a few days at the seaside with a friend who I thought might be the one she could talk to. She was beginning to open up, I thought, and was very taken with my friend, so I'm hoping things will develop there.

This may be completely wrong for you, but suppose you just made the appointment for her with a counsellor/specialist psychologist & took her there, waited and took her home again. No 'forcing', just "I've made you an appointment'. After all, she is still very much a child despite her behaviour and maybe you have to treat it like getting her to see any other kind of dr when she is ill, which she clearly is. After all, you wouldn't just let her choose to see, say a cancer specialist and she's already shown you her condition is life threatening. Maybe she wants you to 'make' her do this as the decision is too big and scary to make alone? I would suggest a female therapist personally (though I'm no expert) as her male/female relationships seem to be problematic due to her awful dad and his horrible business. I was depressed as a teenager and low self esteem etc is so common, but the suicide attempt puts your daughter's issues into a different bracket IMO. Don't want to put any more pressure on you at all and think you are an amazing mum, am just worried about you both. Have you got any support?

It was the psychiatrists themselves who advised me not to force her. But I think this behaviour puts a different light on it.

I'm not too badly off for support. My DH is great. I have three close girlfriends who are always ready to listen - and they are all good mums with lots of experience. I miss seeing them enough though cos they are too far to just pop in. My sister is great also but too far away. And you mums on mumsnet are fabulous also. I can only attribute all this support to the way I am managing to cope without relapsing into my old depressions. Thanks.

I'm glad someone's looking after you! Surely it wouldn't hurt to make an appointment? No suggesting you drag her there kicking and screaming or anything, just wondered if she might secretly be relieved if it was presented as a fait accompli and she could feel that if she went once you wouldn't push her into more than she could cope with? Maybe?

Janstar, sorry to hear about this latest development. No advice but just wanted to say I'm thinking of you.

janstar just read your page, i am so sorry you are going through this.

I am a social worker/counseller gave it all up a year ago, but 14 is a very delicate age they want to be and adult but they are still very much a child, as the others have said she is angry but i do think at her dad who had introduced her all this it seems.

Have you spoken to social services? please don't belive all the hipe, they try and bring families together at least my team did, but she need to open up and talk to someone and i found with my young people stranger work, they are non judgemental. I know you want her to talk to you but she may say things that will alarm you. Lots of hugs a support thats all you can give and let her know you are there. Also if you go through your local Tompson Local or Yellow advertiser they will tell you what help there is for teenager in your area or let me know can find out for you. Have you spoken to the Nspcc, they can over great advice, over the phone too.

Hope this helps take care thinking of you love slink

Janster, I agree with sobernow about this being a way to get a temporary confidence boost. Personally, I feel this is a 'safe' way of exploring something that she is rightfully confused about.

Not helpful from your point of view though. PLEASE don't force her to go to counselling if she's not ready. You will only alienate her. I know, I've been there. I was lucky that the psychologist was very patient and understanding. Initially I didn't get out of the car. Gradually they got me into the hospital, then into the psych's office, but I wouldn't speak. Eventually I was prepared to speak to him and he was great - he didn't push anything, and he was on my side. Up until then I'd felt like it was 'them and me' but he was the first 'expert' who showed me that he was on my side, and he fought my side of the battle and without him being the way he way I really don't know where I'd be now, or even if I'd actually be here.

Please don't push her. I really think that could potentially do huge amounts of damage. You also need to be sure the person you see is sympathetic to the situation (one so called 'family counsellor' accused my father of child abuse and caused problems with my sister as well), and good at their job.

I'm really sorry for what you're going through.

To update all you kind people...I did confront her yesterday with what I know and she was so embarrassed. I told her how I wanted her to wait till she was older for a sexual relationship with someone she had got to know and love. I said the things I thought she needed to hear. She still refused to talk to me.

So I took up the advice of a good friend and I made her talk. I spent an hour talking to this friend on the phone while dd1 followed me from room to room trying to eavesdrop. After I finished she demanded to know what had been said. I refused to tell her. I said, when you talk to me, I will tell you.

I told her I was here for her but I was not going to wait sitting in her room while silence continued for hour after hour. She could come and get me when she was ready to talk and then I would tell her what my friend had said.

Like magic she began to try and talk. It was hard at first and she asked me to help, so I asked a few searching questions to get her going. Before too long she had revealed several things from years back which had been hurting her. It is only a beginning but the first time she had shown any willingness whatsoever to talk.

She even admitted that she felt better after talking and I said that as long as she continued to try I would not force her to go and see a professional. Now I have to go because she is crying again and I have to see if she wants to talk some more!

Janstar, have just read this thread and although I don't have anything helpful to add to the other posts - just to say glad to hear she is talking to you. At the risk of stating the obvious 14 is such a delicate age and I really feel for you, sounds like you may be making progress though.

LOL

Janstar, this sounds like a really good start.

Janstar, you have an apt name. What a star mother you sound. Good luck to you and your dd, I hope the talking continues.

So glad she's talking to you. I think at that age kids are often secretly relieved when a parent takes control, because inside they feel like a scared child even if they are presenting an adult image to the world. It's a wonderful start.

Message withdrawn

janstar ... I can't begin to imagine all you must be feeling, and your dd too. Just a suggestion which worked for me but you must decide would be useful or not for your dd ...

Ask your dd to write a list of all the things that are troubling her .. past, present and future. Then divide them into things she can do something about and things she can't. Then choose one of the things she can do something about and do it. She doesn't have to show the list to anyone, but writing things down often really clarifies what the problems are and focuses. Also like the idea of a diary.

Well done, for allowing her to open up a bit. And do contact that helpline that Aloha posted. Presumably the health services are keeping her under some kind of observation. Haven't they been able to suggest some support groups for you and (eventually, possibly) her?

Janstar I really wish I could help, you seem like such a wonderful caring mum, I wish I had one liek you rather than my stepmonster!!

I think what you are doing is great - let her do it in her time - explain to her the dangers of what she is doing on the internet and that she will probably look back and feel tarnished by what she is done and there are far nicer things that will make her feel nice about herself - can you get out for the day and maybe go to a spa and have pedicures and stuff, maybe get her haircut by a great hairdresser - make her feel beautiful and special - seems really simple but it might work.

When I was depressed as a teen and doing all the self harming and stuff it was because I felt that no one would actually understand what I was going through - I did have a thought a while back that maybe you should sit down withher and tell her how her father's 'business'made you feel, not slate him, just point out why you were hurt - seems like she has been in a very confused household for a while and maybe she is not sure how she is supossed to feel - you saying you felt like this and was sad and depressed and they are normal feelings may help. Don't let her off the hook with regard to her bad behaviour, just tell her you understand and it is normal.

This will probably not help at all but I am sending you both big hugs and hope things start to improve still further!! xx

If your daughter's a bit of an internet girl, how about emailing the Samaritans - [email protected] - totally anonymous - she wouldn't even have to speak on a phone.

It's so encouraging to hear she's opening up to you. If she knows that nothing will shock you or separate you from her then she'll feel safe to come to you.

How about a padlocked diary as a present?

janstar glad that things are looking on the up, you are a star you hang in ther she needs you loads

love slink