M&S - it's over

[Floisme]

I've been known to defend M&S on here but if this is their attitude they can fuck right off.

www.theguardian.com/business/2017/nov/05/not-just-for-over-55s-ms-chairman-says-chain-needs-younger-clothing

Because of course the over 55s just loved The Pink Dress. And all that yellow. We can't get enough of it.

No, Mr Norman, you haven't been 'buying too much for the over 55 customer'. What you've been buying, is too much shite.

I had a skirt very like that in 1975 (can date it by the boyfriend I had at the time!). Wore it with a cheesecloth gypsy top and bangles. Lots of bangles. What can I say? I was young.

Oops, sorry, missed a page. I meant the petrol velvet midi.

The photo is terrible, I came on it from a Try Tuesday recommendation. To be fair it is the most 'fast fashion' item I bought this autumn, everything else I've bought since August is navy (apart from one yellow skinny belt) and I'm wearing it every weekend since I think it won't last till next year. But it's fun.

Did you know that Per Una was started as a joint venture between M & S and Next? M & S bought the brand in 2004.

I didn't know that about per Una. I got a lovely denim skirt when the brand was new.

I'm scratching my head about the burkini goadyfuckery.

Something has changed this season as I’ve bought quite a bit after many seasons of buying nothing beyond tights. Apart from the weird mustard most of the colours are bang on when you compare with Hobbs, Phase Eight, JL etc. The styles are still a bit hit and miss but there is a lot more wearable stuff. Even in Per Una which really shocked me.

I agree with all the PPs that have talked about good basics but they also need to sort out their brands and start putting similar stuff in one place, don’t make me hunt for a top in 10 different places.

I’m 45 by the way.

"but they also need to sort out their brands and start putting similar stuff in one place, don’t make me hunt for a top in 10 different places."

I agree. If I want some new trousers I want to go where all the trousers are. All the lingerie, footwear and nightwear is in the same place, so why not do the same with the rest of the clothes? I am not brand loyal, so separating clothes by brand doesn't work for me.

It would take more than one to make a stand flo. It would be too risky for just one.

Thing is, you couldn't save up for something now. By the time you had the money the jumper would be long gone. I remember the time I noticed this happen. I went back to New Look (so not a hundred years ago) to buy a top I had seen a couple of weeks before pay day.
It and everything on display with it had been replaced.
It wasn't a winter/spring thing. It was in the middle of a season.

If we see something we have to get it. Hence those ridiculous 'Last Chance' rails in shops now.

Kim Winser (Winser London) was brilliant at M&S and has done great things for Pringle and Aquascutum in her time there. I interviewed her for M&S annual report one year and I think what worked in her favour was that she was entirely her customer: she wasn't super model size or shape and I believe she is a single parent, so she got what most women want from clothing... and that is some style, some fun or joy if you follow Kondo, coupled with the colours that work for most of life, and that can go in the washing machine without needing more than common sense. As someone almost said upthread, "if and when I want to accessorize or embellish my basics, I want to do it with MY choice of jewellery or scarf -- I don't want to have it fixed in place."

Oh I hate all that 'last chance' stuff and the way they only stock things for a few weeks. TK Maxx are the kings of it but I believe it was Zara, who M&S want to emulate, who started it all.

WhatToDoAboutThis2017

I don't see the problem with the article. He's right; they do need to attract the younger customer.

I disagree. The main problem is he isn’t attracting enough customers of any age - if they were selling well to their previously loyal older customers sales figures would be fine and he wouldn’t give two hoots about younger ones. The problem is that women in general don’t want to buy what he is selling, and he’s demonstrated that you can’t trade on loyalty if you start dishing out rubbish.
Although if he did start targeting younger customers, providing the quality was reasonable he might provide something I wanted to buy, and I’m over 60.
He could always start by reading this thread - presumably someone in management at M & S must be on Mumsnet?

I did find the Burkini thing a little odd this Summer, But apparently very much older ladies quite like them (I’m talking 75+).

I’m a very young MNetter and I love classic style and good quality. M&S is my go-to place usually. I like their basic stuff, but as of late their sizing has been incredibly odd.

I cannot stand the style of clothing presented to me at the likes of TopShop etc... M&S and Monsoon are for me.

But M&S seem to be doing a bit too much colour too

I like the White Company for things, but they are incredibly expensive and usually above budget

I think it is seen as disloyal at management level to in any way criticise M & S. A family member was a senior buyer. Not woman’s wear. I think they lack someone in woman’s wear with a “good eye”. The new CEO was right to ask about the mustard coloured clothes, who wants them, ditto petrol blue and maroon (not burgundy). These colours are well known in the industry for not selling. The furniture and homewear buyers are good. Menswear is a bit lost I went to buy some soft loungewear for DH yesterday and walked out with a some black sports socks for him. That was it and one single pair of knickers for me cos I have managed to lose part of a set. No Christmas presents were purchased, gifts for new baby in family or anything else.

Windsmoor is a company that does the sort of clothes that would sell. M&S should collaborate with them for coats and tailored pieces for women. Especially work and office clothes. Please get rid of all the garish Halloween frocks. We don’t want this on a night out.

Agree with so much of this. M&S is like a Department store and I cannot be arsed with Dept stores. Out the skirts together and the jumpers together and so on.

I am 48 and the only things I buy there now are underwear and shoes, and underwear for DCs and DH

I disagree with him totally - they need to attract the sort of women who want better quality than Next, and like shops such and Hobbs and Cos

... Oh, and I also shopped in M&S when I was in my teens, 20s and thirties; but not because their styles were particularly 'young' (I would go to Dorothy Perkins or River Island for that). They lost me when they started trying to compete with cheap, garish fashion stuff

I genuinely think they need to ditch womanswear. Its just not for them. Menswear, kids clothing, food and homeware and some pants and tights and ladies nightwear. Now that would be a good use of their retail space.

AJP

I think maybe you are right

People have just lost interest in their womenswear

I hope as well someone at M&S reads this.
I definitely agree about grouping clothing together. A shirt section would be good, with a good quality basics range in cotton and plain colours, black, white, navy, then they could add a few more fashiony ones which change with the seasons.They needn't cost a fortune.

I work and I have small children. I need to look smart but I don't have the time to traipse around looking at masses of clothing all day. I would be perfectly happy to pay a bit more for a pair of trousers if I knew they would last, fit well and were in a nice fabric.

M&S could have come on any thread in the last 5 years and read that their layout, stock levels and colour schemes were a problem. It seems they only sit up and listen when a business man says so.

There was an article on R4 Today this morning about the significant slowdown in retail sales, especially clothing. There are regularly threads on here where people bemoan the lack of clothing they actually want to buy in the shops. I often come home empty handed because I need a larger size, long length trousers and I’m not interested in sweaty polyester. It’s been skim pickings out there for me for about the last 5 years. I’m seriously contemplating a major diet so I can get back into all the good quality smaller tailored basics hanging in my spare bedroom wardrobe. Even if I was a standard size 14/16 now, I’m still not seeing garments I’d want to buy in the shops. It’s all unremitting shite.

I did find the Burkini thing a little odd this Summer, But apparently very much older ladies quite like them (I’m talking 75+)

Isn't that the whole point. The demographic they aim their clothes at is 75+ not 55+. Although dmil 95 has complained their styles have gone to pot. Even she has ridiculed their frills and florals on everything.

I looked at the night dress on the other page. I am just under 60. The only night wear I have ever worn was one I wore in hospital after giving birth. I would hate to wear that item even as a dress it has long sleeves and a collar that would annoy me. In the review it even said it was not suitable for short people like me.
Given us oldies are in general shorter than younger people why design something aimed at older people but too long for them to wear.

I went into my local (not very large) MnS this week looking for trousers and tops and there was just nothing worth a second look. Too many ranges all fragmented. Store far too hard to navigate.Rows of boring polyester trousers or sequined party clothes. I just wanted plain long sleeved t shirts - but not crew neck - and everyday trousers, but not blue jeans. Was that really such a big ask? And I'm in the despised demographic.
I ended up buying 2 boxes of 1/2 price chocs as compensation! now that was worth the visit.