OK. Define 'mutton'.

[AFierceBadRabbit]

Because I just don't get it, unless we're talking a 60 yr old wearing a mini bodycon dress with low neckline?
'Booty' shorts on the over 50's?

If you have the figure who really cares?

Isn't it just another way of looking down on someone - similar to having so-called 'chavvy' tastes?

Or is it a deeply ingrained fear of shocking someone from the front after tempting them from behind?

I think it is a derogatory term that I can't imagine ever using against myself. Why do women even engage in this?

I once saw a woman in her late 40s wearing tight faded ripped jeans, high heels and a tight white t-shirt which was pretty much see-through. She absolutely had the figure and the looks for it, but she was wearing it in an investment bank.

She would have looked great out and about. In the workplace? Not so much. People were saying 'mutton' which I disagreed with, it was more that her clothes were inappropriate in that environment.

It is used solely to make her ashamed of being older.

Oh and the phrase comes from a member of the royal family, some prince eons ago who said he didn't like "girls " he liked mutton, but mutton dressed as lamb.

The phrase is also often used by woman about themselves,,,i.e. Is this dress ok I don't want to like mutton dressed as lamb. In fact there's a thread running at the moment where a woman is asking just that about a dress she likes.

Ah well, as long as it was a prince comparing women to meat then that's ok.

I don't think it's a coincidence that this thread is running alongside the other one incidentally....

I also didn't mean "past its best" in the sense of being off but because lamb is traditionally the more highly prized and expensive version of sheep.

Jesus Christ.

It's not 'women as meat' it's 'people trying to look younger than they are' to describe something older masquerading as something younger.

It has become more of a phrase used against women, but it's hardly likening women to a lump of meat.

That's exactly what it's doing.

Butchers used to try and pass off mutton - older meat - as lamb because younger meat fetches a higher price on the market.

It's about as raw as misogyny can get.

Here's a useful list of clothing suitable for the over 30s

warningcurvesahead.com/2016/06/04/24-things-women-over-30-should-wear/

It is though.
It implies a level of trickery. Lamb is tender and juicy compared to tough stringy old mutton. Who wants to be fobbed of with the inferior version.
As pp said above it is a symptom

i really dont agree with the trickery thing.
at all.

i would bet that the majority of women who dress in 'younger' clothes (whatever they actually are) either want to enjoy themselves, feel good about themselves or feel sexy.

Who dresses to trick people?

kr1stina I love that so much.

I think the phrase is derogatory but usually tight fitting clothes that show a lot of flesh off, cleavage and so on, is traditionally worn by younger women to show off their bodies to attract a mate. By middle age and older, it's more unusual to see as the matching has generally taken place and children might have been had, so there would be no particular biological need to show it all off. I think it's innate biology in us that makes it look wrong to some eyes, rather than being misogynistic or scornful.

I have seen older ladies wear bodycon dresses and look amazing but they also tend to be wearing opaque tights and/or a higher neckline. I think it's the presentation of flesh typically sexual in nature (boobs, bum, thighs) that raises the eyebrows more than the actual fashion.

It's wearing teenage type fashions when you are nowhere near that age any more. Just because some older woman can get into the clothes does not mean they are appropriate. I see quite a bit of it and it makes me want to stare open-mouthed.

I'd rather be described as mutton than mumsy, frumpy or dowdy any day if he week! My worst fear is aging before my time. All because I'm a mum doesn't mean I need to don a fleece and start buying my shoes from Hotter shoes!

It's wearing teenage type fashions when you are nowhere near that age any more. Just because some older woman can get into the clothes does not mean they are appropriate. I see quite a bit of it and it makes me want to stare open-mouthed.

Such as?

Why are they appropriate for teenagers and not older women?
How about younger women?

The more I think about it, the more I agree this is actually about dressing in a provocative manner rather than a "young" one. I don't think that people tend to make comments like this about women who wear casual clothes that a younger woman might wear. I just don't like it. It feels like putting someone in their place based on an arbitrary set of undefined rules and it's one of the reasons a lot of us aren't confident in what how we look and ask "am I too old for this?"

I don't understand why we're discussing this phrase as if it's only about older women.

Hell I'm normally one of the first to kick off about the ageism on here but do young women seriously think it's ok because they're only being compared to lamb rather than mutton?

Surely it demeans us all?

That article is fab. Some amazing looks there.

I hate the term.

Fashion for teens is for teens. My point is that just because you are thin and get into the clothes, it doesn't mean the effect is the same. Older thin bodies have a different shape. It looks a bit sad to see older women dressing in ripped jeans, for instance! I think really the "mutton" expression is directed more at women wearing something that makes them look faintly ridiculous. It's not about having flesh on display.

Define fashion for teens.

I wouldn't wear ripped jeans for work (well more formal occasions at work, nobody cares where I work) as an adult, nor would I as a teenager for anything more formal. But day to day, what is the exact problem with an adult wearing ripped jeans?

Their knees are more saggy and knobbly?

So, older women can't show their knees because they're not pristine? Should they also cover their faces?

I see young people looking ridiculous and wearing unflattering outfits every day of the week. I don't feel any need to pass comment because they're just having fun with their clothes.

This is all fashion is: a bit of fun. The worst that happens is that sometimes we get it wrong.

I believe fashion is for everyone, not just the young and smooth of knee. We're all entitled to enjoy it and part of that enjoyment is experimenting and sometimes making mistakes.

If someone of any age looks ridiculous in an outfit (very subjective) so be it.

No need to call them 'mutton' which is a sexist remark usually aimed at 'older' women wearing things that 'others' feel should be worn by someone 'younger'.

It is ageist and sexist and completely unnecessary yet insidious in our society. We're so used to putting ourselves (as women) down sadly.

Define "teenage fashion" though. It's going back to the implications of "tarty and revealing".

I have a teenager. She wears skinny or boyfriend jeans, fitted T-shirts, checked shirts, jumpers, DMs, Converse and trainers. She shops in Pull & Bear, H&M, New Look and Primark. Nothing she wears would look any different on me or on my 70 year old mother.