Any child psychologists or child experts that can help me and DP support his daughter with becoming a sibling?

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Hello,

Just wondered if anyone with a background in child psychology, or even supporting children through trauma, could advise on how to handle this….

Recently my 11 year old DSD was told about my pregnancy (I’m almost 18 weeks now). Her dad told her when they were hanging out, I was in the bedroom room tidying, sorting washing etc. She didn’t take it well: she got extremely upset and angry. Shouted that she didn’t have a dad anymore, and so on. She went back to her mums. She then didn’t talk to her dad (or me) for about five days and didn’t go to school that week (one day was the teacher’s strike to be fair). She said she wanted to kill the baby, and/or herself. Later her dad went round to try and reconcile and it sort of worked (to an extent). I then saw her soon after that, and she was so-so with me, not unfriendly (general chit chat etc.)

Then for half term break my partner took her skiing as planned and she went to ski school for five days. They had a great time and it felt like a bit of progress was made. She was curious, asking questions, but at the same time starting to make demands about how her brother will be raised.

Since they’ve been back it’s been up and down. Sometimes she’s curious and interested and asks her dad to share the pics of the scan to her friends. That’s really nice. She refused to go to her swimming lesson the other night, saying she was tired, she had done her ballet class the night before, but then wouldn’t go to bed until just before midnight. Other times asks me quite loaded/ spikey questions like “how many women die in child birth each year?” “How many babies die in Labour?” “Will he be disabled?” (I’m quite sensitive to this question because my brother has autism which is very profound). That’s fine, I’m the adult so I can deal with this.

What I’m really struggling with though is her demands about what we call and how we raise the baby, this aspect is difficult to deal with for me. Ok maybe I’m too thin skinned and I should thoughen up, I accept that…She sent a message to her dad, before blocking him(?):

Rules for boy that MUST be followed, or else I’ll commit suicide:

1. Not having an xx name (a name specific to my partner’s native country)
2. Not learning xx (the language of my partner’s country - she speaks this language and wants to maintain an exclusive “secret language” with her dad)

3. Not boning [sic] with father (she means bonding)

4. The ring doorbell has to be connect to my phone (my note: I have no idea what this one is about)

5. I always have to keep first place

AND [my name here] HAS TO AGREE TO THIS OR I WILL KILL MYSELF.

She’s also said on another occasion her brother can’t learn violin or piano, the instruments she learns (actually she’s given up the piano now - but I used to play the violin and was very good at it, grade 8, so makes sense if my son picks it up too, and his dad plays the piano so I would imagine he could be quite musical, if that’s what he wants).

I know why she feels this way - I am understanding and empathetic as I can be to her given this seismic change and her world being turned upside down, she has no other siblings and is used to her life being the way it is and doesn’t want it to change - so not looking for explanations, just wondered what I can practically do to support her: listen, try to understand and validate how she feels without going too far the other way. I know my partner and I need to think long term, big picture etc. but I don’t want to be emotionally blackmailed by an 11 year old. Also, I don’t want to come across as trivial, but choosing a name is quite important to me, I don’t want it to be an ordeal (ok, ordeal is slightly hyperbolic, but you probably know what I mean). Pregnancy itself is already a lot.

I know we need to tread very carefully for a peaceful resolution that everyone is happy with. Any child psychology experts, or people that work with children that can weigh in and advise?

Also for a bit of background, I’ve been with my partner since the start of 2021, we struck up a connection in 2020 (covid year) and he split from his ex wife in 2019, but their marriage was troubled and mired in conflict (so I’ve been told by only one party). I think his exW then regretted pushing for the divorce (be careful what you wish for I suppose). Things have moved fast so this is probably contributing to DSD’s general anxiety. I was introduced to her in Nov 2021 and we got on well form the beginning, she embraced me and we enjoyed spending time together (holidays, family weddings, weekends where we go out for food, etc.)

Thank you

PS in preparation for becoming a parent myself I’m reading lots of parenting books to set myself up for motherhood and to learn how to be a good / decent step parent :

• The book you wish your parents had read…
• How to talk so kids will listen and listen so kids will talk
• Parenting for dummies
• First time parent

Honestly, she's 10. She has no grasp that killing herself would be permanent, etc. She's telling you she's upset and it's just highlighting that she's a child.

She's having her life disrupted. She's already got to cope with sharing her Dad with another woman. You met her for the second time on her 10th birthday, so she didn't even get to have her birthday with just Dad. Now, just over a year later, you're pregnant. I don't think it's unreasonable at all that she's finding that a bit fast! I think everyone needs to accept that she's gone from Dad to 'Dad, plus step mum, plus sibling' in just over a year. That's a lot to deal with.

Give her time and let her be angry.

I’m going to go against the grain slightly. I think that we are too quick to jump to the need for therapy when actually what needs to happen is that a child needs to be parented.

What consequences were there for saying she wanted to cut her friend with a knife for instance? Because if that had been my child that would have been party over and she would have lost privileges.

It seems clear that all she has to do is throw a tantrum and the adults are so afraid of that that they give in to her, and as she’s got older, her emotional manipulation has escalated.

Her parents need to put their foot down. She’s not the centre of the universe, she doesn’t get to call the shots, and she needs to be told that if A, she threatens to do people harm she could go to prison at her age, and if she threatens suicide it will be considered she’s not safe and she may have to stay in hospital for a while.

This behaviour seems to me the result of bad parenting, and tbh OP I would take heed, because the man that is failing to parent this child will soon be parenting your child.

Being upset about the arrival of a sibling is one thing, threatening suicide if your demands aren’t met is quite another.

You need family therapy and to take advice from an expert about how to navigate all these issues. Her reaction is very extreme and worrying, with threats of self-harm. I think this is beyond reading a book or getting mumsnetter's advice about.

therapy when actually what needs to happen is that a child needs to be parented

I think getting some proper therapeutic help would help with this though.

She very clearly needs to be patented with clearer boundaries. But, given where they are now, it might take some effort to get to the point where those boundaries are something she’ll accept and feel safe within.

This is especially the case if, in the background, her mother is going to support the manipulation tactics in any way (just picking her up on demand during contact with her dad will reinforce the child’s feeling that it’s right that she’s in control of everything - however well meaning the mother is in doing so).

So some professional support may help everyone here.

We use a lot of family or child psychological assessments at work for damaged and troubled children such as this. The vast majority of the recommendations are not for therapy, they are for good, nurturing, predicable and consistent parenting. The best therapy for children like this is to have healthy attachment behaviour, boundaries, nuture, predictability and safety.

I see it time and again on this site in particular that rather than examine and explore the basics (basic parenting), the first resort is always therapy or 'the child has SEN'.

Put the basics in first.

This is a bit crazy. You seem lovely and really understanding…..I think I’d have run a mile. I’m not an expert but something is sure as hell going on, this is not normal and therapy is very much needed.

@bellac11 do you have any resources you’d recommend for parents? What’s normally your first step/ how you explain/ introduce the parenting basics to
people. I appreciated your replies on my thread about gentle parenting. I’m a fairly educated person but feel like I’ve absolutely no bloody clue how to parent, I have no role models or support and no natural instincts on what to do.

Give her time and let her be angry.

How angry and for how long? Do you think there’s any justification for threatening OP and her pregnancy, her baby? For deciding she, a child, getting to decide a baby’s name, the language he or she is taught? Do you think OP should have to spend time pandering to this extreme and violent blackmail because she had the temerity to date a man who’s a parent?

She needs a professional assessment starting with parents taking her to the GP and working together.

I often wonder if people recommending family therapy have actually experienced it as a child, especially in a blended family. Anything you say can and will be used against you...

The op has known this young girl for under 2 years. Family therapy is very exposing for all parties, and with someone she has known for short time could make her feel even more out of control than she does now.

Honestly that birthday party would have has me running for the hills. Nobody here can advise the best way to go for this very troubled child, I hope her parents will take it seriously and get her the help she needs.

Threatening repeatedly to kill herself if she doesnt get her own way?
saying she wants to stab her friend?

what have her parents done already? What did her father do when she said she wanted to stab a child? Have they spoken to her GP over concerns? Does she have any diagnoses?

as a pp said, family therapy with a man you are not married to, and haven't been with long, and his ex wife with a child you have not known long i would say was a bad idea. They could go. But not you.

why did the ex wife want a divorce? Getting pregnant came so fast in your relationship, how did that happen? Was it his idea?

I’m finding everyone’s comments really helpful, thank you so much. Sorry I haven’t responded to a lot of them as work is a bit full on atm, but they are very much appreciated.

i spoke to my auntie too (she has a 15 yo and a 9 yo, both boys) and she’s troubled by this message and the threat too.

This OP.
Be very careful when around this girl.

Whilst threats of suicide are shocking and should be taken seriously it is also very fashionable and just a phrase for many teens and teens.
I've had similar conversations to this many times:
"Miss, my pen's run out"
"There's a spare one in the pot on my desk, help yourself"
"ugh..... But that's so faaaaaar I'm going to kill myself".

It’s for her parents to deal with her now, stay well away and focus on keeping your baby safe.
She’ll have to see her dad away from the family home until you’re satisfied she’s seen the error of her ways and even then never leave her alone with him even a couple of years down the line. How upsetting for you all, but your baby is your priority and she sounds unhinged.

She's 10. She's using shocking language because it's all she's got. The adults around her need to be unflappable and consistent. Not running to therapists.

I have a child with SEN who can be shocking in her language. When adults get alarmed, her behaviour escalates. When adults give firm but kind boundaries, her behaviour calms.

We tried family therapy, it doesn't work if a particularly stubborn child refuses to participate!
Judging by what OP has described I feel its not likely to be successful, although individual therapy might help if the child lets her guard down when away from family members.

But that kind of parenting basics support is therapeutic.

Especially when there’s a history of guilt-driven NRP boundary-less parenting.

‘Therapy’ is treatment for something in a general sense. it’s not just seeing some kind of counsellor. So proper parenting support - and help in working to get the child to accept that - is therapeutic in the sense that it improves or ‘cures’ the problem.

I think a big question is - did she suffer from emotional dysregulation before her parents split up? This is not a happy child, this is not a child playing up, this is a child who feels their life is out of control and is doing literally anything she can to try and claw back some of that control - but was that also the case before her parents split?

What was she like before you met her? Has she had huge meltdowns her whole life? Has she always been very controlling? Desperate for routine and the security it brings? Struggles with transitions? Social issues? Did she have any trauma in her life before her dad left? What was the atmosphere at home like when he did live there? What was she like as a baby? Did her mum suffer badly with PND or does she have poor MH? How is she at school?

Her behaviour could be the result of the trauma of her parents splitting up, she could be ND, she could have an attachment disorder - but whatever the case she's only 11 and this is fairly extreme behaviour. I would suspect her self esteem is extremely low.

Her dad has not handled things well at all IMO. She needed a lot more support over the split, he really needed to not move on so quickly and not move in with someone else so quickly. He really should have talked to her about the possibility of having a step sibling in the future and give her time to get used to the idea that you might get pregnant at some point - not just drop it on her that she's getting a sibling in 9 months like it or not. It's fine to say you're adults and should be able to do as you like and she's a child and shouldn't dictate what you do but this has all been a really traumatic series of events for her - so you can say that but then this is what you potentially end up with, a traumatised child with extreme behaviour.

I would give her as much control as you can- but with you deciding what the options are. Like with a toddler that wants to dress themselves - you give them two options to choose from. So you could get her involved in all sorts of ways, it could be with the names - you decide a short list of two or three that you'd be really happy with and she gets to pick from that list. But if not the name then it could be with colours in the room, patterns on bedding or whatever - just be sure that if you're redecorating the babies room you ask her if she'd like her room done too. You need to keep her feeling she is as important and it's not all about the baby, whilst also getting her involved with the baby so she feels part of it - oh the tightropes we have to walk as parents!

If dsd is going to get play therapy on her own (probably the best way IMO). Then it might be worth you and her dad getting some therapy to help you navigate all this too and help you understand what might be going on for DSD and the best way to handle it all. DSD needs to feel all the adults in her life are in calm control, have clear consistent boundaries, make her feel loved but that she is the child and there are lots of things that she doesn't have to worry about because the adults have it under control.

You really need help to work out what is causing this behaviour - is it trauma from the split or is there more to it? Looking at her behaviour before the split and he therapist will help with this. I would make the therapist aware of the letter, the party and any other extreme behaviour. It's so important to get this worked out though or the teenage years could be extremely difficult for all of you. A teen with very low self esteem is extremely vulnerable and can be very destructive to themselves and others.

This! On your last post you said you told her when she was poorly, despite the agreement being that her dad was to tell her after his trip. Somehow all her school friends already knew about your pregnancy. You were baffled as to why she was so upset, called her mother abusive and called SD spoilt

You got an absolute grilling so no wonder the narrative has changed on this post....

the bit that shocked me was DSD saying she wanted to get a knife ‘to cut her friend’ as payback.

And how have her parents dealt with this incident?

In any normal family this would be seen as appalling and she'd have serious blocking and I imagine not be allowed friends over for a long time and expected to write an apology letter.

The whole things sounds very disturbing and I worry the child won't be able to hold down proper relationships as an adult if she doesn't learn boundaries.

*bollocking not blocking!

So from my understanding, she has met you a maximum of 90 times and probably spent less than 4 months, cumulatively, in your presence. She's lost her Dad as a constant and only sees him at weekends and holidays. Now, there will be another child who gets Daddy constantly.

I can't see why she would be upset at all.

I don’t think this is about the baby at all really. She needs professional help to help her process that her parents marriage has ended and to help her move on without needing to try and control and manipulate everyone.