Am I being grumpy with regard to nosy children?!

[BoredOfRainyDays]

First time posting on step-parenting, so please be nice to me! I’m just after some perspective really, as to whether I am grumpy and expecting too much of children, or whether my boyfriend is being a bit lenient with his.

I was out and about earlier with my boyfriend and his 4 year old daughter. We (my boyfriend and I) were having a conversation quietly about something as we were walking along, while his little girl was holding the hand furthest away from me. Not anything ‘secret’, but something that wasn’t relevant to his little girl and that she wouldn’t have been interested in anyway! So we’re walking along and mid-way through my sentence his little girl said to me “What are you talking about?” so I said “Oh I’m just talking to your Daddy at the moment” and smiled at her and tried to carry on. She then asked again and I said “Well it doesn’t really matter too much, and I’m just talking to daddy at the moment.” Then she asked again, and just as I was trying to think of a way to explain to her nicely that it wasn’t really any of her business what we were talking about, her dad (who I had hoped was going to back me up!) told her what it was we were talking about. I gave him a bit of an exasperated look and when he asked me what was wrong I pointed out to him that I had been purposefully trying not to tell her because it wasn’t really any of her business. He then said “But children don’t understand things not being their business.” Now I do understand that children are not ‘aware’ of things like that in the same way that adults are (I work with children, but older ones than her), but surely it is at points like this that you try and explain it to them? I was hopeful he would say “We are just having a grown up conversation at the minute, I might be able to tell you a bit about it later” or something along those lines, but no. His older daughter will also attempt to listen/join in conversations between the two of us that we are clearly trying to have privately (generally they are to do with making plans for potential nice things to do with them!) so it’s not just the little one. I think by that age (she’s 9) she should be old enough to know that it is quite rude to interrupt a private conversation between 2 people (whether they are adults or children) and ask what they are talking about.

My parents were in general quite strict with regards to manners though (they are big fans of the “I’m
talking about you, not to you!” phrase) so I don’t know whether I’m just being a bit picky and expecting too much. Thoughts?

@SilviaSalmon Ouch! I don’t think that at all. I love children (as I said, I work with them) and I find their crazy imaginations and creativity fascinating. But I have also been told from a young age that (while it might be impolite to have a conversation that doesn’t include all members of a group, I guess it depends on circumstances) it is also impolite to directly ask people having a conversation what it is that they’re talking about. I was under the impression that it was never too young to attempt to politely and kindly explain that to children (and all things manners related), but it seems that I am wrong. Which is fine, I don’t know a massive amount about children that young and I am learning all the time.

But I definitely don’t think they should be seen and not heard. She’s far more interesting than most of the adults I know!

Sounds to me like you wanted to prove to the child that you are more important to her dad than she is.

Try not to do that. Even if it's what you really want.

She isn't rude. She's four. You, on the other hand, should know better.

@BoredOfRainyDays
it is also impolite to directly ask people having a conversation what it is that they’re talking about.

She is 4! 4 year olds are still learning what is polite/impolite, right/wrong!

If she is often told that the conversations you choose to have in front of her are "none of her business" she will soon learn not to ask questions or be interested in others

@PlasticPatty that wasn’t my intention at all, and I don’t believe that’s how it came across. If she’d asked her father what we were talking about I wouldn’t have said anything as it would be nothing to do with me. I only answered her because she was talking directly to me. It just felt a bit like Sod’s law, I don’t parent them because it’s not my place (they have 2 parents already), but I do try and set a good example as I suppose any adult should. If I’d answered her question straight away then her father might have turned around and said a similar thing to what I’m saying now, you never know!

Thanks @woollyheart. That seems to be the general consensus

I don't think you are being grumpy necessarily. I think we ALL go through a process, usually when we have our own children, of remembering and revisiting what we were taught as children. Your reflexes and instincts are conditioned by the way you were parented. I think you have to "catch yourself" having those thoughts, recognise that they are based in your own upbringing, and then consciously evaluate them and decide whether or not you, as an adult, really agree with them. I found that I didn't agree with most of mine. I'm a much less authoritarian mother than mine was.

It's more complicated for you, because they're your stepchildren, but it's a similar process. Do you agree with your parents that it's rude for a child to ask adults what they are talking about, if the adults are talking in front of them? If you find that your core beliefs and your partner's really do conflict, then you have to talk about it and thrash out some compromises. Again, most parents go through this with their own children as well, especially first children.

She's 4. You clearly don't understand how a 4 year olds mind works! They think the whole world revolves around them and don't understand the concept of adult conversations.

YANBU. Absolutely nothing wrong and certainly not rude with wanting to have a short conversation with your DP without having to share details with a 4 year old.

@MsSquiz I know they are! But they don’t know stuff is impolite until they have it explained to them. That was meant to be the point of my thread. She knows it’s not nice to pick your nose, and to say ‘pardon me’ if you burp or fart, and to wait until someone’s finished speaking before you speak. But she knows all that because someone has taken the time to explain it to her.

When you choose to go out with someone who has kids and it gets to a point where you're asking/hope he/she will side with you or choose your side, it's time to realise that step-parenting isn't for you because any decent parent will always put his/her kids first.

Thank you @Greensleeves, that’s really helpful

Sounds to me like you wanted to prove to the child that you are more important to her dad than she is

At four she will only just be learning about what is and isn't good manners and I think you are expecting a bit much from her. This was a good opportunity for you to help her understand how it works. You could have said "Let me finish talking to Daddy, then I'll explain." You could then have finished what you were saying, with any further interuptions you could say "I'll explain when I've finished talking to Daddy" then as soon as you had finished given her a brief, simple, explaination of what was being said.

So err, what were you talking about?

@CheeseCakeSunflowers that is also very helpful, thank you! I am very conscious of not trying to parent them, I replied with what I thought was an appropriate response to a direct question at the time. But I guess one thing I do need to take from this is that you canno hope 4 year olds will get the hint!

This isn’t supposed to be a critique of the little girl at all by the way, she’s brilliant and I am very fond of her.

Maybe you could have said you were just saying how lovely she was?
End of inquisition.

@FrozenMargarita17

A potential new house. Which she is aware is happening at some point, so it’s not a secret. I asked her dad a very mundane question relating to budgets, it really wasn’t very exciting!

I could easily have told her what we were talking about, she then declared it to be ‘boring!’ when he told her. But I thought it was the right thing to not just tell her because she’d asked

Isn't there a saying about how there are no secrets when there are children present

@Aprilshowersarecomingsoon I like your thinking!

@BoredOfRainyDays
But she didn't just walk up to two people and try and join in did she? She was out with her father and his partner and trying to join in.
What you see as nosey is as simple as her trying to be part of the conversation/group/family.
I do t understand why
a) you have private conversations around her
B) you refused to answer and allow her to join in
C) how you cannot see that it was you that was rude.

It reads to me like you used this to compete for your partner's sole attention...
You sound quite immature and a honestly feel sorry for the 4 year old. At most she was showing curiosity and a want to be involved and you refused to allow her.

@BoredOfRainyDays but you didn't say to her it that it is impolite to ask you what you were talking about. (Which, I don't actually think it is impolite)

You told her you were talking to her daddy and then said it didn't matter too much.

Nothing about her being impolite. She politely asked what you were talking about and chose to carry on excluding her from a conversation

it is rude to have a conversation in a group that does not include everyone, and it's even more rude to then tell the person you have excluded from the conversation that it's none of their business.

She’s 4. Yes, asking what you’re talking about may not be the height of good social etiquette, but she’s 4. Of course she wants to know what you’re talking about. And obviously while you were having this conversation about budgets, no one was talking to her/engaging with her so she was probably a bit bored too.

@BoredOfRainyDays having just seen what you were talking about. Could you not then have said "just talking about the boring grown up part of getting a new house. Are you excited about having a lovely garden/having a new bedroom/what colour would you like your bedroom"

Kids like to be involved, not excluded

It's not her, it's you!

@RescueRemedy21 and @MsSquiz I will take both your points on board with regard to future conversations. I didn’t think it was impolite to have a brief conversation with her dad while she was quite happily looking around her/looking at shop windows/carrying something that she’d got from the shop. I won’t do that in future if so many people on here think it seems rude.

And I had no need to compete for his sole attention, I didn’t interrupt an existing conversation between the two of them, so I already had his sole attention as I had asked him
a question, if if you want to think about it like that.

I have said multiple times that I am learning about children that young, and what they can and can’t be expected to do. And I would never have used the phrase to her about it being none of her business, because it would be very unkind towards a child so young!