Think I should leave

[AnnaKat75]

Long time lurker but first time poster so please be kind!
In brief, I'm married a year to a lovely man & fantastic father which is why I'm so hurt. He has 2 boys aged 13 & 17 & I have two girls aged 12 & 16. As per many on these threads the kids have no real issues with each other but are also not very bonded due to differing sexes, personalities & interests.
We've been together 4.5 years in total & have maintained two properties as his children live in another town with their dm. His boys don't come to mine/ours much as they have weekend activities. I don't go to his/ours much as so do my girls & we've always tried to make this as easy as we can for the children. Dh sees his boys eow & a night during the week - he travels to see them unless it's holiday time whereby they generally come here.
My problem is this. His exw is a sahm & dh pays huge maintenance, her mortgage, her car loan & all the extras for the boys. He has also taken sole responsibility for putting them through third level. This was all in place before I met him & that's fine.
My exh & I go splits on everything even though I'm the resident parent & that too is fine. I agreed to this in my divorce as I was desperate to divorce as my exh is a psychological bully & I really needed that divorce after him stalling & stalling for years.
I work in social services & about 18 months ago I resigned my extremely stressful job on doctors advice. My mother had passed away a few years ago & I think I had a delayed reaction which escalated due to work stress & I reached total burn out. Dh was in agreement with this & I thought no more about it as I had savings & an inheritance from my dm which I am using to support my children.
This money is now running out which I expected & I'm ok with that as it's given me great breathing space. However, I'm not ready to go back to work in that sector just yet. Dh knows this but expects me to sell my house (to release equity) & downsize as opposed to helping me out for a while.
We have always kept the majority of our finances separate because of the kids, but I am honestly bewildered that he won't help me, I'm his wife!
I have never asked him for a penny for my children & never would. I still have some money put aside for their education but I'm struggling day to day & will do so until I get my head/a job sorted.
Dh is not generally a mean man. He pays his share of bills, remembers his entire family's birthdays etc. His exw did a right job on him & now refuses point blank to get a job even though she was not awarded spousal maintenance & I know this has colored his attitude to "wives who don't pull their weight". However I feel I'm now being 'penalized' for the fall out from his last marriage.
Am I being unreasonable to expect my HUSBAND to give me some support just until I get properly back on my feet?
I honestly feel like leaving I'm so hurt by his stance & I know that I would never do same to him.
I'm not in the UK & I don't qualify for disability here as dh's salary & our assets (two houses) disqualifies me.

Hi @katarajean - I have huge sympathy for the OP's reasons for giving up her job. Social work is an incredibly demanding job, and the pressure on people who work in that field is enormous. So, I do get why she gave up the job.

I'm also totally on board with all those people who said she shouldn't be working for free for her husband in the circumstances - couldn't agree more.

I do see an element of choice in how long the OP has been out of work - I think that's really clear in how she talks about the circumstances in which she'd take another job. And I'm not judging that - her health is important. So I don't use "choice" in a disparaging way. But there is still an element of choice in what she's doing.

The fact that she has done that unpaid work for her husband, for instance, shows that there are some kinds of work that she is capable of doing. She's choosing not to. I don't judge that. But I am trying to explain the emotional response that this probably triggers in her husband.

And your question about marriage is a good one. For me, personally, maintaining separate houses and finances isn't my idea of marriage. But, different strokes and all that - it doesn't matter whether you or I think that's the basis on which we'd have entered a marriage. It IS the basis on which the OP and her husband entered a marriage. And that's what the OP is now trying to change.

I do think there must be a way through this, if they both want to find it. What I'm suggesting is that the OP needs to understand the ways in which this will be triggering her husband's fears, and she needs to address that in how she goes about this, if it's to work. And he needs to recognise that too - because you can only adapt your response when you understand it.

I understand a lot of what you are saying misplaceddad - but when you say the OP needs to understand the ways in which the situation will be triggering to her husband’s fears, you mean the way it would be triggering to your fears if you were her husband. We do not know her husband’s fears.

I also think the bare bones of the marriage (separate finances and houses) being what the OP entered into belies the vast differences in emotional terrain she expected and has found. OP says she would support her husband (and indeed has with IT work, and who knows what the domestic division of labour is) but that same support is not forthcoming back. What happens if the husband loses his job? Does the OP say she will not support him as separate finances were agreed? Is there no room for circumstances to change?

I just don’t see the point of being married if there is no ethos of mutual support and room for discussion. That much is necessary for marriage to work, I think.

Financial questions are always so tricky! I also feel that my ex and my current P give more to exes than to me, but my P always has justifications as to why it's like that and he works hard to improve our old house so I support it. In your case, ask yourself what's in it for you if you lead pretty separate lives.
Could it be that if you always declared financial independence, you either chose a man who wouldn't be there for you or it doesn't even occur to him to help you? Did you tell him that you need his help, for him to be there for you in the time of need? Did you tell him how you feel? What does he say?

Totally agree with singledad and indeed it rings true with my OH too who got stung too in his first marriage financially and emotionally. As a matter of fact, he didn't even hide that he was very scared of getting married again. Until then, I'd never really realised that my strong, in control, laid back husband was actually a man fighting many anxieties.

The part about OP working for her OH is not much relevant as it is. For all we know it's a 1 hour job once a month and OP insisted on doing it, we don't know.

I think the concensus is that OP needs to speak with her OH and give him so reassurance as to what the future looks like. They've been married 1 year only. It might mean that all this happened soon after they were engaged. OP says he is normally a nice and generous man so the issue is likely not to be that he doesn't want to help but his worry that he could find himself back in the position he was before.

How can he be a "generous men" if they split costs of nights out in half???? That's not a "generous" behaviour. And its his WIFE we are talking about not some random person...

Are people who think the husband is in the right really saying that if their life long partner got sick and needed their help and it was in their power to comfortably give it they’d say “nah, fuck you. Sell your assets.”

I can not imagine a scenario where my husband got ill and I forced him to sell his assets whilst I rolled around like Scrooge McDuck on my mountain of gold.

That is not the actions of a nice person and not someone I’d want to be married to.

How can he be a "generous men" if they split costs of nights out in half???? That's not a "generous" behaviour. And its his WIFE we are talking about not some random person..

This. Ten times this. Out of all of the info on this post, this is the one that still has me flummoxed. It just feels, so, well, COLD. Who does this with their other half?????

I mean I genuinely get the angst of not wanting to be screwed over again financially. But not one bit of that divorce trauma, explains this.

You must be terribly hurt OP.

IMHO, DH is spending too much of his £ on his children and his past life. There's 0 left over for his current marriage and the life he has now.

There's nothing you can do about financing the exW, although it must be impossible not to be resentful. Boy, DH is resentful about it - that's why he's put £0.00 into his new marriage.

DH needs to think again about lavish financing of the DCs' univ when he won't support his own wife for a few months. It doesn't sound like you need that much £ comparatively for a few months off.

It doesn't sound like DH keeps much from his salary. I would suggest that in order to move on fully, he starts by looking at his finances to work out how to invest in the life he has now. Because he's blowing everything on a marriage that has ended and potential DCs needs - no wonder he feels like he's been burnt.

If he could release some ££ to invest in his current life, and you, his wife, oddly enough, he might find he feels less bitter.

Totally agree with hecky, Sadsy and Kat. Evwryone is going on a out the op’s ‘choice’ to give up work - what about her dh’s ‘choice to get married again? Did he not think about the vows he was making as he was saying the words? It’s not like he hadn’t heard them before.

And people saying about “changing the goalposts”, I very much doubt that the OPs husbands proposal was, will you marry me? Oh and by the way if you ever get ill and need me support? Fuck that you’ll be on your own. But you can work for me for free. And pay exactly half of everything when we go out anywhere.

Op I work part time voluntary and my dh fully financially supports me and my kids who are at uni (he is their step dad). He also has his own kids. Your dh is most certainly not a generous man.

He's obviously been burnt by his past.
You'll only know what you want to do after a frank discussion with him (after you've backdated your it work bill!)

Op, I have been there. The only thing that I can say is that sometimes, women like us are prepared to prove our independence, paid our share, show them we won’t be a burden as a previous ex and with that... we teach them not to provide for us.

A lot can be said about equality but the sticking point is that you would help him if he were in your shoes but he doesn’t. Can you change him before your own marriage gets eroded? Probably not, he is used not to provide for you.

There is also another important thing to consider, whether we like it or not, when either of the partner stops working, there is immediately a shift in power in the relationship. Simply put, they assume they are doing “more” and you put up with lousy behaviour because you “can’t” afford to leave.

I know you complain about the exw not working, but at this time you are exactly in the same place. If she has not worked for a long time, she may not get a job even if she tries very hard, the longer you are out of work, the more difficult it is to find someone willing to take the risk of employing you, so don’t put yourself in the same position.

With regards to his finances... The difference is that he is not giving the money to his ex, he is paying the carer of his kids, he is not paying for a roof over her head, but one over the heads of his own kids. IME, big levels of financial commitment after a failed marriage mostly come regularly if you have a child together. Otherwise it is just like being flatmates with benefits.

Yes, presumably from his POV he is paying money for his Dc to be a sahm to dare for his kids. But does not feel that he needs to bear the financial burden of supporting you to be a sahm you YOUR kids.

But he seems to have forgotten the ‘richer For poorer’ clause in his marriage vows 😜

Actually, I take that back, my own exh does his best to avoid paying child maintenance, but he fully support his SAHpartner and her son. So it may go either way.

OP you say your ex and you split everything even though you are the resident parent. Is he paying the right amount or could he contribute more even just for next 6 months ? Is he planning to help support his DC through university same as you have a saving fund for them?

Could it be your DH is feeling that he could support more instead of, if your DH sees it this way and I don't know, but may be thinking he's being asked to support 4 children now?

Him not being prepared to loan you the money isn't good. You've said you'll pay him back...however 18 months is a long time to be out of work and you're saying you still need another 6 months.

In his position that would concern me too. I imagine he felt you being out if wirk all this time wasn't something he was keen on or would do himself...as you said he works extremely hard....but he didn't say anything as it didn't impact him financially....now it's impacting him by you asking for money...so he's making his position known.

Another point is that people generally have less sympathy when you don't have a physical illness keeping you off or out of work. Anxiety, stress can be perceived in a certain way, especially by an individual who has a strong work ethic and is never out of work.

Social care work can be stressful and requires a lot of resilience, especially in the current climate with government cuts to social care.

I'm not sure if you're a qualified social worker, but if so you could do some BIAs which pay @£300 each.

Hi everyone. Thank you so much for all the replies & I'll try my best to clarify a few things.
First off, I did ask him clearly for help & that's when he said no; in his opinion I should be working & if I was that worried about money I should downsize the house.
I did outline a plan to him. I want to get as good a job as possible but not in the social services sector. I have done two interviews (neither of which I got) & have a few more lined up. I plan to give myself 6 months to find a 'good' job outside my sector. If this is not possible I will take something less well paid or part time. I told him all this & also said that a less well paid job would mean me not always being able to go on holidays etc. & his response was "well that's life".
Please understand that I've never experienced this from him before hence my hurt & bewilderment. However I do take on board what one poster said about my mh issues being exacerbated indirectly by dh & I think that person could be correct in that maybe my gut was picking up on potential issues rearing their head. Dh & exw & the boys boundaries are all a bit blurry & I'm someone who likes things to be on the level.
I think two things are at play here. Firstly he (like many people) while seeming to show support, doesn't actually see mh issues as illness & at heart is quite dismissive of it.
Secondly I do think this has triggered stuff regarding his exw & @SlightlyMisplacedSingleDad I totally get where you're coming from. However, my exh was a dreadful emotional bully & yet I didn't go into any relationship or my 2nd marriage assuming all men are at heart bullies! Dh chose to marry me & as many have said, marriage is not a static thing. The people involved change & life happens & we all have to move with it. Dh is basing his current opinion of me on his opinion of & his experience with his exw, & that is dreadfully unfair.
I'm not blaming his exw & I don't disapprove of sah mothers at all. However I think dh was very shortsighted in his divorce. He agreed to pay a mortgage & massive maintenance for a woman who was home with his young kids. What he failed to see was that the boys would get older & now he's left in a position whereby he's the sole provider for teenage children & because of this his exw is in a position where she doesn't have to work & has told him she has no intention of doing so. She has also said she has no intention of contributing to uni as she never went & doesn't think it's important. She believes both boys should go work with dh. Imo Dh should have stipulated part payment of mortgage & reduced maintenance after the boys reached secondary school age. I'm sure he is very ticked off that his exw is free to do as she pleases until 6 o'clock each day while he's putting in 12 hour days, but that's not my problem! And if he is that ticked off & triggered I think it's very unfair that I'm on the receiving end of his annoyance as it's totally misplaced.
Dh asked me to marry him & at this point I'm honesty not sure what he expected long term? Did he think I was going to stay young & sprightly forever? I certainly didn't think that of him. And I keep coming back to the point that if he had an accident for example, & was told his recovery depended on him switching jobs & it was taking him a while to line something up, I would never emotionally or financially abandon him!
I never invoice him for IT stuff as it was a couple of hours per week & while it's stuff that would take him ages to do I can nearly do it in my sleep. I viewed it the way I view him changing the light bulbs I can't reach as I'm so short!
I do agree that my exh is probably a factor. He doesn't pay maintenance but does contribute to large expenses & will contribute to uni (I managed to get this included in our divorce). But dh has never been asked for a penny for the girls. My eldest has a pt job & also busks at times to get extra cash. And, if all came to all I would help fund uni via student loans. So again, any feelings he may have regarding being put upon are totally unfounded.
I don't think dh is a mean man but I think he has some serious issues around finances & provision & I fully agree with something one of the last posters wrote; he may have physically moved on but financially he is stuck in his previous marriage & now does not have the emotional or financial space for this one.
Again, thank you all for your input, it's really helped clear things in my muddled head.
I'm going to outline all my thoughts very clearly to him tonight & see what he has to say.

Good luck!

OP, It is so hard to understand the tone of conversations via mnet but something you said has jumped out at me.

I will take something less well paid or part time. I told him all this & also said that a less well paid job would mean me not always being able to go on holidays etc. & his response was "well that's life".

Depending on how you said this, this could be a very triggering comment for him. Because you are essentially saying that you will take a job that will potentially lower your quality of life (in terms of holidays), certainly for the foreseeable future. What position does that place him in? It basically either forces him to say 'don't worry, I'll pay for you', or it forces him to say ' well my holidays (assuming he takes nice ones) are important to me and I'll go on my own if you can't afford it' or 'thats ok, I'm prepared to compromise my lifestyle too to accommodate your lower income'.

Neither one of those is 'winning' for him if you step back and look at life through his lens. I do appreciate the fact that he asked you to marry him etc but again playing devils advocate, he could very well be sitting there thinking 'are you kidding me, I married her thinking she was polar opposite to my EW and as soon as she gets the ring, she's expecting me to be the cash point'. (I'm a nice person, but if I'd been cleaned out via divorce, that would be my instinctive response).

His point could very well be, 'if you respected our values and your vows, then you wouldn't even think of coming to me with this. Why do you expect me to compromise my lifestyle, or fork out more money because you are making the choices you are? You have the money (and you do), make some changes and compromises yourself. You can't have it all'.

I still think if this was the situation reversed (and it was a woman posting in your DH's position), the responses would be VERY different.

My advice would be this. As opposed to outlining your thoughts on this, why don't you ask him how he feels about this all? Why don't you try and figure out what's going on in his head? Digest it and then think about whats next.

If you push someone who is overwhelmed/ has baggage from divorce, that can very easily backfire. Conversations can go south very quickly and money after divorce is a very emotive topic for many.

Good luck OP, I hope your talk goes well tonight

@TooSassy, again I get your point. But, as I've repeatedly said when you marry someone you undertake to take the good with the bad. At least that's always been my understanding of marriage. I stuck my first marriage out for years for this very reason until it hit one affair too many on the part of my exh.
I didn't ask to get sick & I am making a great recovery. I also burnt out & left my job BEFORE we got married so it's not like I woke up the day after getting a ring on my finger & went "oh I don't feel well, think I'll have a breakdown"! He knew all of this.
When I made the remark about the holidays etc. to him I was merely letting him know the consequences. Within the context of that conversation I was explaining to him that my main concern is not relapsing & that a career change is in my opinion fundamental to that & that while I would do my level best to find a different job at my old pay level I couldn't guarantee it.
Again, if the situation was reversed & he said same to me my response would have been, "don't worry about it. I'll still take my kids away for their holiday (we always do this separately) as per usual but when it comes to our holiday (as a couple) I'll fund it if you'd like, but I'll have to cut cloth to suit measures so it might be a staycation as opposed to a trip abroad". I wouldn't have just said "that's life"!
I've done precisely that with my girls since I stopped working - activity holidays at home as opposed to going abroad.
Dh is perfectly entitled to feel as he does but honestly, he shouldn't have gotten married if he couldn't see that there may be times when we'd have to lean on each other.
I'm now thinking he possibly only went through with the marriage so as not to lose face with family & friends.

And I agree that money is very emotive. I can very much understand people not wanting to blend anything, ever, or at least until children are adults. But marriage, whether we like it or not, changes things & it does come with a certain expectation of trust & care & longevity, & I think it's very naive to think you can marry someone & commit to them in all ways bar financial.