That you were / are the other woman

[Willyouadmit]

I admit I was. I read a lot of threads on here and posters always justify with I was not the other woman. My DH and I have been together 10 years. When I met him he didn't initially (for about a month) tell me he was married with children. The day he told me everything I was angry and upset. I told him he had to make his decision immediately.

My dh's ex would tell you I was the ow.
My dh would tell you I wasn't.
As with all things, the truth is probably somewhere in the middle.

His story, which is accepted as the truth by his side is that they were living separately, separate rooms, separate meals, separate weekend plans, separate holidays with the kids, and had been doing that for 2 years. But they were still sharing a house while they tried to negotiate a sharing of kids and finances through long and drawn out mediation. They were not married so he had no automatic parental rights at that time. He says she knew he was seeing someone else from the very beginning, he never hid it.

Her story, accepted as truth by her side, is that they were going through a bad patch but were trying to sort it out, she says the mediation was couples counselling. Then he had a secret affair and left their happy and sustainable relationship for no reason.

I suspect they were both burying their heads in the sand. She knew he wanted to move on but couldn't face the practical and emotional upheaval so wouldn't negotiate. He can't bear conflict so put off forcing the negotiations for way too long.

He should have just faced it early on. He handled it badly. In trying to avoid upset he just created a whole lot more. He should have made sure his last relationship was 100% over, not just 90% over, and waited a decent period of time for the dust to settle before even thinking about dating. But life is not like that. And what's a decent period of time anyway?

But he didn't do it the way he did because he's a bad person, he did it because he was scared and didn't know how else to do it. He also had some very unhelpful legal advice from an emotionally inept solicitor which didn't help.

And I was young and stupid and had no idea what it meant to take apart a parenting relationship even when your relationship as lovers and partners was accepted by both sides to be over. If I had known then what I know now I would not have got involved with him at that time.

We're still married 15 years on with 3 kids.

Are we bad people? I don't think so.
I was naive, he was scared. But we could and should have handled it so much better.

I think his kids have definitely been damaged by the way their parents split up. I think given the natures of the people involved it was never going to be pleasant for them but me being involved to whatever extent definitely didn't help.

It is a difficult subject, I'm not proud of it particularly. But it is what it is.

Take it- so you're thinking is that it is completely fine for mum to tell them but their dad can say nothing ?
I completely agree with you for once, they didn't need to know.

Knitjob- I think you understand my OP. You are right it doesn't make someone a bad person because of how you met your partner and like myself you probably handled it the way you thought best at the time. Hindsight is a wonderful thing. I definitely agree that both DH and exw were burying their heads in the sand and not dealing with their issues. It's not an excuse as you say it's a fact.

Font your point about 50/50. Is that so maitenance is non payable. Its rare for a man to want 50/50 when maitenance isnt the motivation.
So you reckon 50/50 would stop dirtbags having affairs? What about the facts that 50/50 would not be best for a huge percentage of children.
No all these things may go into aans reasoning for being a awful human but he still has that choice.

knitjob it's completely obvious from your post that you were the ow, regardless of the convoluted knots that your husband has tied himself up in.

A pretty simple rule of thumb would be not to get involved with someone who is living with their partner and the mother/ father of their children, regardless of what they tell you about the exact status of their relationship.

Fwiw, I have never been the 'wronged wife', but my mum was,and I've seen the damage close up.

All this aggro and you weren't even the other woman :/

I was when I was 17. I fell for an older man in his 40s. 6 months into the relationship I found out he had a fiance. I gave him ultimatum and he chose me.

We didn't work out. He cheated on me and I deserved it 100 percent. I deserved the hurt, the pain and the paranoia because I caused it for someone else.

Feel like a different person looking back. Feel disgusted with myself.

I’m still not entirely sure what your question was😳
The thing is, you aren’t going to get a lot of support from women by asking would you admit to being the other woman!
Women who knowingly go out with a married man are generally thought of as shite bags......
Sorry but true

Ps
If I’d been going out with a bloke for a month then he tells me he’s married with kids....
I wouldn’t have given him a ultimatum.....
I’d have kicked him in his cheating nuts
Just saying

I can spot an OW a mile off, without a word though, and I have never been hurt etc in this way. The OW is usually the one that looks uncomfortable in her own skin, lacks confidence and eye contact and doesn't always look relaxed. She is usually a nice enough person but the
relationship and its beginnings have somehow diminished her.
Sounds like wishful thinking. I know 3 second wives who were the OW and none of them look anything like you describe.

I think this thread in itself perfectly explains why women do not admit to having been the OW. There is zero tolerance for cheaters on MN. I think that's a bit of a black and white attitude, human psychology is messy.

BestBeforeYesterday I am not sure why you would think there would be 'tolerance' for cheaters. Cheating ruins lives. It is especially ruins children's lives and well being. If you are so terribly unhappy with your marriage then leave quietly and start a new relationship further down the line, the pain and anguish that an affair can cause is unacceptable to most people.

Knitjob, or could it be, as it is often the case that he was keeping all his eggs in what basket because ultimately, the last thing he wanted was to end up alone. So he said what he had to say so his wife still thought they had a chance, told you want you wanted to hear so you believed he was about to leave and he kept this up for long enough so that when the time that he had to make a decision came about, he could go with the one that made him happiest but with less level of risk.

It's not a criticism of affairs as such because there have been many in my family and all in all, it has turned for the best for all involved. As my OH says regularly, if his wife hadn't left him for someone else (after coming back and going again) he would never have met me and he can't live with this idea, worse, he can't imagine what he would have done if we'd met when he was still married.

However, I do think many men lie to everyone, themselves included when they try to justify their actions and in most cases, they did what suited them as a priority rather than being the victim of the circumstances as they like to pretend.

Actually the right thing to do would have been to end it right there and not give him an ultimatum.

OP, your DH has done the classic of rewriting history. It is easy to say the marriage was poor and that he wouldn’t be here if he hadn’t met you - but he didn’t finish his marrriage and then meet you did he! So to me it wasn’t that bad.

My ExH has an affair. It was the nastiest, saddest period of my life. The deceit was horrendous. I felt like ending it too. So perhaps your DH’s ex wife also considered ending it too but had to carry on because of their children like I did too. I loved my ExH. It never crossed my mind that someone I loved could be so wicked. The damage to our children has been continuos. They see their dad once a week instead of every day. He isn’t there to see them when they come home from school, when they are sad, etc etc etc as ultimately he is now a part time dad as he has a new family.

Sad. But I’m glad you made your DH happy :/)

Like some of the others- not sure why you posting.
You didn't know he was married.
You gave him an ultimatum.
He left his wife.

How do you think she felt?
It doesn't matter what his circumstances were- he didn't leave before he met you. Would he have done? Would he have stayed if he wasn't having his ego flattered by someone new?
He is a liar and a cheat .
You are the selfish other woman,

My ex was having an affair for over 8 months before I found out.
You cannot underestimate the pain and heartbreak .that caused .And continues to cause.

To say there are other circumstances is wrong, if they don't want to be in a relationship they should have the guts to sort it out, not line up another woman first.
Cowardice . And both parties try to justify it.

@Willyouadmit & others in the same boat - I am a cheated on exw.
As far as I was concerned my ex & I were going through a bad patch, or should I say HE was going through a bad patch - unhappy in work, not sleeping, drinking too much, bit of a midlife crisis. Our dd had also been extremely unwell & was still on meds. I offered much support & even bought him a holiday to a far off destination he had always wanted to visit as an anniversary present. It was a single ticket as we had no one who could have minded our kids at the time & our dd would have been too small to travel such a long way.

The day he left for the holiday I woke up to the most beautiful letter from him telling me how amazing I was & how much he loved me & how grateful & lucky he was to have me & the kids in his life.
Three months later I told him his drinking had reached crisis point & that he needed to do something about it - his response was that he was leaving. Myself & my kids (the older two at least) spent months in absolute confusion - me because I'd had NO idea he was thinking along those lines & the kids because they couldn't understand why daddy had just decided to leave when mummy & daddy didn't fight & seemed ok together. He refused to give the kids or me any any logical explanation bar he was unhappy. It took me 2 months to get him out of the house after landing this bombshell on me as having told me he was leaving he then hummed & hawed as he couldn't find "suitable accommodation" & I spent weeks with my nerves in shreds with a man who kept telling me he was leaving but wouldn't actually go. Meanwhile he was still drinking & out with his friends every weekend. I eventually snapped & packed his bags.
About 6 months after he left I heard he was seeing someone - a woman who was part of his going out circle. I asked him about it and he told me it was very casual. As this time he was still coming to the house to see the kids as he didn't want them seeing him in his "crappy flat" & would offer to cook me dinner!!!!
A good friend eventually rang me & told me that she had irrefutable knowledge that they had been seeing each other for MONTHS & way before I had even bought him the holiday by himself!!! His own parents accidentally corroborated this a short while later as exh started confusing his official time line for events. As often happens I then heard from plenty of other people that the affair had been going on for ages - over a year before he left.
I was DEVASTATED. At this point I knew the marriage was well & truly over but the person I thought I knew; the person I had shared 17 years with; the person I had stood by through thick & thin; the person with whom I had watched our baby daughter being wheeled off for major surgery; the person I had TRUSTED implicitly had spent months weaving a web of lies & deception in order to save his own skin; not make himself look like the bad guy; & to give himself time in case he changed his mind about her - & make no mistake he WAS hedging his bets.
It took me months & a lot of therapy to get over this - not so much the marriage breakdown but the knowledge that I actually never really knew him & that he had lied to me for so long about so much & that he was at heart a very, very weak immoral person.
Now I don't know what he told this woman. Maybe he told her the marriage was over, maybe not. The blame lies squarely with him as he was the one with a wife & three kids. However, she is to blame also as getting involved with a man who is not out of the family home (whatever the state of the marriage) is both stupid/naive & a bit morally bankrupt especially when there are kids involved.
The point of this long post is that a man who is prepared to cheat on a wife & kids is not an honorable man & has an inbuilt steak of deception & denial & will basically say anything to keep himself protected. I was lied to over & over about everything including how much he loved me, & if I were to hedge my bets I'd say the ow was lied to also & was told exactly what she wanted to hear. I'd say he was telling her he loved her a few hours after telling me!!! If you're unhappy in your marriage, grow a pair & tell your partner and end it properly if you feel you need to.
After a series of break ups & getting back togethers my exh & the ow are now together with two kids. I'm sorry to sound patronizing but I actually pity her as her relationship was born out of lies, deception & the hurt & confusion of three children. She also had to wait for his exw to issue an ultimatum about drinking & to kick him out of the house to actually get him - not exactly a great start.
I've never told my kids the truth as I wanted to protect them. And I also didn't want them hating their now sm as that would have damaged their relationship with their dad. Same when she got pregnant. Yes I wanted to throttle them as not only had exh 'left' his kids he had also told them he'd never have any more as they were enough for him but then she wanted kids - probably lied about this too.
I'm not judging any of you who may have been the ow - but make no mistake your actions will have caused a lot of hurt & trauma for many kids & that's the part you ladies will NEVER see unless you have the misfortune of it ever happening to you. Also make NO mistake that if a man is comprehensively able to lie to his wife & kids, then he's able to comprehensively lie to you.

Cheating ruins lives.

True. But if kids are involved, it doesn't make much difference if one partner cheated or not (hopefully, children are spared the details of the breakup of their parents' marriage). Most marriages that ended with cheating would have ended anyway - which doesn't condone the cheating at all, but I really don't believe in this rhetoric "we were happy and if it hadn't been for the OW, we would still be together".

BestBeforeYesterday I don't know a single child that is spared the details, they get to know the truth in the end. Many of my friend's children are in counselling, battling horrendous MH issues and one or two were suicidal and are still not out of the woods. The children take the brunt of the upheaval and the pain.
Every marriage has its ups and downs, and many dhs live to regret leaving their wives and families. I know very happily married men that have had affairs best, it is not about the wife or family life, but perhaps more about having their cake and eating it? If they were unhappy they would have left before no? Why wait for OW?
I could not be a man who ever thought it was okay to be married and start an affair personally it says everything about his character.

Totally disagree that marriages that end because of affairs would have ended up anyway. I think more men leave when they have a secure new relationship to go to than moving out with the prospect of being single. Marriages go through rough patches but when there comes the prospect of a relationship without the issues it's easier to leave because starting from fresh is often easier than undoing damage.

Relationships born out of affairs are based on dishonesty and lies. It is contaminated from the start with the pain of others, and the stain this leaves on both the dh and the ow is long lasting.

No one will truly like you or respect you, they may tolerate you socially but deep down you know you will never be liked or forgiven.

If you are unhappy leave, and leave with kindness and dignity especially if you have children.

If you are going through a bad patch work on it, we all have them.

If you are the OW this is something deep down that will always make you feel like crap. Why do it to yourself? Have some self respect. One day it may happen to you, it is very likely to, once a a cheater always a cheater, no not any different or anymore special than his previous dw/gf you are just another victim.

I know a few who were OW, it’s not as simple as some of the posts above. Many were young and stupid (both relationships) and have matured into kind and happy people. Some have kids and new relationships and all get along ok. Some all talk to each other and have moved on. Some I knew had children whilst little more than children themselves, behaved stupidly, didn’t require cope but moved forward.

If they were unhappy they would have left before no? Why wait for OW?
Probably because they don't have the guts to leave. From reading the relationship board, it seems many cheaters never actively leave, they get kicked out. And yes, many definitely want to have their cake and eat it!

Can you please get this moved to the relationship board OP?
SM get enough shit on this site without posts like these under the SP section.
Report your own post and ask HQ to move it.

Haven't RTFT but I guess technically I was the OW but not when he was with the mother of his DD. It was when he was with the gf he got with after the breakdown of the marriage.

We slept together once and within a week he'd broken up with his gf and started dating me. So I guess technically I was the OW for about a week. I trust him completely as I saw he took responsibility for his actions and broke up with his gf at the earliest opportunity (he wanted to do it in person). Sure it wasn't great, he should have broken up with her if he wasn't happy and we shouldn't have slept together whilst he was in a relationship. But I do completely trust him.

*Relationships born out of affairs are based on dishonesty and lies. It is contaminated from the start with the pain of others, and the stain this leaves on both the dh and the ow is long lasting.

No one will truly like you or respect you, they may tolerate you socially but deep down you know you will never be liked or forgiven.

If you are unhappy leave, and leave with kindness and dignity especially if you have children.

If you are going through a bad patch work on it, we all have them.

If you are the OW this is something deep down that will always make you feel like crap. Why do it to yourself? Have some self respect. One day it may happen to you, it is very likely to, once a a cheater always a cheater, no not any different or anymore special than his previous dw/gf you are just another victim.*

This really is a lot of nonsense.
I was the OW according to Ex w.
I feel no 'stain'.
We have a wide circle of friends, many of whom are couples who were formally friends with DH and Ex w as well as friends we have made between us.

He would of left when his wife started sleeping with her now DH - only this would have meant leaving his children. Meeting me gave him the courage to do this. The children didn't want him to leave. Custody is almost always (was at the time) in the mother's favour. She was a sahm - he worked away. No chance of 50/50. As advised by Solicitor when he went to enquire about leaving prior to meeting me.

I have no 'deep down feeling making me feel crap' . I am 14 yrs in to an extremely happy second marriage. Still very good friends with my ex h who I was married to for 18 yrs.
2 of my DSc (soon to be 3) moved to live with us as soon as the court would recognise their wishes.

Really need to stop generalising on this subject. I know Ex wives want to hear that the second marriage is miserable. That the kids never get over it. (Ours say it was the best thing that ever happened, everyone is happier and they don't have to live in WW3) and that we (OW) are all racked with guilt. This may be true for some but as everyone's story, situation and behaviour is different, it really isn't a case of one size fits all.

Newsofas OP, your DH has done the classic of rewriting history. It is easy to say the marriage was poor and that he wouldn’t be here if he hadn’t met you - but he didn’t finish his marrriage and then meet you did he! So to me it wasn’t that bad.

There seems to be a blind refusal to accept that there are thousands of separated couples living under the same roof at the moment. Down to a simple case of economics and the cost/supply of housing.
If you live in the SE, how many people with 3 dcs can afford to split up and both house their children. ?Average rent for three bed is £1500. Mortgage not much less. .
So, you separate but are housed together until they can afford separate homes. This can take years. And all parties are expected to remain celibate in the meantime ? Or is it all a lie and no one is separated bit living together?

Personally, if a girlfriend tells me her boyfriend still lives in the marital home , I would advise her to be careful and consider the fact that he is still married. To test this by going out locally together. If he doesn't balk at this then assume he is at liberty to have another relationship. Ultimately she can never know for sure. Ultimately if he wants to have another relationship then that's his choice. She owes nothing to possible existing partners. He is the one breaking promises.

There are two types of affairs. The type when the man is after sex and companionship but has no intention of leaving the marriage. It's an 'extra'. He will only leave when caught and chucked out. Few get caught because they are very careful. The other is a man who is unhappy and looking for an exit. He will leave as soon as the affair is established.