Holiday abroad - I don't know what to do!

[MumTo2GirlsDT]

So my parents have offered to take all the family abroad on an all inclusive holiday, which consists of my 2 parents, brother & his 2 girls, sister brother in law & their 3 boys, me DH & 2 DDs. Now the problem is I have a 10yo SS but my parents can't afford to take him as it's £460 each. They also don't really want him to come (they don't have a natural relationship with SS) as it's the 1st family holiday for them with all their grandchildren.
Me and DH have just bought a house and are struggling to pay all the bills atm especially with Xmas coming up so we can't afford to pay SS'S share for the holiday.
DH has said he can't go without SS which I understand and feel awful about not being able to take him. But I suggested me and DDs still going as I'm not going to be able to afford to take them on holiday for years and years.
We are paying for SS to go on a residential school trip for a week next year aswell so I don't see it as he's been left out (which is how DH sees it) because he is going on a holiday with school.
I don't know what to do tbh because I do feel crappy for either the DDs missing out on a holiday with their grandparents & family or for going without DH and SS.
Any advice? Opinions? Personal experiences?

I don't think your parents are under any obligation to include your SS who you seen once a fortnight.

I find it bizarre that MN always insists that Scs have to be treated the same by step grandparent. Presumably your SS has two sets of grandparents already to spoil him?

Well with that in mind then I don't think that inlaws have any obligation to accept their children's partners into their lives. Given they aren't actually related. How outrageous that their child should expect their partner to be welcomed into the family and treated as one of them. They're not related after all.

I don't get this resentment towards stepchildren on MN which insists that DSC just need to suck up the fact that they're not equal and have no right to be, regardless of the fact that they never chose to be in the situation where they're seen as second class members of their own families.

I think that inviting him is the right thing to do even if he hasn't been courteous to your parents in the past - he's a member of your family. He will probably say no, or his mum will rightly refuse pwrmission during term time given he's of secondary age.

As an aside, your DH needs to remonstrate with him about his impolite treatment of your parents. It's not on.

I agree that he should be polite towards OP's parents. That being said, the OP stated that her parents didn't want to invite him and that this is "their first holiday with all of their grandchildren," from which he is being blatantly excluded.

As a child he should be being polite, but as an adult most people would advise him to cut the toxic parents out of his life.

OP, maybe you should check if he wants to go and his mother will allow him to before your own mother changes the whole holiday?

I agree he should have been invited and you have made your point to her which she has accepted but if he's not interested or allowed then you could all still go to the place your parents have chosen

It seems very convienient that mum is suddenly in charge and will have the final say in whether the boy can go on holiday or not.

Don't we usually have threads about the father having the same 'rights' to make decisions about holidays?

In this case though, halo, it's in school time.

As both parents will be fined if the absence is unauthorised, it's only fair that both parents give permission for the holiday and accept the risk of fine.

I don't think a mother or father should be able to take a child out of school without the other's permission. Holiday time, they have every right to take the child away.

errrrr....will your dc - also your dh dc - be taken on holiday with his ex when she takes her ds?
No.

Also he already has holidays planned that don't include your dc.

Why does dss have to be at every holiday your kids go on when it isn't reciprocal?

I think it's rather disingenuous of your parents to not include him on the basis of 'they don't really know him'. This would be the ideal time to build on that

However, they are NOT wrong for wanting it to be just your side.

Does your dh think his ex faces this dilemma when she makes holiday plans?
Why doesn't he feel it's 'unfair' when your dc can't go with dss on his holidays?
He's basically saying it's acceptable for his ds to go on holidays with either mum or dad - but not your dc
OP, you don't need his 'permission' to take your kids on holiday by yourself - especially when they won't be enjoying anything like that for ages.

How do your dc feel about dss having all these holidays but they can't even have one?

i think your dh is the one being unfair here and playing disney dad.
Your feelings and your kids feelings matter too - i would go. DH and dss will get over it.

I would feel more ambivalent about this if it were a family holiday paid for by mum & dad. Then absolutely yes. The non resident child should be included to go with his father step mother and half siblings because HE HAS A RELATIONSHIP WITH THEM ! This is NOT his parents holiday it's his Step mothers Parents, he doesn't have a relationship with them, they do not see him except incredibly occasionally . OPs parents come to visit small pre school grandchildren The SS is a 12 yr old who is starting to have a life away from parents and the sheer bloody tedium that a LOT of nrc feel at 'visiting ' dad out of obligation every other weekend. There IS NO RELATIONSHIP between these people and the SS.
Why is it so difficult for people to understand that not all families 'blend' in the same way. Especially when there is a decade or more between children of first and second families. We don't ALL live in these lovely Disney families where everybody includes everyone in an equal manor . Sometimes they do, it is easier with children the same age- but often the children themselves don't want it. I certainly don't know ANYONE age 12 who would want to spend much more than an hour with a toddler ! Let alone a whole weekend or an entire weeks holiday. !

Sounds fair enough of your parents to me, the kid is not their relation and I'm sure he gets treats from his own mum's parents. If his mum's parents were taking him away with their family, would that be unfair on your DDs? Why should the stepson effectively have three sets of grandparents and all the treats that go along with them? Especially as he is going away with school anyway, I think it's fine. If your DH wants to make a fuss then leave him at home too and enjoy a holiday with your DDs.

the kid is not their relation

Why should the stepson effectively have three sets of grandparents and all the treats that go along with them?

I don't understand how people can write in such a cold way about a child. It's not his fault that his parents split but it's like he is condemned to suffering because of it.

The grand-parents should not be forced in taking and paying for a child they don't want to be party to the holiday they arrange. Why should they. However, they should respect the fact that by doing so, their son in law will not come either, and this will result in some awkwardness between OP and her OH.

What I find very sad in this thread is how some SM think that OP's husband is being selfish by not going because they think it is totally acceptable that a child of the family should be excluded from a significant family gathering just because the child happens, not by choice, to be going on more holidays then their own kids.

I wonder what would happen if the kids were OP's from a previous marriage and they got to go on many holidays with their father too? Would the consensus be that since they get to go on many holidays too, they shouldn't go on that trip if their step sibling doesn't get to go. I bet not, another rationale would be found to justify why it would still be acceptable to exclude the one child.

I don't think your parents should be under any obligation to invite your SS, who you see once a fortnight

Me neither, it probably never even crossed their mind. If DSS's grandparents were considering a holiday, would they be expected to invite the OP's child? Where does it end?

Why does DSS have to go on every holidays the OP's children go on, when it isn't reciprocal

That's what I was trying to say, but couldn't phrase it as neatly

I don't think there needs to be a one-size-fits-all rule for these situations, but for this one a few things jump out:

A) if you're going to fork out that much money and get into debt for it, another 460 is frankly neither here nor there. I do think though you and DH could offer to pay this - as they're paying off later, could you also pitch in stepson's share in instalments then?

B) they're being precious about the 'first holiday with all their grandchildren' (do they imagine there'll be more in the future, with more loans taken out?) Big family holidays are chaotic. One more person being there will make NO difference.

C) as he probably won't go anyway, it would be kind to at least ask him.

Petal, I think the issue is that DSS would be excluded from a family holiday that his father is attending. The OP's children attending a holiday with DSS mother or grandparents would be different as there is no family connection there bar DSS.

Personally I think in this scenario it is acceptable for DH not to attend as he may not wish to pick and choose which children he holidays with, ir he pays for DSS to go (maybe split the cost with mum).

As someone said above it is not about the number of holidays a child has but about 1 child of many missing out on a holiday with dad.

If the dh doesn't go then o/p's kids miss out on a holiday with their father, so whatever he does he is picking and choosing who he holidays with.

Dss goes on holiday without his step siblings and dad. Why do the dad/siblings have to sacrifice their holiday if dss can't go.

Kids miss out. Things are never equal.

If I were the mum i wouldn't be letting him go in term time anyway and risk being fined for someone elses holiday.

The gps are being unkind. The kind thing would have been to invite him, and then let his mum decide whether or not he could have the time out of school.

And the way the op talks about the ss going on a school trip as well as a holiday with his mum makes it sounds as though this should make up for the fact that his parents are separated. As though this is one of the 'benefits' and he should be grateful.

For anyone who doesn't know the quote from Roald Dahl about kindness, here it is:

"I think probably kindness is my number one attribute in a human being. I'll put it before any of the things like courage or bravery or generosity or anything else.

Brian Sibley: Or brains even?

Oh gosh, yes, brains is one of the least. You can be a lovely person without brains, absolutely lovely. Kindness - that simple word. To be kind - it covers everything, to my mind. If you're kind that's it.”

If the dh doesn't go then o/p's kids miss out on a holiday with their father, so whatever he does he is picking and choosing who he holidays with.

Dss goes on holiday without his step siblings and dad. Why do the dad/siblings have to sacrifice their holiday if dss can't go.

Kids miss out. Things are never equal.

My thinking is that if dad doesn't go none of the children have had a holiday with him, he hasn't picked some and not others to have quality time with.
Both sets of children will have had a least 1 holiday though. In any case the OP seems to have sorted it so that it is a family holiday for them rather than some/all of the kids missing out on a holiday with dad.

I would not leave SS at home. If he could not come with then I'm afraid our whole family would not be going.

Your parents need to accept that SS is a part of your family, and should be making an effort to get to know him.
They have very selfishly put you in a very difficult position, it sounds as if this holiday is more about them than actually spending time with family.

Leaving SS at home, or DH & SS would be harmful to your family.

I understand you feel it is a lovely opportunity for your own children, however plenty of family's can't afford holidays abroad, taking them without SS (disregarding his feelings) is teaching them to be selfish (a little bit like their grandparents are)

But given we're talking about a blended family, does DSS have to be included in every holiday his father takes?

I don't think a child needs to necessarily go on every holiday with their parent, Petal. Most blended families I know time trips to either take all the kids, or none, to limit resentment. But there would be an argument for taking some kids and not the others if the DSC are on an equivalent holiday with another parent at the time or something, sure.

But I don't think this applies in this case. Because it sounds like OP's family haven't been on a foreign holiday before. That is quite significant to many people and I understand her DH being reluctant to make a momentous trip like that without his son.

There is also the sheer numbers of people who are invited to consider. The DSS may well feel upset that his half siblings are invited, their cousins are invited, their aunt and uncles are invited - and he's not. It's very obvious that he's being purposely left out.

Someone further up mentioned various combinations of holidays taken but I don't think I've ever really seen a blended family where the combo is dad, step mum and dads children with joint/mums children left at home.

I often see SC's who have never been allowed to holiday with dad due to the overal tally of actual holidays rather than holidays with dad.

That's sad

This is not just another family holiday.

This is a big family holiday, including 13 family members and excluding only 1.

But given we're talking about a blended family, does DSS have to be included in every holiday his father takes?

Every holiday? No. But the ones which include the father's children, yes. The blended thing is a distractor - a parent has an obligation to treat his children fairly (equally is difficult due to differing needs, age etc.). Leaving one of your children out of a so-called family holiday is appalling behaviour.

And the 'where does it end...should the mother take the half sibling?' is ridiculous. Or are we saying it's ok to marry someone with children without considering those children part of your family?