I've asked MNHQ...

[ChinaCupsandSaucers]

.....if we can have a little 'note' at the top of the Stepparenting board, with a list of acronyms that cause offence - to ensure that posters get support and threads aren't sidetracked by inadvertent use of common phrases that are less welcome here on MN;

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/site_stuff/1811572-Board-notes

Allnew

No.that wasn't my arguement.
I was correcting the pooint you said I had made (which i hadn't ) for what I actually had said.

A BM signifies someone who gave birth to, but does not parent their child

That seems fairly clear as a MN definition - is there a list of acronyms we can add it to?
I know that isn't how the term is defined elsewhere on the Internet, but if that's MN convention, then surely it's just good manners to explain it to new members?

China I wouldn't like to see other as an acronym because that interpretation is a pile of bollox invented by those who wish to be offended and it validates their paranoia to have it "officially" recognised

They'd only find something else about the SPACE board to get offended at.

Sp board not space board

It's quite simple.

Birth Mother is the appropriate term for a mother who is not involved in the child's life. Such as in adoption and where there is an absent mother. The implication is that they gave birth to the child and that's all. Where the mother is involved in raising their child they are the mother - no further qualification required. There is only one mother.

It is offensive in the same was as referring to the birth mother as the "real" mother in an adoption, when it is obviously the adoptive mother who is fulfilling the role of mother.

With most terms that are found offensive, there will always be people who say "Oh, I'm OK with it so I'll keep using it, even though you and a good number of others have told me it is found offensive." That doesn't make it right.

I don't view all step mothers as evil. That would be stupid. There are good ones and bad ones, ones that love their step children and ones that clearly hate them.

psycho So what if it is? The reality is that here on MN, the culture is to soundly berate (and in some cases abuse) anyone who uses the term. The reasons for that are irrelevant, really!
So why shouldn't new members be warned?

It's all very well saying - ah, but they are making it up, it's not a phrase that can cause offence - but it certainly creates a viceral response from some.

Theexisapsychocunt No, I am not paranoid and no, I have not invented something to get offended about.

soup I don't think the issue of whether some find it offensive is under debate.
To be fair, this thread has proved that it is more offensive to some than swearing and disablist language.

The issue is how to share that with new members in light of the fact that elsewhere on the Internet it is accepted language that features in FAQs and acronym lists. MN members have proven that this is such an offensive a term that its use overrides their ability to temper their posts and permanently affects their judgement of MN members who use it, even inadvertantly.

China yes and when I was a regular SP poster I used to send a polite pm to the "offending" poster explaining how although I didn't bother me the use of "bm" drives some posters wild.

However as explained in my earlier post about parallel threads - simply being a SP is enough to get the backs up of people on mumsnet.

I've been absent from mumssnet for years - this is a row which has been done to death (interestingly with some of the same posters).

At one point it was agreed to use TM (the mother) - which was slightly toungue in cheek.

This attempt to DICTATE to posters what they meant when they posted is distasteful - as if a poster knows better than the OP the OPs own mind

SPs have always been hammered here on mumssnet - stopping using BMP won't change that.

And it's not the whole of mumssnet who find it offensive its a few specific and vocal posters

I don't think the issue of whether some find it offensive is under debate

I didn't say it was.

Its not an ossie of whether BM is offensive - its an ossie of whether some posters can read other posters minds and a mumsnet culture that the SP board is open season for abusing the posters who need other.

On no other part of mumsnet does this happen.

As I said I think it hits at people's deep root hidden fears and exposes prejudices they may not even be consciously aware they have.

I didn't say it was.

Sorry soup I must have misunderstood - I read your post as an explaination of why the term was offensive to you.

The thing I don't get is why MN members such as yourself aren't calling for new member guidance from HQ about this?
If posters agree that the term is offensive to them, and even acknowledge that it is widely used in a different context elsewhere on the web, why shouldn't new members be given guidance to avoid offending you?

I can understand why psycho has such a cynical view of the situation - it's almost as if those who are offended don't want MNHQ to explain the impact the phrase has because those who are offended want the continued opportunity to berate and abuse members who use it!

Rubbish.

It has bog all to do with "mind reading" because there are things which are offensive regardless of intent.

Interesting how you whinge about the perceived lack of respect for step parents yet don't think others need to be treated with respect.

I'm not whinging on soup dragon - I'm just not as easily bullied as some of the other posters Herr.

And yes it is about mind reading.

Poster A uses BM
Poster B says poster A is being offensive
Poster A says no I only meant this
Poster B strarts telling poster A exactly what they meant and what a terrible and evil person they are at a tines when poster A is already vulnerable

Suggesting Poster B has read poster As mind and knows it better than poster A does

Until last week I had only ever seen the term birth mother used for someone who had given birth to a child and then the child was adopted. My use of mumsnet is quite extensive but I don't tend to use other parenting forums so had no idea it is generally used to refer to the woman who gave birth to children but who is still very much in their lives.

I have no idea how XHs girlfriend refers to me but I hope not as the DCs birth mother - as I am the RP I see that as rather insulting. I have brought it up on a thread here recently as I hadn't realised how it was in common usage and thought the poster was using it in an insulting way rather than just not realising its not the best thing to say. Mother works fine - it's presumably fairly obvious that I am the person who gave birth to them, looking at the stretch marks

The thing I don't get is why MN members such as yourself aren't calling for new member guidance from HQ about this?

Personally, it's because I didn't expect those using the term to be so dense that they can't deal with the fact that it is inappropriate to use it to describe an involved parent.

And yes, I was explaining why it is offensive. Mainly because of the repeated calls, even late in the thread, for an explanation. It's not to to with whether some find it offensive but why. I note that posters are still trying to justify it though.

Except, of course, Poster B doesn't necessarily say they know what the person was thinking do they? It could just as easily go

A: BM
B: That's actually rather offensive
A: Oh, sorry, I meant X but I won't use it again
B: Great

No mind reading required.

But Miranda in real life - no one uses acronyms - so it is completely different - in real life she probably uses your name or says their mum etc.

And there you go again Soup Dragon - mumsnet decidewhat is and what iisn't offensive not the self appointed mumsnet police.

Is it not an issue that posters are scared to post that they are SPs because they know they will get a totally different reaction if they drop that into their post.

Mumsnet has always seen open season on SPs.

Try going into L.P. and constantly challenging their terminology - you'd get laughed off the board

But I was referring to the most recent exAmple I have just read - which was the situation in my post and not yours Soup Dragon.

BM when used by a step mum is offensive. When I post on the step parent forum (as I am a step mum) I try & not use any acronyms at all as I find it gets confusing! If I ever do I tend to refers to my DSS mum as either DH EX or just DSS mum.

The point I think that may be being missed here however is that BM is apparently a widely used acronym on other sites & that new posters here may not be aware that it is considered disrespectful here. To have it pointed out & then let the original point of the thread continue would surely be the best way to approach.

There are very forceful posters in step parenting, as I said I'm a step mum but rarely post in step parenting partly because I have an easy natural relationship with my step sons, & partly because it really is a battlefield. I'm not quite sure why.

And why should A be dictated to? I don't think it's offensive - I am secure enough in my parenting of my children not to care what term is used to describe me.

stillslightly I have seen people pilloried for using DH EX.

She is not DH EX she is their MOTHER etc etc.

Personally, it's because I didn't expect those using the term to be so dense that they can't deal with the fact that it is inappropriate to use it to describe an involved parent.

And that's my point. Even though its use is encouraged elsewhere on the Internet, when its used here on MN, users are referred to as dense/ignorant/thoughtless, which creates anything but a supportive environment.

But I was referring to the most recent exAmple I have just read - which was the situation in my post and not yours Soup Dragon.

Perhaps you should have made it clear that it was one example and not general then.

And why should A be dictated to?

Why should any of us moderate our behaviour in order to get along? It's called being considerate of others. If a term is found offensive, the benefit to the general community of not using it is greater than any loss of freedom of speech on the part of those using it.

Saying "Oh, I'm happy with it so it's OK" is just plain stupid. That doesn't apply to any other offensive use of a term and it doesn't apply here. It just makes the person saying it seem rather obtuse.