NOW CLOSED: Talk to Unum about "The Right Time to Talk About a Back Up Plan" - you could win a £250 Amazon voucher

[AnnMumsnet]

Following on from the challenge Unum set MNers earlier this year we've now been asked by them to ask your opinions on "The Right Time to Talk about a Back Up Plan".

A Back Up Plan is all about knowing what you'd be entitled to from:

a) your employer
b) any protection policies you have and/or
c) the state (existing benefits you may receive and also any you'd be entitled to due to the change in circumstance)

... should you or your partner be unexpectedly unable to do paid work due to illness or injury.

Unum say "Most of us manage to get by on our monthly wage with some savings for a rainy day, but what would you do if you became ill or were injured and had to stay off work for a long period of time? We know it might be a bit daunting to think about this. But we want to get Mumsnetters talking about Back Up Plans, like income protection - and how and when is the best time to ask about this and start to put something into place".

Unum have produced a guide for helping create a Back Up Plan - please take a few minutes to look at the information on this from Unum and let us know what you think.

~ Have you had this discussion with your workplace? Has your DP/DH?
~ At what point would/did you negotiate your benefits at work - was it when you started, or maybe when you returned to work after maternity leave? Or have you - or would you - raise it at an appraisal?
~ Have you thought about or considered what benefits you or your family would be entitled to should you have to be off work sick, or if your DP was off sick? What do you think you'd get and how would you find out about it?
~ What impact does the recession have on your views of this?
~ If you've successfully asked your employer about this what tips would you pass on?
~ If you're an employer yourself what do you think about this?

For more information on Unum please click here
We have some MN bloggers working on this too and you can read their blogs here and here

Any other comments welcome. If you have questions for Unum please visit twitter.com/askunum

Everyone who adds their comments and experiences to this thread will be entered into a prize draw where one winner will get a £250 Amazon voucher.

Thanks and good luck
MNHQ

We review on a regular basis, I'm due to go on mat leave shortly and DP on a temporary rolling contract so it's something that is rarely far from our minds!

I haven't discussed it at work, but I have read my entitlements on the intranet and completed the forms for death in service etc. My husband is the same. We both work for very large organisations and neither of us really has any bargaining power there; although the back up plans are good, we just have to take what we're given. We do have critical illness protection and life insurance to cover mortgage instalments.

I have no idea what we would do if this was to happen or who we would turn to. We would be unable to turn to family unlike before as they are now struggling after the recession.

Since times became hard i have been saving all i can. We have been living off as little as we can and saving every penny possible to have a little to fall back on if we were to loose our incomes at any stage.

We haven't spoken to our employers about this nor have they asked. If they were to ask i would be really stuck. I wouldn't know what to say to them really i would just explain what i have above.

Where benefits are concerned, we have looked into what we would be entitled to but it is so little we wouldn't be able to live on them let alone rely on them. We also dont feel safe including them into a plan due to the benefit cuts and more being spoken about in the near future.

We have considered taking out insurance to cover ourselves but i think that if i am paying a certain amount per month, its such a risk knowing if i would ever have to take advantage of claiming that if i did have to for any reason i would then be able to use the money i have saved through not having to pay out for a policy!

We have got income protection which we took out when we had our first child - but now can't afford a private pension!! Now I worry that we are covered if something happens to one of us but not if we get old, which is hopefully more likely!!

Have you had this discussion with your workplace? Has your DP/DH?

both myself and DH work in the public sector so there is no negotiation

~ At what point would/did you negotiate your benefits at work - was it when you started, or maybe when you returned to work after maternity leave? Or have you - or would you - raise it at an appraisal?

As above

~ Have you thought about or considered what benefits you or your family would be entitled to should you have to be off work sick, or if your DP was off sick? What do you think you'd get and how would you find out about it?

We are lucky with the provision offered in the public sector and also have critical illness cover for anything more long term

~ What impact does the recession have on your views of this?

None really - money is a concern generally but not in regard to benefits

~ If you've successfully asked your employer about this what tips would you pass on? - n/a
~ If you're an employer yourself what do you think about this?- n/a

we've had the discussions but have stuck our heads in the sand because we both have inflexible employers and neither of us have any policies which would help us. Guess we need to progress beyond discussions and sand. Hmm.

I don't work but I employ people. We always make sure we have the cashflow to pay them for at least three months in the event of any financial disasters and have enough cash ourselves to live for a year without drastically cutting back.

This is a complaint that was sent by The Black Triangle Campaign to the UK Office of Fair Trade regarding Unum...

The FSA received the same complaint, could this be why Unum stopped marketing it's private policies?

I'd suggest reading it, alongside the links in it before giving Unum 1 penny for anything, never mind Income Protection Insurance.

I write to you as the Scottish Representative of the Office of Fair Trading on behalf of the Edinburgh based disability rights campaign group Black Triangle which has serious concerns regarding the fairness, (and legality), of Unum Insurance?s involvement in the UK income protection, (disability), insurance market when they have been advising the UK Government, (via the DWP), on welfare reforms since 1994 to the present time.

For reference to this please check out the following pages on our website ?

Marketing Campaign

blacktrianglecampaign.org/2011/08/21/unum-unveils-consumer-campaign/

This also mentions the Guardian/Unum tie up, with The Guardian being one of the only newspapers that was campaigning against Atos?s involvement in the benefits assessment programme, (until the above mentioned Unum tie up that is).

Marketing Master Class for it?s Financial Advisors

blacktrianglecampaign.org/2011/09/15/unums-game-plan/

This page references what Unum describe as ?A Master Class? to their Financial Advisors?, (Salesmen), in which they advise them that the current welfare reforms, (that they advised on), are something that can be used as a ?sales tool? for want of a better description.

Atos ? A Conflict of Interests?

blacktrianglecampaign.org/2011/10/01/unum-the-dwp-conflicts-of-interest-insider-trading/

An ?editorial? type article outlining Black Triangle?s general concerns re Unum?s involvement in the income protection, (disability), insurance market.

Denies Profiting from Welfare Reforms

blacktrianglecampaign.org/2011/10/07/insurance-giant-denies-welfare-reform-will-boost-its-profits/

Unum?s denial to John Pring, (of www.disabilitynewsservice.com), that they are profiting from the current welfare reforms with Black Triangle?s view being, (on the evidence that we have), that Unum?s involvement as advisors to the DWP was grossly understated by the Unum executives to John?s enquiries.

See Also ? Atos : Unum Connections

blacktrianglecampaign.org/2011/09/05/the-uk-a-country-of-second-chances/

Mike O?Donnell, Chief Medical Officer of Atos Healthcare.

Check out who the Chief Financial Officer of Unum Insurance UK is too.

And ?

blacktrianglecampaign.org/2011/08/23/important-read-circulate/

www.whywaitforever.com/dwpatosveterans.html

blacktrianglecampaign.org/2011/09/07/new-labour-the-market-state-and-the-end-of-welfare/

BBC Has internal Unum documents claiming that they are influencing UK Government policy.

blacktrianglecampaign.org/2011/08/20/bbc-10pm-news-6th-november-2007-transcript-news-article-unum/

And the attached report by Mo Stewart which was distributed to 360 members of The House of Lords prior to the 2nd reading of the Welfare Reform bill and referenced during the debate by several of them.

For information regarding the Unum scandal in the US may I suggest the book ?Insult to Injury, Insurance, Fraud & the Business of Bad Faith that was recommended to me by Prof Dan Feldman, (Professor of Law, Yale University), who was the special prosecutor of the New York DA?s office which negotiated the legal settlement on behalf of 38 US states with Unum as the definitive general description of what went on ?

blacktrianglecampaign.org/2011/09/03/coming-to-the-uk-soon-insult-to-injury-insurance-fraud-the-big-business-of-bad-faith/

If you understand how Atos is operating in the UK, you only have to read the first 30 pages of this book to see that they are operating in exactly the same way as Unum was in the US prior to them being prosecuted, fined, ordered to pay $100?s of millions in compensation and reopen over 300,000 claims

Black Triangle have serious and genuine concerns regarding Unum Insurance?s position in the UK income protection insurance market with all the evidence that we have seen indicating that this has been a long term plan that has included infiltrating the DWP to enter the UK market for their products.

We request that the Office of Fair Trading use the considerable powers it has to investigate this matter fully and take any necessary action.

Im due to return to work shortly after a long period of mental health issues. Luckily whilst off work we could get by on DP's earnings however it has made me think what if DP was also ill or worse if he lost his job, and consequently we have started to plan for a "back-up". We had a private income protection policy which turned out to be useless when i was off sick due to small print exclusions so I would be very wary of paying for any such policy again.

A policy offered through your employer however is another matter and one which I would perhaps consider if the small print and details all stood up to a thorough examination! I doubt though whether my employers would pay for such a scheme as this one proposed, they are a small private company who don't even offer a pension scheme. How could I approach them with the idea?

Reading this back I think I need to look for a new job!

This thread's been a revelation! Trust MN to have lots of well-informed posters to highlight the real issues... Which I knew nothing about...

Long-term sickness for many is devastating & life-changing with companies taking zero responsibility for their employees in some cases.

Still something to think about on a personal level ...

DH refuses to discuss a backup plan. He has previously indicated (even before the recession) that it just causes him to stress. As a family, we only have his income to live on at the moment. I like, so many others, can not imagine how we would get by if something happened. If something did happen (as it did to my grandparents and parents - illness/horrific work related accidents), we would manage somehow, you have to - that is what I need to believe. It would be impossible to ascertain how DH's employers would behave in such circumstances. I find the thread interesting, but rather worrying and depressing to read. I would suggest insurance providers are not benevolent charities, but appear in the majority of cases to be money grapping and willl manipulate events/circumstances to hold on to as much money as they can possibly manage.

I work for the NHS so benefits aren't negotiable but I know that sick pay is full pay for six months and half pay for six months. So that's good.

I have no idea how much sick pay dh would get if ill. Will ask him when he gets home.

We have a critical illness cover but I think it only covers certain conditions and things like losing a leg. So I know we can't rely on it.

We have a couple of years of salary worth of savings so could use that if really stuck.

Thanks for all the comments. The name out of the hat was mrsbunnyw and she wins the £250 Amazon voucher - well done.