Autism signs & advice 23 months

[Newmomma2705]

Hi
Just looking for a bit of help and advice really. My DD will be 23 months this week and is showing some traits of autism. She has already had a referral to a peadeatrician from the health visitor after expressing my concerns however due to the current pandemic nay not be seen for a long time due to back log. She has had a hearing test which was inconclusive however I don't believe there is a problem with hearing. She has had a referral to SALT however same situation she won't be seen until everything open again.
I am extremely worried about autism although I know it's not the end of the world and am actually a Peadeatric nurse so have met many autistic children it's hard to deal with it being your own and not something you expected. I am not sleeping at night I feel like I assess everything that she does and I love her to absolute pieces and dony let her see my worry it's always on my mind and I feel like this is taking her being a toddler away from me.

My concerns are-

• only responds to her name occasionally
• No real words at all, babbles constantly. (Hasn't lost words just has never said any yet)
• doesn't point at all. She reaches or looks at what she wants and looks back at us or just cries looking at the object (of pulls on our clothes and pushes us to whatever she wants)
• her attention isn't great. She does give eye contact and keeps it if it's something she's interested in (nursery rhymes/ animal sounds/ hide and seek)
• not interested in people or childre

Other info-
No sensory issues enjoys messy play, not bothered about loud noises etc
Doesn't hand flap, spin or any of the other stimming behaviours (that I've noticed)
Eats well will try new things & no sleep issues
Attend nursery and there only concern at the moment is her attention.
She loves books but doesn't point things out
She enjoys playing with her stackers, building blocks, shape sorters. This week she has copied us sweeping with her broom, started pouring cups of tea and putting dolly down the slide and laughing but no more pretend play as such.

I don't really know what I'm looking for maybe just signs your little ones has autism? Could this just be a language / communication thing or is that not a thing? Thanks x

Hi @Harmos and Newmomma2705, for us everything changed when Ds began to speak, probably at around 3.5 yrs. It is incredible how all-encompassing language delay can be.

One of the red flags had been that SALT and paediatrician always described him as a child 'with his own agenda'. He didn't do the shared attention thing at all prior to his speech development. He generally responded to his name, but not always. He didn't distinguish between trusted family members and strangers, and would happily go to wander off with anyone who paid him any attention.

If he wanted my attention, he would take me by the hand and lead me to it. He also had some minor sensory issues, chewing his sleeves and an aversion to loud noises. He would even put his hands over his ears in his sleep, if there was a loud noise.

Also, when he develop speech there was a lot of echolalia, plus what he would describe as his 'random stuff' using phrases completely out of context, and reciting large tracts of radio and tv ads.

Funnily enough he still does this to an extent, and we all find it a completely endearing trait. I appreciate we are lucky, he is popular and witty with lots of friends. And while ADHD is significantly debilitating, it is so far removed than the potential prognosis we were given when he was three.

Please feel free to pm me, or ask me anything on this thread. I often feel I have an obligation to tell his story, as it's one of real hope.

@Newmomma2705 Apologies I didn't mean to steal your thread
@Pomegranatemolasses
Can't thank you enough, will PM you for more, are you in UK? will save typing if you are ok to speak over the phone?

I'm actually in Ireland @Harmos. I really feel your pain - very similar to what we went through with Ds at that age.

Has anyone got a toddler who spits? Could this be a symptom?

He has done this for a long time but just recently he is doing it all the time, I'm wondering if it's because of lockdown boredom?

He was two in January. Before Xmas I got the health visitors round to do an assessment early and also got them to put in a referral to the paediatrician.

He is non-verbal. Doesn't understand much. Is very full-on.

Hi, you mean actual spitting and not drooling? I must admit the number of google searches ive done ive not come across this. Is your dc not behaving as such due to a bad taste in his mouth? Does he lick toys or put toys on his mouth or lick shiny metal which can leave a bad taste thus making him spit? Or maybe he has a nutrient deficiency which gives him a bad taste in his mouth, like iron deficiency? Sorry cant help more.

Yes actual spitting. He spits randomly on the floor, up against walls etc. He also spits when he gets told off for something.

This last few weeks he's been doing it even more than usual so I'm guessing frustration/boredom.

He bites too. A lot. All the time, not just when he's angry. He bites randomly. Like he would be climbing on me then just bite me for no reason. Sometimes you think aw he's coming in for a cuddle and he'll bite me on the shoulder!

He doesn't really play with toys.

And some toys it's like he doesn't see the whole toy for what it is, for example he has a toy vacuum but he won't play with it 'properly' he will just press the buttons and switches on it or mess with the wheels. Even though we've shown him how to play with it lots.

Never pointed or waves etc. Can't get him to wave at all.

Gets angry very quickly. Absolutely zero patience with anything.
If we get in the car and i don't start off literally straight away he will kick off.

Same when he was in the pram and we were out somewhere, literally the second I stopped pushing the pram for whatever reason he would kick off ....

I'll stop because I could go on and on

@ReturnofSaturn, the biting is probably sensory seeking behaviour. has he any chew toys which could be a less painful option for this?

@ReturnofSaturn

It sounds like its just a behaviour issue where he is not yet in control of his mind yet. From what I've been reading, receptive language Shared attention pointing/gestures are all from the same area of the brain, so if this is yet to be developed, we almost have an uncontrolled person who will behave to his own agenda. As to why he bites, its probably because he is yet to be "disciplined" that this is not ok. Everytime he bites just slam your own hand onto yourself showing some anger so that he starts to put 2 and 2 that biting makes you angry/not ok. Try that and see if it works. I am not an expert but I don't know other way how you would give him the message that biting is not ok.

As to why he bites, its probably because he is yet to be "disciplined" that this is not ok. Everytime he bites just slam your own hand onto yourself showing some anger so that he starts to put 2 and 2 that biting makes you angry/not ok

Please don’t do this. Just calmly and firmly every time tell him that we don’t bite, biting hurts.

If he’s not doing it in anger then I agree, it’s likely a sensory issue or to get a response.

You can buy a picture book called Teeth are not for biting from Amazon. Read it to him a lot.

we almost have an uncontrolled person who will behave to his own agenda

This child is only just two years old. Of course his brain is not fully developed.

Yes he has been disciplined actually. We have tried bloody everything.

ReturnofSaturn how long has the biting been happening for?

My ds (autistic, 6yo) went through two periods of biting, though only when he was angry or frustrated. One at around 18m and again just past 2yo. The second one lasted a few months. He would also pinch. We bought teeth are not for biting (and hands are not for hitting...) and read it to him every day for quite some time. Eventually I think he just grew out of it. He is a bit different to your ds as he is very verbal and has good receptive language but as a young child he struggled to express his anger and frustration in an appropriate way. It can be very difficult and upsetting to deal with but hopefully it will pass.

If you haven’t already seen it, this is a good guide to sensory related issues.

www.falkirk.gov.uk/services/social-care/disabilities/docs/young-people/Making%20Sense%20of%20Sensory%20Behaviour.pdf?v=201507131117

As to why he bites, its probably because he is yet to be "disciplined" that this is not ok. Everytime he bites just slam your own hand onto yourself showing some anger so that he starts to put 2 and 2 that biting makes you angry/not ok.

Don't do this!! This is terrible advice. This is not how to deal with any child nevermind a non verbal child. He is only 2.

Ds was totally non verbal till 9.5 years old, he has a handful of words now. We've had a number of these issues over the years.

Calmly but firmly tell him 'no' and direct him to something he can chew. If he has limited to no understanding keep it simple.

It could be communication related frustration, looking for a reaction or a sensory need if he's not angry (this sounds more likely). Ds used to bite and it was a sensory need. Encouraging him to bite a chewy tube eventually stopped it. We tried a number of chews before we found one that gave him what he needed.

As for spitting, that was the worst one. Ds was a little older when we had that one so we could use social stories. Is he spitting for a reaction? Have you tried totally ignoring this behaviour? Easier said than done!

That was in paragraphs, silly phone!

Knew the experts will come to the rescue😀

Biggreen87 knows what they are talking about.
Spitting was definitely a sensory thing for my son - he had a fascination with water and he would spit on things like windows and mirrors and then smear it with his hand.

As Ive said and repeat, knew the experts will come to the rescue, however my suggestion was from my expectation that the parent would have already tried the 'firm No' being suggested.

Yes read a lot on google aa this is new to us, and not in the paediatric field, and yes still do not wish autism on my worst enemy (no offence intended). Op also clearly concerned about autism.

Won't say more on this thread.

Yes we have tried ignoring the spitting but he still does it. To be honest I think he would still do it if no one was there. It's like he enjoys it in a way.

A lot of the time with the biting it's almost like he doesn't even realise he's doing it.

Unfortunately there’s no magic wand that is going to stop a child biting overnight, especially if the child is not neurotypical. It takes time, patience and consistency.

Artie made a good point. Does he touch his spit after spitting?

Sorry, that was in response to Harmos.

Sometimes he touches and plays with it. Sometimes he doesn't.

My DT2 has Aspergers and has a twin who is NT so we had someone to compare DT2 to when he was little which made us even more paranoid .
Reading about shared attention brought it all back to me. DS is now 18 but I remember it like it was yesterday . He was referred at 12 months , because although he was meeting most milestones he was always at the lower end of what was considered normal. Late to pull himself up, crawl , wave etc . At that stage it was clear he had some sensory issues , nothing major but he liked to watch waves, didn't like loud noises etc. To be honest I felt from when he was only a few months old that he was not NT and I had no experience of other children apart from DT1. He had some occupational and speech therapy between 12 months and 2.5 years . During that time he developed appropriate speech , displayed shared attention, pointed , waved , walked and was discharged at 2.5 years
However I was still not convinced in my heart and at school it was clear he needed help with concentration and had difficulty processing information .
It wasn't until he was 10 that he was eventually diagnosed with ASD .
I tell my story , just to show that there doesn't have to be a total absence of certain development skills , like shared attention, pointing , turn taking , speech , in order for ASD to be there . Sometimes they are a bit delayed or a bit disordered . Eg , although DT2 wasn't delayed in speech and did use it appropriately , he also repeated stuff a lot . His imaginative play was somewhat repetitive also but not entirely . I knew that he didn't have a speech disorder or GDD but I could see that there were elements of these conditions that fitted .
He has never had a tantrum in his life , was never set in his ways as a toddler , although now I would say he likes routine to a certain extent and has specific interests .
He completed A levels last year and is now studying ICT . He is a very empathetic young man who has a very strong sense of who he is and his strengths and weaknesses . He also is very observant about his ASD and the ASD of others that he has come across.
I would say , trust your instinct . Many people reassured me and I reassured myself when looking at development milestones but in my heart I knew that something wasn't quite right .

Thank you @Teawaster very helpful info and glad your son is doing so well now.