6 year old with language problems, possible ASD asking me to stab him because he is not a real boy :(

[JustPondering]

Hi, my son is 6 and has a language disorder and maybe ASD but who knows, we have just been re-referred to a peadiatrician to find out. H e has phonological language disorder, receptive and expressive language delays and problems with social understanding.

Recently he has been bursting into tears a lot, which is quite normal for him but what he has been saying worries me, he keeps saying he is just a silly boy and that he is naughty. He has also asked me tonight to go get a knife and stab him because he is not a real boy He is having problems at school at the moment, he is finding it hard to read and he keeps getting told off for not sitting still, being too loud and hurting peoples feelings.

I am really worried about his seemingly low self-esteem, this is quite unusual for him as he has always been so happy and extremely confident. i don't know what to do, should i wait for his appointment with the peadiatricain to come through or go back to the GP and ask them to refer to CAMHS?

His appt has taken so long, he was referred ages ago but he was referred to the wrong place so the GP had to re-send the referral. He has a speech therapy appt on tuesday so i don't know if i should mention it to them, I'm not sure if they can do anything though.

He sounds very upset and anxious and the root cause seems to be school. It sounds like his school environment is not meeting his needs and is being positively damaging to his emotional well-being , poor little boy.
School needs to be aware of how he is feeling and they need to be actively seeking ways to support him academically, socially and emotionally within school.
CAMHS could be helpful but what needs to happen first and foremost and ASAP is for you to request an urgent meeting with school to share your concern about what is happening with him and to demand that school takes immediate action to better support him. Does he have an education statement? Has an education psychologist been involved? If not these things need to happen. Has there been a SENCO involved - they might be a good person to speak to first off.

Good luck and I hope school becomes more supportive and fast.

Big Hugs to the wee fella :( x

Has this started since he went back to school or was he like this in class last school year?

I would go and see the Head and I'd be keeping him home until something changed. He's 6 - keeping him home until it's sorted wont hurt his education and will help his emotional development. They need to take action, and PDQ.

No he doesn't have a statement, he was getting along fine in reception but is getting difficult and is struggling now he is in year 1. I feel that his problems are only just beginning to be taken seriously. The SENCO has put in a referral to an educational psychologist but I believe the waiting lists are long. He has only just got an IEP. He is also having some formal assesments on tuesday with speech therapy to assess his higher language skills.

He had IEPs at his old school and a CAF report as he was under a peadiatrician but since he has started at his new school there has been nothing until this last month. I had to request the IEP myself and it focuses purely on his phonics.

I'm not sure what to say to the school, he has been off school most of last week as he has been feeling unwell, he is upset that he has to go back on monday. I will speak to his teacher on monday when i drop him off. Although I would rather keep him at home with me if he is feeling like this but I know this won't help in the long run.

No he was absolutely fine in reception, he had problems with being loud and with his language but he was happy.

I really do want to keep him at home but I don't want to make it worse I suppose.

I would keep him home Monday & take him in myself for the tests on Tuesday. I would ring the Head on Monday, explain the situation and ask for someone to be available to keep an eye on him (not the class teacher) while you have a private discussion with the Senco, after his tests, on Tuesday.

It could be that it's something that would have happened anyway as he got a bit older (and his peers got a bit older) but frankly it sounds like the new school aren't doing all they should be/could be.

Hello Justpondering, is there any more you could tell us about his behaviour ie at home with other people/children. It's just so sad that he should feel this way. Keep a diary daily if possible and ask school to do a home school diary. Often year 1 is when problems begin to surface in asd children.

I have posted on here before about him. His behaviour at home varies really, he can be very loving and sweet, he is also prone to emotional outbursts over seemingly nothing, for example he will start screaming if his older brother so much as touches his arm when he doesnt want him to. He is also emotional when happy, he crys with happiness when he gets a new toy

He has recently started tip-toe pacing in front of the TV, which is new for him, only started since returning to school. He watches TV upside down every time and spins for an extraordinary amount of time and never gets dizzy. He can not sit still at all unless he is watching TV. He has no volume control.

He can make friends initially but he falls out with them often as DS always has to be in charge and has to choose every game. He is very controlling. He has recently started stealing food when he is supposed to be in bed and he is definately not hungry he eats like a horse yet he is very slim, he has been finding the food in the hamper we put together for christmas every year. He still wets the bed and is on medication for this.

He spends most of the day at home in imaginary play, he plays with action figures mostly.

It is getting hard to take him anywhere as he runs all over the place, says inappropriate things to people, and if we have to wait in a queue he rolls around on the floor or sways and tries to grab leaflets and things, it is very stresfull.

He can't always recognise people he has always got my 2 sisters mixed up who look nothing like each other and 1 of them are here daily. He also gets 2 of my friends mixed up with each other and 2 of his friends.

I asked him why he thinks he isn't a real boy, he says its because he doesn't know a lot of stuff and he can't ride a bike. He said he doesn't want to go back to school until he can read. Then he changed his mind and gave me a bizaare explanation about water in his belly and knifes get people away and water.

He has speech therapy at a health centre not in school on tuesday.

Hi Just, there are quite a few red flags in your description of your Ds. When are you next seeing the paed?

I would recommend keeping a diary of his quirks/issues and how you deal with them. I found that my diary made the proffs sit up and take notice of what we were trying to deal with on a daily basis.
I agree with what others have said about the school not meeting his needs. You definitely need to meet with the HT and or SENCO.
Good luck

Not even got his appt through yet it was meant to be on 2nd November but he had been referred to the wrong sort of peadiatricain so it had to be sent again to the child development team. He was under a peadiatrician till he started reception but he never got sent for ADOS as the peadiatrician thought he would pass and said that he was imaginative. I am going to insist he gets assessed this time though. My younger son is seeing the same child development team on 26th oct so i might ask the peadiatrician about him then but I guess they would make me wait for his own appt.

I have taken lots of videos of him as he only toe walks at home in front of the TV and when barefoot on the hard floor in the kitchen.

I will ask for another meeting with the SENCO on monday.

I would definitely mention it at the CDC, they might be able to advise you.
I had to chase appointments for Dd3 many times. I would give the paeds secretary a ring and check that they have received the referral.
I am dead cheeky and always ask if we can be contacted if there is a cancellation as i am available at short notice. We have just skipped the podiatry waiting list in this way.
Good luck

I am going to ring school before 9 today and hopefully SENCO will be there. He keeps eating leaves and twigs at school, his older brother has seen him a few times, can I ask that someone keeps an eye on him at playtime? I can't imagine it's very healthy to be eating twigs.

Good idea about asking to be told of any cancellations! Definitely going to do that, I am usually available at short notice.

How did you get on?

As for 'keeping him safe' (not eating leaves) at breaktimes, I would imagine it would be part of what they need to provide for a child with SN wouldn't you.

Hi, went well, the head and the SENCO where in a meeting this morning so I went and took DS to school and the SENCO rang me back, she agrees that he sounds like he is feeling bad and it seems to be related to school, we are having a meeting today at 3.15, that is with the SENCO, the class teacher and the pastoral teacher. Will update later. She said someone will keep an eye out for him at playtime.

DS went into school saying he had to be very brave at school and that it would be hard to sit still on the carpet as it is very lumpy, bless him.

Glad you are feeling positive Just and hope your meeting this afternoon goes well.

Bless him about the lumpy carpet. Ask them to give him a move a sit cushion. Ours works wonders for fidgetpants Dd3.

JP just wanted to say (((hugs))) for what you are going through and how distressed your little man seems. Hope the school are taking this seriously now and keeping a proper eye on him. Agree you need proper ADOS assessment ASAP. He sounds lovely btw. Big from me.
HW xxxxxx

Hi the meeting went well, the SENCO told me to request a particualar peadiatrician and go to the GP for a urgent referral to CAMHS as we couldn't wait for the peadiatrician appt.

We went to the GP today who spoke to DS, DS told her that he wanted to die so he would know what it feels like as he's never been dead before, so she said "yes but you would miss all you family wouldn't you?" he said "well no, because I would be dead and wouldn't be able to feel anything or think anything". She asked him what he thought dead was and if anything was bothering him and he told her that school was bothering him every day.

GP said that he is a bit young for CAMHS but she feels he needs some assessments doing so has referred him, she also chased up the appt with peadiatrician and that is on the 5th november. She also told me to keep any knifes out of reach. He also has to do some urine samples because he is wetting the bed still.

been a productive day as he had his assessments with speech today too but they haven't been scored yet, although he didn't seem to do so well on the part where he had to give logical explanations and the literal language part, he seemed to do okay on the story re-telling part.

Hi, sorry I've not been back, visitors from overseas hampering my MNing!!

I'm glad the meeting went well!

Wow - I'm very impressed that he was able to speak to the GP like that, lots of kids just clam up.

A bit young for CAMHS? I'm surprised by that, but very glad she referred him anyway & that she chased up the Pead. When my godson was going through a phase of wanting to kill himself (he had had a serious head injury - he is now partially recovered, will never be 100%, but has stopped wanting to kill himself!) we had to hide all of the knives, glasses, all kinds of things - he was older (15) so more creative with his planning. It was a fucking awful time, but we got through it - you will too (totally different I know, but still horrible!).

Let me/us know how yesterdays tests went when you find out.

Is he at school today? If he is, how was he about going?

He was fine going into school yesterday, said he didn't want to go but got over it fast. He came home with a chunk of hair missing though! he gave himself a hair cut because apparently he didn't have that colour (hair colour) and wanted it.

I don't think he would actually try to kill himself, he just seems obsessed with the idea of death. They are strange thoughts to be having at the age of 6 I think. I will definitely be keeping knives out of reach anyway though.He told the doctor that school bothers him everyday too.

Oh no. Oh well, I suppose that right now a bit of hair is the least of your worries though... just a small 'oh fuck'.

I know combined with everything else the 'wanting to be dead' thing is a worry, but many kids go through this weird phase, a bit obsessed with death or rather 'being' dead, how it feels, what it means etc - all kids can be a bit odd

I still can't believe how honest and open he was with the Dr, it's good as it's moved the referrals along more quickly!

Any idea how he got on with the speach assessments?

Yes I was very surprised at what he said to the doctor, but she did ask him very specific questions, like why do you want to be stabbed and he said because he doesnt know what it feels like, and she asked him if he would miss everyone and he said no because when your dead you cant think anything. She also asked him if he knew what happened when you die and he said you go to god and live in a star. She then asked him if anything was bothering him at home or at school and he said yes at school.She asked him if heliked his teacher. She said to him that if he got help at school would he still want to stab himself and he said no. Doctor said he could do with having some assessments done.

She also asked him how old his brothers where and DS answered with "my brother is sometimes nice and sometimes silly like me"

No idea how he went on with the assesments I think the results will be posted with a report, I will post the results on here though. She said that he couldn't seem to give a good explanation for things and that even a very young child should be able to give a logical explanation. But she didn't have time to score while we were there as we were running late.

I have to say he doesn't seem depressed at all, so maybe it is just an idea he has got from somewhere. He does cry a lot, but that is normal for him, he has always been over emotional.

It sounds horrible what was happening to your godson, must have been very scary. See I don't actually think DS would actually try to hurt himself, but who knows.

It sounds like a brilliant appointment, where she asked good questions and he knew how he felt and felt confident to say it. Great start.

LOL re the brothers!

The assessments - well, maybe he was just having an off day or the assessor made him uncomfortable and he didn't feel confident answering? Be interesting to see the 'score' anyway wont it.

We didn't know if my godson would go through with it or not, but he wanted to. He hated (hates!) how his life was (is) compared with how it used to be before the accident, how he couldn't walk, couldn't talk properly & mostly how his friends lives were moving forward and his wasn't (isn't). It was hard, but although he will never live independantly, his life is 'ok' & we were very lucky in that he retained his nature/sense of humor etc - lots of people who have brain injuries change completely. Anyway, enough waffle from me!! Your DS is only 6, it will be a lot more 'abstract'.