I have no understanding of this

[TheOriginalFAB]

My son is 10 and we have had to remove him from school because of continuing bullying and 2 physical attacks by a boy is is statemented. The school will not exclude him. They will send him home a few minute early when the helper also leaves but reckon they can monitor him all the time he is at school, ie right next to him. No one was next to him when we saw him this morning. Why is it that his right to an education comes before my son's right not to be physically attacked at school? I really do not understand it.

My other son has additional needs but was dealth with swiftly and fairly when he pushed a child over. This boy has hurt my son much more seriously and yet we have had to take our child out because they say they can't remove the child who is volatile and unpredictable.

I just do not understand it and I am devastated that my child has to change schools now.

Suddenly I've lost all my patience with this one.

You have said there is a group of children picking on your son and yet you continue to blame the child with SEN.

You just can't go to the head of a school and ask them to remove a child, whether they have SEN or not. What do you honestly expect them to say? OK then Mrs Fab, we'll let him know tomorrow?

You are insensed with rage and accusations against one boy, yet there is a GROUP of bullies, but you haven't yet spoken to the governors.

What needs does this child have exactly if he is so capable of manipulating a group of children to pick on your ds. It quite often happens that smart kids manipulate SEN kids to do their bidding for them. My dd got that all the time 'soandso keeps telling me to hit soandso'.

I do feel for you OP, having a bullied child is the worst thing in the world - but you need to stop accusing and start talking to the school effectively and without blame. The bullying is the school's fault, not the child's.

Whenever I bring up the other children the staff won't talk about them and will say we are just discussing the recent incident so no, I am not blaming one child.

Feel free to leave the thread if reading it is annoying you.

This child targetted my daughter today.

The head of governors will get the letter today.

When a parent targets the child of another - or when that is the perception - it is likely that will step up the bullying and increase the conflict.

The school should be able to deal with more than one incident in one meeting though, IMO they are being completely obstructive in not wanting to get to the heart of the matter. They should have clear records of incidents. I make sure an email goes off if there is anything said by my DD at home. There is usually one every week of low-level bullying.

Sorry if what I say isn't what you want to hear but I have read an awful lot about inclusion and disability rights, behaviour, statistics of bullying and statemented children, etc. The general picture is that statemented children are victimised bigtime, and often are used by the smarter kids to do their bullying for them. They are more likely to have a difficult home life as well. The school will always try to defend them and it's right that they do.

I have said nothing about not wanting to hear what you have said but I am telling you what has been happening and I can't make the school do anything.

What do you want the school to do - exactly - as far as I have read you want them to exclude a child. It's not as simple as that. You have to play the 'game' if you like - of getting evidence, presenting it, listening to their side, writing letters if need be, speaking to governors. If they acted upon the wishes of every parent asking them to exclude a child with a statement, well, the world would be a very sad place.

Anyway I'd best leave this thread now because I really don't want to argue. Leaving the school would probably be the best thing for your children.

I don't want them to exclude him because he has a statement but because he is violent and unpredictable. The same as I want the other 6 boys and girls who have physically assaulted him. One is clearly in a cared for situation so nothing doing there either. They get told what we are doing but we get told nothing about what the parents have done or said.

I am not interested in an arguement either. I just want to be able to send my kids to school without worrying if they are going to need medical help by the time I pick them up.

The school are gaoling to meet your needs and are failing to meet the needs of the boy in question too.

Personally I am happy when parents complain. This child is not being sufficiently supervised and the school need to act.

Complaining vociferously to the Lea, the school and the governors is the way to go. It just depends if you have the energy.

you are allowed to demand of the school that they fulfil their duty in keeping your (and others') children safe from harm. this includes all children, even the so-called perpetrators.

you cannot expect the school to listen to your calls for expulsion. there could be all sorts of mitigating circumstances which you have no idea about. obviously it is not ok that your ds is being hurt, but that is not the whole story, unfortunately - just the whole story from your side.

if the school cannot cope (and it seems they cannot) then you can ask what theya re going to do next; what extra support they are going to put in place. you can inform the LA that the current support system is clearly not working, and you can ask for policies to cover these eventualities.

but you cannot demand that other children are removed. there is a clear protocol to follow - from informing teachers, head of year, headteachers, governors and then LA. if you have not followed this protocol, then you must (or really, you have no room to complain. it is your choice to remove your ds. if you have not followed through the complaints procedure to the end, then you cannot complain that the school has not reacted)

Obviously that should be failing.

Gaoling would be going a tad far I think

I accept we were wrong to ask the school to expel him but what else could we ask for when nothing the school hs done so far has stopped the attacks. And even when we remove our child from the school the intimidation continues with him targetting our daughter. I suspect my husband wishes he had done more sooner like I wanted him too.

All the school have done is

talk to the kids
eventually get the parents in once

now they say they will send him home early, but now we have removed FABBoy I don't know if they will still do that, and say he is being supervised but clearly they are not doing it or it isn't working as yesterdays incident shows.

We will take this as far as we need too as we do not want anymore children suffering like ours have and we do still currently have 2 other kids there but I can't see them staying for long with the way things are going. I can't even stand in the playground without immature parents glaring at me and my child.

Land - that is a bit unfair. We have been in to school numerous times and didn't know we could go to the LEA?Governors until told about it on here and we have now done that. We wanted to be fair and give the school chances. Clearly that was the wrong thing to do.

I think you just need to focus on insisting that the school protect your dc and properly supervise the boy(and the other bullies).

how the boy is prevented from hurting yours doesn't matter.
When you tell the school what to do you just allow them to avoid the issue.

Fab : "I want you to expel x child"
School "we cannot do that"
Fab :" but he needs to be removed"
School " we can't discuss this child with you and we cannot remove him"
Brick wall

Instead you want

Fab"my son is being attacked. What are you doing to protect him"
School : " well we can't exclude this boy..."
Fab : "I am not interested in what you can't do. Please detail for me how you are acting to protect my child from future attack..."

Ditto to governors
Ditto to Lea

When we asked what they were going to to do if not expel him they said send him home early and supervise him all the time. That was it and it has been day one and not worked.

So you keep on at the governors, the Lea and keep writing your complaints to the school and persist with getting them to explain how they are going to protect your dc.

It kind of doesn't matter what has happened up to know. I am just trying to explain how a change of tactics may help going forward.

Up to now. Not know

Yes, school are not interested in going over old ground even though we bring it up as nothing has been done after some attacks, nothing at all. I am clock watching until I can go and get my children. I am missing ds1 so much. I haven't seen him since Sunday and he isn't coming home until tomorrow.

Exactly, there is no point.

So writing to all parties and being determined in getting answers re protecting your dc is the only issue. Everything else is a waste of energy.

We should have taken him out a lot sooner.

I am also happy when aprents complain: it was that which helped us get a dinner time TA for ds1 (his most problematic time), and eventually a Base place.

I absolutely believe all Fab says as well becuase I sawit at ds1's school: it wasn;t preference foir the Sn child, far from, but a general incompetency, laziness adn inability to get to grips with ANYTHING at all.

Although, constant supervision SHOULD do it Fab: if the person is of sufficient intelligence to actually understand the child- we have ahd those who have been, and those who have not (and think 'oh dear ds1 please don't try and break people's legs any more will do the trick- we we tried that love! I ahven't put myself through a SN uni course un order to help the boys yet failed to bloody ask him to stop you know! grrr).

The school is useless;: pag's advice is right.

This grabbed my attention :'We were told the child wouldn't remember the next day what he had done the previous day but he is clever enough to wait until the helper has gone home before he hurts my child and to seek out his sister to say that too. That mother really annoyed me today but it doesn't surprise me. I suspect the school are scared of her.
'

I suspect I might know what's going on there: ds1 is very able to operate at a manipulative level (wish he'd teach me, I am the opposite and a target for anyone who can usually)- EVERYTHING he does is in some way a calculated power snatch. Yet at a very basic level, despite his very high functioning level, he has a massive chuck of cause and effect missing when it comes to his own actions: he gets that X+Y = power; he doesn't understand anything beyond that equation invcluding wider effects on people, why his actions are wrong or memorable, and why he should stop them. At a basic level ds1 (who is so much more in reality but I hope YKWIM) is essentially an alpha drive on legs, at loeast with other people.

Words have been had with the Head today as no one spoke to my dd today. She spouted some crap but I put her straight. I have told her if there is one more thing with either of my children then we are taking our remaining children out and have emailed the new school to ask of all 3 can go there. Fuck knows how we will pay for it.

I feel I have handled this all wrong by being emotional and stroppy but I am emotional when it comes to my children and them being hurt.

The class have been told not to speak too or approach any of my children (said in the playground in the letter but this kid got her in the lunch hall) but 2 have been up to DD today to ask when DS1 has left. If he needs telling more than once, as the head has said, then how do they expect to stop him hurting my children. And if he needs precise instructions then surely he will just think he has to stay away from her in the playground?

What the child will do or not do is not possible to predict. The child isn't the issue.

The school should be getting him the correct level of supervision. They have obviously failed to do anything.

Your emotional reaction is understandable, entirely understandable.
But it looks like none of the children in this situation will cone out any better off. Which is a huge shame.

It seems apparent that the class are happy ds1 has gone and have been grilling dd again today as to why he has gone. The class have been told not to speak to any of my children. Am I repeating myself??

We are now seriously making plans as to taking them all out if we can.

Kids do okay on basic meals, yes?....

...you are over-reacting FAB. Of course the other children from DS's class want to know what has gone on. They probably have no idea that you thought the situation was so bad you felt you had to remove your DS. Asking your DD where he is etc is logical and understandable, it is not 'getting at her'. As the children doing the asking were most likely asking in all innocence, they probably didn't realise they were doing 'wrong' - even though they had been told not to - to their minds, they were only asking a simple question.

you are sounding quite paranoid now tbh. I don't think it is in any of your children's interests to come across like that. I also think taking your younger 2 out of school is even more of an over-reation than taking your DS, before speaking to the Head properly, the Governors, the LEA, and giving them time to come up with a strategy, instead of what you seem to have done which is mutter about it, complain in vague terms to the teacher and deputy, and then got indignant that 'nothing has been done!'.

Sorry, but that is how it comes across. You of course will disagree, but then as you admit occasionally, you don't always handle things the best way (who does?). I am just suggesting now that you don't make things worse by getting anxious about your other 2 and taking them out for inde school, which you say you can't afford.

People on here can be too kind to you sometimes FAB, and I don't think it is always helpful.

Now I know you will be cross and offended with me and I am sorry about that. But I am trying to talk straight to you for your own good. If I didn't give a stuff about your situation, why would I spend my time responding to you on here?

It isn't over reacting to think we can't trust the school to keep our other children safe there as they have proved that with ds1.

It isn't over reacting to be upset that the bully has laughed in dd's face that her brother has had to leave.

We have done everything we can and we weren't prepared to leave him there any longer as the school has shown it can't keep him safe and waiting until the governors and lea had got involved would have taken too long. The attacks were getting more violent and more often. Are you really saying I shoud have left him there while the LEA did whatever it is they do?