To give up on my son's school?

[jaffacakesaremyfave]

My 8 year old DS has severe behavioural problems at school. In the past 2 years he has been excluded more times than I can count, been put on a reduced timetable once for 3 months and recently again for an indefinite period (so he's currently excluded every Friday)

His reception year at school was fine but when he moved into year 1, the problems started. We relocated due to my work and he moved school when he was at the end of year 1 and things really began to deteriorate.

He had a bad start due to racial bullying which I don't feel the school took seriously and as his behaviour became worse, they resorted to locking him in a small room until he calmed down but would often leave him there until I came to collect him even when he had calmed down.

I fought to get him into a better school which was run by the same head teacher where his older brother attends and for the first term his behaviour improved dramatically. However, over the last year we seem to be back to where we started.

The most recent incident was yesterday where he left school premises (he's never done this before) and the school rang the police. They only called me after he had gone back into school and said they called the police as they are unable to follow him when he leaves school grounds. The police never came so basically if he does this again they will leave my 8 year old son to wander around a busy main road until the police arrive.

I feel at my wits end and I don't know how things can move forward. I have had so many meetings with the school to try and manage his behaviour. He has a teaching assistant and he is extremely fond of his current class teacher but his behaviour deteriorates if neither of them are in school (like yesterday when both were at sports day all day). Next year will be horrendous as he already doesn't like his new teacher for year 4.

I've tried to get him referred to CAHMS several times through both the school and GP but these have led nowhere. His main problems seems to be about becoming frustrated if he can't do his work or if he is told off for something that he feels is unjust (like being told off for talking in class when it wasn't him talking) This leads to him either completely shutting down and becoming mute for hours on end or become destructive and swearing at teachers.

At home he is generally well behaved but we have a very close relationship and I have learned how to ask him to do things in a way that avoids conflict and if things escalate then I know how to calm him down and he always accepts his punishments (e.g losing his electrics, pocket money, can't go to football etc)

I recently had a meeting with someone from parent partnership who attended a meeting with the head and she agreed that some of the things the school were doing were not helpful (e.g if my son walked off they would tell him he's going to a PRU or back to the previous school for which they also run).

He has witnessed DV when he was very young from his father (who is now in prison and he no longer sees) and i found out last year that their father was emotionally abusing him and his brothers (which never made it to trial).

I have asked for counselling but nowhere can provide it for free so my only option is private which I can't afford. The school made a referral to a charity for young carers (after me pushing for a year to try and find an organisation that can help him) but they only offer an outing after school every fortnight and it really isn't set up for children like my son who have behavioural issues.

I've been to CAHMS in the past and done the 6 week parenting course but like I say, his behaviour at home isn't the issue and CAHMS won't deal with behavioural problems.

I feel like the school has given up on him and labelled our family as 'one of those families'. They are extremely patronising to me (comments such as 'well you do so well getting them to school looking clean' etc.)

Not that it should make a difference to how we are judged but although I am a single parent, I have always worked, have a high level of education and am in a professional career but they still seem to treat me like I'm some silly single mother who has messed up her child and assume I'm at home on benefits.

Sorry for the long post but I really do not know where to go from here. Should I move his school for a third time to one not affiliated with this one or leave my son in a school not able to manage his behaviour and potentially letting him leave the premises and not be followed.

Where do I stand legally with their position on this? Surely they have a duty of care to ensure he is safe during school hours and if they cannot manage that then they should call me immediately so I can intervene.

I am so exhausted and upset by this situation

Thanks Winky,

I'm definitely going to look into an EHCP application myself.

An update of today. I went to look around another school and told the new head everything. She appeared to be understanding and said he could start there on Monday for a managed move.

The head of current school then emailed asking to cancel meeting on Monday and basically good luck and bye. The problem is that the managed moves is temporary and at the discretion on new head (so basically she can send him back to old school if she feels it's not working) Also to get him in permanently then I need to apply through LA admissions which may not be successful so he may end up staying at old school.

Should I still ask the head to meet on Monday?

I was annoyed today because I emailed the head asking if he can go in for transition day (DS wanted to be at school). Head replied that's fine but then I got a phone call from a TA at 10am saying head had asked her to call as transition is only half a day and can I collect him at 12 even though his behaviour had been fine when she called. When I challenged her and said why can't we just see how he goes for the rest of the day and I will collect him if needs be, she said no, he's not supposed to be in Fridays!!

I am worried about the new school as head said it was an academically low achieving class (and had been since yr 1) and that they have spent their allocated budget for EP's but that the yr 3 class teacher is their SEN. I said as long as I feel something is being done, even if it doesn't work it will enable things to be escalated higher rather than just leaving me and my DS in limbo.

Oh and I've not spoken to school nurse but used to work with our local school nursing team and they don't deal with things like this. It's more about vaccination, weight, bed wetting etc not behavioural/emotional things.

I've no idea why he isn't on SEN or why I'm having to push so hard for any help. I've always just been told he doesn't have SEN. I asked for an EP referral many times over the years and they constantly said they don't have any in our LA but the head from new school said all local schools put money in a pot for EP and get allocated time (enough for 2 children per school). I didn't even know about this until today. He doesn't have a behavioural management plan, there's nothing for him to aim for and no reward when he behaves.

A lot of my anger is that I feel I've been so misinformed about what's available, what's legal, what's really going on with resources.

Smile I think you misunderstood me, I didn't mean a school had been shut down for using illegal exclusions, I meant illegal seclusion which is where you keep somebody in a space, on their own, against their will and prevent them from leaving.

It was a specialist autism school in the NW that made the news, but I don't know if I'll be able to find a link now.

Some basic info

I'm shocked that there doesn't seem to be much mention on the thread of how your son escaped from school. If ofsted found out a child had managed to leave the school premises alone they would be straight in doing an inspection. Part of safeguarding is ensuring the children can't get out. Frankly I'm shocked and worried by this more than anything else and if I were you I'd be putting in a formal complaint about the fact that it happened!

That's nonsense Kariana.

A child absconding without the school realising, maybe, but not just for a child managing to get out. What do you think mainstream schools are, high grade prisons??

Low, I can answer yes to all the following from the article you linked

•	Do support staff or teachers or others take the child to the room or space?
•	Is the child left in the room or space alone?
•	Is the child is unable to leave the room independently or not understand how to leave the room when they choose to?
•	Do people watch/monitor the child  from outside the room without entering the room?
•	Is the practice dependent on a room or space which is available at the place the child  is being educated or cared for?

I already alerted safeguarding, they had no findings however it was informal rather than formal written complaint. Do you think I should formally complain?

Well, I think they should stop doing it, however that is achieved. They need to go into the room with him if he needs to be removed from the classroom because he is a danger to other pupils. When he is calm enough to be safely left for some cool down time they can- but with the door open and an adult close by.

TBH though, I just think your son needs better help. He needs to be somewhere that can meet his needs properly.

So today was an absolute disaster. His behaviour at the new school was worse than ever. They don't want him back there.

I really don't know what to do or where to turn. I'm so ashamed that he can behave like this. The new head asked me to sit down when I collected him to talk through what he had done that day. He stormed out of the room and I tried to catch him before he ran off and he was kicking me and swearing. I've never seen him behave like that before.

I'm just devastated and at my wits end.

I'm so sorry. Perhaps get this moved from AIBU or start a new thread. Must be people who have faced similar situations and can advise you.
Don't be ashamed. You aren't making him behave like this and you clearly only want what's best for him.

I've rejoined Mumsnet just to comment on this thread. You sound like an amazing mum OP!
Firstly, from my experience working as a teacher in a SEN school, children have to be allowed to leave a safe room whenever they want. They're not supposed to be blocked in there. (This was the case with a boy who had issues with faecal smearing too!)
Furthermore, I had a child who acted similar when I was doing my teacher training year. At first I would punish & reprimand, but then found that actually if I did "pre-learning" during reading time (introducing the basics of what we would be learning that day) this was a confidence boost for the child so he wouldn't feel overfaced at the work. Plus this also built his confidence as he was able to then model how to do the work on the board to his peers.
If you can manage your DS's behaviour, then so can the school. If he moves to this new school, the SENCO should agree an individual behaviour plan with him & give him small targets that are achievable.
No way should the staff have threatened your DS with the PRU or his old school. No wonder he doesn't trust them!

Now you have seen how he behaves at school - can you not push for a referral or special school?

It makes me so mad that you are embarrassed. The school should be embarrassed about the lack of support, guidance and help.
What does your head suggest the next plan should be? Are you going to try to transition to yr 4 where he is?

If you talk to your son out of they're heat of the moment can he shed any light on the reasons for his behaviour? Does he know he is going to loose it?

Thanks Wolfie, I do feel responsible. He's my son and I've obviously let him become seriously messed up. I cried in front of the head, I just feel so lost. I'll ask for the three to be moved.

WORK, thank you for your post. They no longer lock him in a room (this was at the sister school) but I now know this was completely wrong and shouldn't have happened. He's now allowed to find a room to sit in if he becomes overwhelmed but he is often followed (I know this is for his safety) which winds him up more. He's not allowed back at the school he started today so he's back to the old school tomorrow. If there are places that can deal with faecal smearing then surely there is somewhere that can deal with my son!!

Green, I have never questioned whether he actually does these things, I know he does I've just never seen it first hand. He's never tried to kick me before. The head has agreed to a TAC meeting on Monday and I've requested he get assessed for SEN, referred to a behavioural specialist (recommended by SENDIAS to do a Boxall assessment), referral to EP and to stop reduced timetable. School agreed to discuss these issues on Monday but refused to stop the reduced timetable and said I had to comply with it to keep him at current school. She copied in the exclusion officer to that email so I guess it must be legal to not provide a full time education for my son.

I don't know what else to ask for a referral to.

What concerns me is that you are trying to do the schools job - you shouldn't have too and this seems to be the main issue - by not doing X Y Z they are effectively making his life difficult so you have no choice but to move - it happens!!

What you should be doing is saying what you want

I want DS in school full time
I want DS to have 1:1
I want a plan when X happens
I want real assurance that Y doesn't happen

It's my understanding that it is legal to have reduced timetable with your agreement. The implicit threat seems to be that they will move to permanent exclusion if you don't agree.
You say you have allowed him to become messed up ... you have also given him what qualified professionals can't- the space and relationship to trust you. To be able to work through things and develop emotionally.

If he can function at home I am sure you will find a setting that will suit him. It may be a long road, but he needs the confidence that comes from having you in his corner.

Thank you Can't, I wish you could come to the meeting on Monday with me and say that to them!! I do feel like I'm doing their job for them Green. Every little simple exercise is a battle such as getting him an IEP. Surely I'm not asking over and above their duty as a school to do these things.

He can't really explain why he gets so upset. I think he is very eager to please and once he's been told off or spoken to in a firm tone then it's a downward spiral. It's like it's all or nothing for him.

He got upset at the meeting today because he felt like it was one long bollocking going through each event throughout the day. It was hard for me to listen to but obviously I have adult coping skills that he lacks and he just wanted to run out. It's when I tried to catch him that he lashed out at me.

I feel like the head is gloating a little bit. Her email to me today started with

'The Head has rung me from new school deeply shocked at DS's behaviour in school and feels unable to manage him at their school after just one day'

I feel like answering why has it come to this then! Why didn't anyone intervene earlier! There's only so much I can do as a parent and I've been begging for help for two years. He's obviously deteriorated to the point of not being able to cope in a mainstream school so why won't they refer him to a specialist!

What annoys me the most is that to get any help, you have to prove the interventions put in place didn't work but because there haven't been any substantial interventions, we are starting from square one when things are already so bad.

Another email from the head when I asked why he hasn't been assessed as SEN her reply was

'DS is at age expected for maths, his reading and writing have slipped recently below expectation as he is choosing not to do the work set in the lessons. He is capable of doing it but doesn’t enjoy literacy as much as he does numeracy. If this pattern continued next year and he was at my school then we would then have to consider putting him on the SEN register for literacy.'

Surely his behaviour is a 'barrier to learning' and needs to be addressed.

You haven't let him be seriously messed up at all. He's clearly finding certain things really incredibly difficult. He needs support in school and to develop coping mechanisms to work alongside school strategies. He's not messed up at all.

Can't, it's not with my agreement.

The head emailed

'The reduced timetable for Friday is still in place if we are to be given support by yourself to try and manage his behaviour currently and avoid further exclusions until the end of term. It will be reviewed each week as agreed with the local authority. That is a decision I have taken with my governors full approval if we are to manage him here. It is a condition of him remaining at any school at present.'

I think she added the line 'if we are given support by yourself' to make it look like I agree when I've made it clear I don't

Thank you Wolfie, I feel responsible because I chose such an utter wanker to be his father. Because of this he's had the worst start in life and he is clearly very damaged/disturbed.

They still talk about him making 'bad choices' like he chooses not to do work but what lies behind that is embarrassment at being behind, fear or being humiliated etc. His self esteem is on the floor and he hides it by being rude and aggressive as an avoidance tactic.

I feel awful now because I really lost my temper with him when we got home. He took it well and went straight to his room and apologised to me afterwards.

Apparently the new school have had to ring other parents to apologise for my son's swearing. I just never thought things could get this bad

Id agree it's a trust issue - they don't like him and he knows it -

They are destroying his confidence and 'love of learning' - yes he's being an arse - but it's a reaction to the adults around him - which no doubt has an effect on how the children treat him.

Apply for a EHCP yourself! Ask over on the SEN boards how to do it.
You do not need the schools permission and will trigger things like an assessment of needs by an Educational psychologist.
You can definitely get one for behaviour.

I agree Green, what happened to 'every child matters'!!! It seems they only matter if they don't have additional needs.

I am going to apply for the EHCP myself but doubt it will be successful. My understanding is that it's then next step up if SEN interventions are not working but he's not even in the SEN register so I have no evidence of interventions not working etc.

I've asked for evidence of all exclusions etc from head and I'm going to see how things go at the TAC meeting on Monday but if I still feel like they are unwilling to help, I'm going to write to the board of governors, head of education in our LA and our local MP.

After two years of fighting I'm just exhausted by all this and it's time they started to take my concerns seriously.

Hi all,

The OP has asked us to send this thread over to SEN and so we're just doing this now.

I could be wrong but a lot of your son's behaviours at school sound like ASD to me (especially the bolting and not coping). I think the school sound awful but there's always a danger that you'll end up jumping from one frying pan to another. You need diagnosis and EHCP in order to pinpoint the right school. I think a lot of people get ASD diagnoses from CAMHS but ours came via GP referral to paediatrician. Apologies if I am way off track with the ASD suggestion!