Advice on Aspergers please.

[bonkerz]

Not exactly sure where to start here really. Have posted on a few occassions about my DS who is 7 in July and about his behaviour in school.
For the last 2 years we have been having trouble with DS displaying inappropriate behaviour at school. He gets very angry and has huge tantrums which can sometimes turn violent and aggressive. School have excluded him twice and have said they are finding it increasingly difficult to cope within school.
At home he can be argumentative but we dont see the aggression that school talks about.
We have been working with family steps for the past 4 weeks to come up with different techniques to try and control his behaviour but school seem to be struggling with implementing the techniques.
I have now been asked by the school to go to the GP to get a referral to Mental Health and to get DS assessed for Aspergers and Autism. I have looked at symptoms for aspergers and must admit that DS does display some signs ie unable to operate in social situations, Unable to recognise other peoples feelings etc. He is above average intelligence and the school are not able to challenge him educationally due to lack of staffing apparently.
I suppose im really after some support from other parents who are going through or have gone through the process for diagnosis of aspergers or autism. Im really scared of the words mental health and how this label will reflect me as a parent. Is my son mad? am i a terrible mother?

i'm very new to this. my ds was diagnosed with aspergers about 2 weeks ago and he is 7 years old. i can't give you much advice as i am learning all about aspergers myself at the moment, but i would say don't be afraid of referal to CAMHS, the child and adult mental health people. this is no reflection on your parenting but just the experts to help you and your ds.
you are doing the right thing to find help for your ds and that makes you a good mum.

(keyboard bit buggered so apols for lack of caps)

You're not a terrible mother and your ds is not mad.

My ds1 is about the same age as your ds and has a dx of autism. Ds2 is 4 and has a dx of AS. I don't have any experience of CAMHS (mine were diagnosed by a Paed) but IMHO getting a dx, if needed, is a good thing. It will hopefully help your ds to access the help he needs.

What techniques are being tried (or not!) by the school? Have the school been looking at what triggers ds' anger/aggression? Looking at what happened just before each episode can really help to find a way to prevent or reduce the episodes in the future IME. It might also be worth looking for a different school if the current one can't meet his needs.

Feel free to come and post on the SN board as well. There are quite a few of us who are either going through this now or have done so in the past. The "is he/isn't he" stage is a really tough time IME. Mixed in with it is the "Was this caused by something I did or didn't do?" The answer to that is a definite no but it can be very hard to see that while you're going through it. xxx

Thanks for the replies. Deep down i know its not anything ive done or any reflection on my parenting skills BUT it is still really hard to deal with. I really hope (and i know that sounds odd) but i hope it is aspergers or something in that region as it would then mean he has a reason for behaving the way he does.
At home i can deal with DS quite easily but then i am on a smaller ratio with him than the teachers. At school they have had the Ed Psych in who has given them alot of anger management strategies and also told them they have to praise more and also dedicate more one to one time to DS. I really dont think that the school can do this though although they are appearing to be willing at the moment i really dont have alot of faith in them. As a parent i am already doing extra work with DS at home as they cannot challenge him when he is at school.
Have decided to go GP on Tuesday next week and discuss referral.
Bugsy, can i be nosy and ask what sort of behaviours etc your Ds demonstates?

DS was very aggressive when he was 4-5 years old. I did get some advice and did alot of positive parenting and forced myself to calm down and stop shouting at him. I also drew up some basic ground rules for us all to stick to: no shouting, no namecalling & no hitting being the most basic ones.
So the aggression has really calmed down. Now the problems are low self-esteem, being bullied, poor concentration, great difficulty with social friendships. He just about copes with the school day, but he is not enjoying it or happy.

thankyou Bugsy, you have just described my son! He gets very aggressive at school but not so at home. He doesnt understand how his behaviour affects others, he has low self esteem despite me constantly praising him. He is overly affectionate and tries TOO hard to make friends IYKWIM but once he has these friends he doesnt understand how to cope with them! The bullying aspect is what im scared of as i feel this is starting now. Gto GP appointment next wed and also got app with head tomorrow.

My GP referred me to CAMHs & they have a 13 week max wait in our area. I was seen after about 10 weeks. I had an interview with the Child Psychologist, then I took DS to meet her and she interviewed him, then she invited me back & gave me her diagnosis.
It was all very straightforward.
I found the session with DS gruelling. It was heart rending listening to him. I was digging my nails into the palm of my hand to stop myself crying.

sorry, that should be Child Psychiatrist.

my 8yr old has recently been diagnosed with Apsergers just wanted you to know your not on your own

school can arrange to have him tested though

thanks again for this support. Bugsy, what area are you in?
Interesting though about how you got the diagnosis. We have already been involved with Family Steps and the school have had DS reveiwed by an ed pshych who has reported that DSs behaviour is not 'normal'. The school on the other hand seem to be passing the buck to me and are saying that because DSs problem is not with his work and is with his behaviour then they cant assess etc.

I am in London Borough of Wandsworth and am finding the school unhelpful. They say they have no funding, which I am sure is true, but they just don't seem very interested. I also get the feeling that they are not being frank with me about what is happening in the classroom. DS is miserable & yet when I talk to his teacher or the head, they treat his misery very dismissively.
I am currently exploring alternative options that I might be able to afford if I move outside of London. I'll let you know how I get on!

Had a meeting with head and DSs teacher today. Seems things have got alot worse wt school BUT they have decided that in all honesty they havent been dealing with it properly and are now adopting strategies that are appropriate for a child on the autistic spectrum. They are writing quite a hard hitting letter to our GP which i will take on Wednesday when i see him. Also have the referrals from ed psych stating DS is not displaying NORMAL behaviour. Am hoping that with proof of the disruptive and aggressive behaviour from numerous outside organisations that we can fast track the referral to CAHMS to get my son the help he needs before everything else begins to suffer.

I'm glad to hear you are getting some support from your son's school. Hope you get to see CAMHs soon.

well things got worse last week and i feel completely deflated.
Went to doctors and GP was SOOOO unhelpful. School had written a letter to GP explaining DSs behaviour and that they request referral to CAHMS. GP explodes and says DS is a normal child, that all educational proffessionals should be shot, that saying you want to kill yourself is NORMAL for a 6 year old and he refused to do referral to CAHMS!!! Obviously i left in tears. Rang school who didnt know what to do next. Rang Family Steps who basically said maybe i should sit and let things happen and that in 6 months when my above average intelligent son has learning difficulties then maybe some help will be available.
I rang school nurse who was shocked and told me to make a second appointment with a different doctor for 3 weeks time. She is also referring DS to a peadiatrician who she said will look at DSs history and back up the referral for CAHMS, School have also arranged to see Ed psych at school and are going to press him for referral. My only other option if all this doesnt work is apparetnly to seek help from social services.
Feel like im running around in circles and getting no wehere and all the time im doing this DS is suffering.

bonkerz,

I would complain about the treatment you received by this GP as a matter of course. Do not let this behaviour by this person go unchallenged.

Forget the "advice" Family Steps gave you, that is certainly not going to help anyone least of all your son.

The school nurse is being sensible by referring your son to a paed but you really need to see a developmental paediatrician. They are perhaps more helpful than CAMHS would be. Your GP could have referred you to such a person.

I would seriously consider applying for a Statement of special needs for your son if you have not already done so. You would need to write to your LEA to do this, certainly do not let school do this because you can appeal and they cannot. IPSEA are very good and have lots of info. Their web address is www.ipsea.org.uk.

Thankyou Atilla for that website. Definately looks interesting.
I have been questioning the school about getting DS statemented since OCT 2006. Apparently i have to wait till DS has atleast 4 IEPs and is on School Action PLus for a minimum of 6 months. The school are dragging their feet and as yet i have only seen 2 IEPs and not spoken to the SENCO at all, infact although i have asked about the SENCOs involvement with DS i have never had an answer.
Will wait till next Tuesday when the school see the ED PSYCH and see if they can press the issue of referral, if that dont work i plan to go get a second opinion from a different GP and then if that dont work will approach school again before Easter holidays and demand statementing i think.

Hi Bonkerz,

You've been completely led up the garden path by the school. He certainly does not need 4 written IEP's and to be on SA plus for a minimum of six months.

As mentioned there is NOTHING to stop you writing to the LEA yourself as the parent asking the LEA to assess your son. If school are dragging their feet they will continue to do so despite you going in there. Forget all thoughts of the school applying for the statement because they will drag their feet over this issue. You are far better off writing to the LEA yourself. Also you can appeal the decision if the LEA say no, the school cannot if the LEA refuse their request. Many parents do not realise that they have far more power in this regard than schools do when it comes to making statement applications.

I wish you well.

Well i am totally annoyed now.
After being told last week by the head that DSs school would not use exclusion for him and that they felt Ds was not 'normal' i got a phone call at 1.25pm from a very abrubt receptionist at the school telling me i had to collect DS immediately as he was being Excluded and that this exclusion will go on the record. I was so angry i was shaking.
I went immediately up to the school and was faced with 3 members of teaching staff informing me my son had violently assaluted a member of staff. Indeed one teacher had a scrath about 3cm long on her arm!!!! Head was off premises and so was acting head! The 3rd in line said she wanted to exclude DS for 2 days till friday.
Obviuously i was and still am an emotional wreck. Noone could get hold of head to find out if exclusion was allowed to be used and DSs teacher (who was in meeting and fully aware of what had been promised) skulked off back to class.
I spent the next hour crying and spilling out all my fears and frustrations.
TOLD them i was going to bring DS to school tomorrow and i have organised a day off so i can stay there with him and DH is coming too.
Atilla, thanks for the ipsea website, cant get through to their helpline BUT i have written my letter for assessment request and i handed this to DSs teacher today and informed them i will be starting this immediately. When i asked SENCO about statementing she still refused to do it and said i had to wait atleast 6 more weeks!!!!
So as things stand i have no confidence in the school or the staff, i find it hard to believe the school are coping with DS as they are taking the easy route and sending him home....out of sight out of mind....thats not dealing with the issues!
Managed to get hold of a year 3 maths book from school today (DS is in year 2 and is not 7 till end of July) Ds has done 5 pages tponight and constantly moaned how easy the work is!!!!

Hi Boonkerz how are you getting on now? I have read through the thread and it occurs to me that the exclusion could be very helpful as this just confirms that your ds needs 1:1 support at school which is what you have been saying all along.

To get an AS and ADD diagnosis for my ds I just rang my GP explained the situation and she referred me to a developmental paed. It took about four months for the appointement to come thru so don't wait for that, keep pushing for an assessment.

Get hold of the Code for Special needs provision. It is available free from the department of education and skills, go on to their website and ring a helpline. This document sets out what the school should be doing and is very helpful to refer to. Good luck and keep posting.

hi, thanks for the reply.

As things stand so far I have a referral pending for a pead. I have self referred DS for statementing and i am currently filling out the forms for this, decision by April 19th!
Big meeting at school next week with ed psych and family steps helpers plus teachers and head.
Have asked for all exclusions to be formal ones as was told last Thursday they had not been formal and since found out this is unlawful! Am fighting with head to get her to produce paperwork about the exclusions to give to LEA.
DS is now arguing about goin to school and cries every morning saying the teachers hate him!
The school have managed to keep DS in school so far this week but im sure its out of sheer bloody mindedness on hteir part, i mean lets face it it really wont look good if they start formally excluding a child who has SN and is undergoing so much is it!!!!

School sound pretty crap tbh. However I think it is worth sticking with them for the time being while you try and get a statement. You might want to consider an alternative school in the future however?

At least the meeting shows the LEA and school are taking things seriously now. I think a lot of schools like to think they can deal with SN kids on their own and they are encouraged in this belief by the funding structure. This might be O.K with say kids with mild dyslexia or a bit slow at their reading etc. However our kids need a hell of a lot more than this, they need expert imput and 1:1 support in some cases. Regarding the "unofficial" exclusions, I presume that the HT is not denying these occured? If you put it to her in a letter that ds was asked not to attend school on x dates, she can either lie or admit that proper procedures were not followed. The fact remains however that the school were unable to manage ds's behaviour so asked you to remove him from the school - surely that is the only evidence you need??

Pat on the back for for keeping ds in school. Some things have to be non negotiable (as far as possible). The more you keep bringing him, the more pressure that will build up for a statement to be put in place. Good luck

www.ipsea.org.uk/exclusion-support-sheets.htm

Bonkerz

You may want to read IPSEA's above page on exclusions as well. IPSEA's web address is www.ipsea.org.uk

thanks atilla, have read alot on IPSEA website and i did actually present that page to HT and asked for letter etc.....we are currently still in arguments about the exclusion, she is still saying it wasnt!!
School nurse popped out today and is referring DS onto a school pead to assess for aspergers, she thought it may only take 2-4 weeks for initial appointment which is good (well for here it is).
Got to start providing and writing evidence for statement now...so daunting but have alot of helpful forms etc
DS has had a rough couple of days again, no exclusions but he is being bullied and one particular boys name keeps cropping up and DS keeps getting into fights with him. Mentioned this boy to the teacher this morning and her way of dealing with it was.......not letting DS out to play today at all...to avoid confrontation apparently!

bonkerz your situation sounds so much like the one we went through 2 years ago. {{{hugs}}} that was without doubt the most difficult time of my life

So sorry you are going through all this. If you ever want a chat CAT me.

THANKYOU AMY,Can honestly say im at my witts end with all this. At home i have a wonderful little boy who has his moments but on the whole is no worse than other kids. At school i have a hideous thug of a child who violently assaults and is a health and safety issue to staff and children! Such a huge difference but definatley the same boy.
Procedures take forever to follow and all the time my son is becoming more unhappy and the hostility between us and the HT and tacher is growing.
Hate sending him to school and hate going to collect him incase he has had a bad day!
Want to scream and shout and obviously i cant!

parents evening tonight and im not sure i can be nice to DSs teacher! Was agreed tonight would be about focusing on positives for DS sake but fell sick at the thought of her sat saying nice things about DS when i know she is in fact feeling as low as i am and also is unable to cope with him!