3.5yo only needs 9h sleep. What to do with her in the mornings/evenings?

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We have resigned ourselves to the fact that DD2 currently needs very little sleep. She gave up daytime sleep age 2, and since then has been fine on 9-10h. Problem is, DD1 (5y) needs about 11h - she goes to bed about 7.30pm. We always put them both down at the same time, but DD2 (who has often been up since 5.30am) then spends about an hour coming out of her room again and again and again and again .... By this point of the evening I really need some 'me time' and can no longer have her following me around.

Have tried 'rapid return', door shutting, star charts, chocolate etc. She just doesn't yet have enough self-control to bear any consequences in mind when she gets the impulse to jump out of bed. Can't use a stairgate as she just yells the place down and wakes DD1 (and the neighbours!).

The only time she's slept ok was in the holidays when she slept about 8.30-6.30ish. I'd be quite happy to have her quietly occupying herself or even watching TV till 8.30 (so I can get on with my stuff), but there is no way DD1 would go to bed an hour earlier knowing her little sister is allowed to stay up.

DD1 used to wake early but got into the habit of looking at books etc on her own till it was time to get up. DD2 just can't be persuaded to do this. She is obsessed with drawing but if I leave pencils in her room she'll draw in her story books/on the wall!

I really have resigned myself to her sleeping pattern for now, just need some coping strategies really ...

bump

Do they share a room. If not could you lete her watch a DVD quietly or listen to a spoken word book for a while?

Thanks for replying Five.

No they don't share a room. DD2 always goes to sleep with a story CD or music on but (unlike DD1) doesn't seem to take much interest in it - it doesn't stop her coming out of her room a zillion times.

If I were to let her watch a DVD I'd have to do a pretend bedtime (story, goodnight etc) with her while DD1's around, then let her sneak down and watch TV when she comes out - could try this but am concerned that ...
(1) DD1 occasionally comes out of her room (and often gets up to use the loo) and as her room's just at the top of the stairs she would probably cotton on;
(2) DD2's no good at keeping secrets!
(3) I would feel like I was encouraging DD2 to come out of her room after bedtime, and might exacerbate the problem;
(4) DD2 would undoubtedly expect me to put her to bed all over again when all this was done, and there'd be no guarantee she would stay there after that;
(5) DH and I sometimes like to watch a DVD ourselves once they're in bed!

Sorry was thinking a portable one in her room.

We have a slight same problem so we either let our DD stay up and watch a DVD while we have supper and then put her to bed or we put her to bed at 8 and DH will cook supper while I read to her.

Ah, I see. Only got one TV. And most of the time it's just me in the evenings. Thanks anyway Five

I'm an older sister who needed a lot more sleep than my younger sister, my mother always said I could get up after sister had gone to sleep. Can't believe I feel for it but it might work for your little ones.

What about stickers to keep her occupied in bed, of course you run the risk of them everywhere. Or a talking book on CD?

Thanks nannynz. I think we may have to allow her to get up - I am truly sick of hearing myself say 'Bed! Now!'. Just need her quietly occupied so I can have some sort of 'me time'.

Will probably risk pencils/stickers.

She has a talking book every night - doesn't help unfortunately.

I went out last night and DH put her down - she crashed instantly

Any other thoughts ... ?

This evening she fell asleep in the car at 6pm while I was picking DD1 up from a friend's house - I transferred her to her bed still asleep when we got in - so have evaded the problem again tonight! No doubt she'll either be up in the night or at some ungodly hour in the morning ...

I have problems with my son sleeping -he doesn't. but I do know that feeling of I am sick of hearing myself say that phrase. Last night I refused to put him to bed. My sister v.kingdly did it. There was less fighting and arguement. If DH can get her to bed let him do it and find out what routine he does. It might be a difference in routine. It might be she knows she can push her luck with you. But doesn't know his weak spots if he doesnt do bedtime regularly. Don't take it personally. All kids do it. Just don't get angry. I currently use a TV ban the next day. Mess about in bed. Get punishment/loose treat next day. This will often work. If can't take something away from one, treat other for being good at bedtime. envey can be used as a tool. Mums are sneeky too! Children this age are capable about learning about consequences for behaviour.

Forgot to say - don't expect miracles it will take time to work. Apparently it takes a month to learn behaviour and 1 year to make it habit. I know it sucks but hey 1 month of sleep is still a month of sleep. it gets better from there...