Support thread for those who were under the misguided illusion that their DC would sleep through by six mo - come and join!

[arthymum]

Did you assume that your DC would be sleeping through by the time they were 6 mo - and now you've hit the milestone you realise you were wrong, wrong, wrong as you stagger out of bed 1, 2, 3 times a night?

Do you sometimes can't help but wonder if you'd done things differently (BF/FF/stuck with the dreamfeed/co-slept/put them in their own cot/followed a GF routine/listened to your MIL ) you'd be getting more sleep?

Do you sometimes dread meeting up with other mums with perfect sleepers (especially when said babies are way younger and tinier than yours)?

Are you in a permanent state of confusion and doubt about whether to 'try' something or not (CC, ssh-patt, PUPD, NCSS etc.) but feel it's never the right time (teething, cold, too young) and not sure anyway whether you have the bottle/energy to see it through?

Do you hold out faint hopes that they'll sleep better when they're on solids/when the teeth come through/when they're another pound heavier/when they're in the new gro-bag/when they're on more solids - and each time - wrong again?

Do you mostly cope okay but every now and then feel tired and miserable and sorry for yourself and burst into tears at the postman or get into a petulant fight in Sainsbury's?

Do you secretly fear that you'll be on here in 3 years time, posting about the fact that you haven't slept for nearly 4 years?

Then come and join me! I've seen you lurking on other threads but feel that we need a place to congregate. Share your tears, tantrums, triumphs and tips - and hopefully one by one, we can all eventually disappear off the thread and into the land of nod....

ooh, well done fg!! so it does happen! you definitely deserve it. big kisses to all of you XXXX

Balls. Last night was back to normal; awake screaming inconsolably for an hour and a half from 4am. I knew it was too good to be true...

We've had a shocker too. DS is sick (fever and snotty) and everything is haywire. Two nights ago, REFUSED to go in his cot. Awake every hour or worse. Took turns having him sleep on us all night. Back to newborn hell! Last night was better - we took the side off his cot and I slept on his floor all night beside him. Seemed to help.

Getting his TB shot tomorrow. That should help with sleep?!

it's two steps forward and one step back isn't it....or sometimes two forward, two back, or three forward, four back....you get the picture.

am back to contemplating sleep training. it's just not me, but i'm starting to come round to the idea that he may need it. last night he woke at 9 to cry for an hour - he just wants me, or my boob to be precise - to send him back to sleep. and that's not convenient for anyone. i only have two boobs and they have to come everywhere with me. going home to my mum's this weekend though, so no way am i going to inflict any unnecessary crying on her. maybe i'll screw up all my courage and do it next weekend. or maybe he'll just start magically sleeping 12 hours straight between now and then!!!! ahahaha. no doubt i'll keep you posted though.

DS slept through again last night! I wish he'd just make up his mind instead of toying with me like this!

Staines, it took me a long time to gird my loins re sleep training but I just knew the time was right and that DS was ready and able. It wasn't nearly as hard on me or him as I thought it would be. He seems to have no will power at all and when I've been confident that he's otherwise OK and CCd he's only ever grizzled for 20 mins max.

I've kind of done it in two stages too, one to get him down to one feed a night and then a break of two months for teeth then stopped night feeds a fortnight ago. I haven't CCd with the night feeds though coz I think that would have been a bit unfair. I did pretty much what Mumormom posted a few days ago.

That said, not all babies are the same; Chulita's always said that her DD is pretty determined and I was talking to a friend today who said that it just doesn't work on her DS (who is the same age as ours and has just started waking 8-9 times a night but also that my baby isn't the worst sleeper I know anymore!)

Hey all. Things a bit grim here, DD all over the place waking 3 or more tmes again, won't nap in cot and I have mastitis. Sob.

Kiwi, sending you virtual cake and fine wine. Will that help? How do they know when we're feeling like crap and why do they choose then to be awkward?

Don't listen to this Kiwi but DS slept through again last night. I am beginning to allow a very small chink of optimism to creep in...

Hi all,

My lack of posting here is not because I have a sleeping baby, but because I was just too bloody tired and bored of lack of sleep to even talk about it anymore. Reluctantly we have also started sleep training, this is after weeks of being cried at all day, whilst a tired baby rubs his eyes, yawns, refuses food. but overall absolutely refuses to sleep day or night.

So I decided to do it just with the going to sleep for the night part. First night it took half an hour which I was amazed at, but he was terribly knackered. He slept until 2:30am which was amazing and I thought if it only took half an hour last time i may as well go for it in the night as well. 2 hours later I was regretting that decision and wanted some sleep! (To be honest he was only grizzling but he just wouldn't actually sleep). Second night it took an hour of crying and that was really hard, but then he slept through. Third night 40 mins, and he woke up once in the night, but I refused to feed him and he went back off easily. The next night - 7 mins and a sleep through. Last two nights it has been under 5 minutes but he has a tooth coming through so has been up at 3am one night and 4am another, but because I'm not sure if he is in pain I have been picking him up and feeding eventually. So at the moment one wake up isn't that bad, even if it takes me an hour to get him back into his cot, and at least I have reclaimed some time in the evening to relax/eat/have a bath which really helps to give me more energy in the night.

I really feel bad about the sleep training but I was starting to not cope and I had no energy to play with my son, and it was really affecting him with the lack of sleep.

staines it was the same here - when he woke in the evening if the hubby went up he would scream blue murder, he wanted me and the boob, even though he wasn't even really feeding. As he was up so much in the evening I was starting to wonder if I was ever to go out evening time ever again...

mom N's TB jab didn't affect him nearly as much as his other jabs, it was definately a lot milder, fingers crossed!

kiwi - you poor thing, can the doc give you anything for the mastitis?

Hi All, Can I join you? The OP of this post just about sums me up - DD was 6 months on Tuesday and has never slept through the night. DS was 3 last week and is a reasonably good sleeper, although think he is being disturbed by DD as he keeps calling out in night - he was sleeping through the night by 6 months though.

Am really getting desperate for some solution, so eager to follow how you all get on. Last month I really got desperate as DD started a new torture, whereby instead of waking for food, she also started waking in small hours just to be awake - oh joy!! So, having tried NCSS, 10 days ago we started Baby Whisperer PU/PD technique. 1st night, it took 1.5 hours and then she slept for another 6, meaning she went 7.5 hours between feeds - we, of course didn't!! I was up an hour before she did, checking she was still breathing and couldn't get back to sleep again. Has been a bit hit and miss since then. I can pretty much get her down for a morning nap of about 1.5 hours without feeding - that this coincides with DS having started nursery is absolute bliss!! Am trying to refuse to feed her if she's been asleep for less than 4 hours at night, but I'm so tired, it is hard.... Last night was horrendous. She fed every 2 hours and from 2am I was in with her and then from 4am she was awake (practising her newly learnt skill of clapping ) for 2 hours then back to sleep for an hour and woken by a huuuuuge poo!

Tonight I need nerves of steel, as she does seem to do better if she feeds less often, I just think she's not too good at putting herself back to sleep.

Read your post with interest MOM - I normally just stick the nightlight on in her room when I go in there at night, so I can see what I am doing, but this morning at 6am I eventually switched it off as thought I would have enough daylight creeping through to see - was still pretty dark and she went straight off, so think I will try without the light tonight. Wish me luck...

Staines and Row78 - DD is the same - if hubby goes in, she just screams and screams - she just wants me, which is lovely, but rather wearing. When I was at my Mum's last month DD was awake for 1.5 hours in middle of night, Mum was up getting a lemsip and tried to help me out - lots of suggestions like, just put her in her cot and shut the door (just not my thing at all), then offered to take her, at which point DD screamed blue murder a la DH and Mum said - ooh, she's having a right paddy. Too true, but what do I do about it?

Every day I go through the... I should give up Bfing and go to FF, I should have done Gina Ford, should never have let DD feed to sleep.... am exhausting myself with all the regrets let alone the lack of sleep. Just really want to be able to enjoy DD and these early months...

Sorry for me, me, me post, but is reassuring to hear others in the same place.

Row - what sleep training technique are you using? do you pick up, or just reassure, or something else?

Thanks Ladies.

Hi Starshinetiger,

How much solids is your baby taking during the day, and how much is she napping ? If you can work on getting these two things right, then it will be easier to sort out any sleep associations.

evening all. ok, i think we need to set up a new thread for the successful nights, cause i feel sucky posting on here when things go well, but i want my sleep deprived buddies to know when they do....it's a paradox.

kiwi - sorry about the mastitis, i had a bout a few weeks ago - scary how quickly it develops, though it did have the benefit of forcing me to stay in bed and i actually caught up on sleep!!

i'm not going to say anything about last night.

starshine BabyPanda was very similar at 6 months, despite a recent regression she HAS got better so chin up! priyag if it's not rude, I'm not sure that solids are really all that much of an answer, especially at 6 months when most babies are only just starting them. My DD eats like a (small, cute) pig and still demands feeds at night, because she wants the comfort rather than the food. Oh but I realise now you may be saying that if they eat enough in the day you may have confidence that they don't NEED to feed at night? Ah ignore me, I'm too knackered to think logically!

After the mastitis (thanks for all the get well wishes, better now at last!) and terrible nights we've bitten the bullet and gone for some CC. Last night DD woke at exactly the times she'd been feeding previously (so I'm sure it's habit not hunger) and went back to sleep after 35 mins the first time, about 25-30 the second (which DH managed to sleep through !!). Then slept in her cot for morning nap for the first time in about 3 weeks! For 1 hour 25! more . Night two tonight... fingers crossed it's not worse. I WILL be strong I WILL be strong (repeat to fade).

I feel I am having a contest of wills with a 9 month old. I cannot be beaten by someone so small.

starshine, while I agree with Priyag that solids helps, I'm with Kiwi here too. At 6 months, DS still needed milk at least once during the night. Now he's 9 months he has suddenly started properly eating 3 meals a day.

I don't think it's any coincidence that he's also started sleeping through at the same time as eating more. He's always been a brilliant napper which has saved my sanity.

Kiwi, glad to hear you're better and good luck in your contest.

We shall overcome,we shall overcoooome...

peculiar step back tonight - ds has refused solid food most of the day - i am (again) putting it down to teeth.

Priyag - i do appreciate you are trying to help, but must confess I found your advice a little simplistic - I'm fairly sure that most of us having reached 6 months of interrupted sleep have already considered the benefits of getting solids in and naps in place, but for various reasons we are all finding it isn't as straightforward as we hope.

Well that's me, anyway. Every day i add up how much food has gone in and total the amount of naps plus activity spent and promise myself that tonight will be the night where we've got everything right and I will be rewarded.....and end up feeding at 12 and 4 at a minimum. and getting up at 6. on a good day!!

i know what i need to do - stop giving ds the boob every time he murmurs and stop co - sleeping eventually. i 100% empathise with starshine when she says "Every day I go through the... I should give up Bfing and go to FF, I should have done Gina Ford, should never have let DD feed to sleep.... am exhausting myself with all the regrets let alone the lack of sleep. Just really want to be able to enjoy DD and these early months..." - this is exactly how i feel, though i've pretty much come to terms with the lack of sleep, it doesn't bother me nearly so much any more, but i am spoiling my own enjoyment of this time by stressing over whether or not I should do cc. at the end of the day, it's my choice, and pointless to worry about it! just thinking out loud here really, which is where this thread helps so much!

Blee to early morning waking. 4.50am this morning

But about the fact that DH said yesterday he'd give me a lie in this morning. Bet he was kicking himself when DS woke up. Ha ha ha.

Staines, if the idea of CC is a stress, just don't do it! You couldn't do it now when baby staines is teething anyway and co-sleeping is just soooo lovely; I am very of you that you can do it successfully. I tried to have DS in with me for a nap this morning and he just thought it was the most exciting thing in the world. Mummy's bed is clearly not for sleeping in any more so I guess our days of co-sleeping are over now

I really miss it. I wish that I could have the combined loveliness of sleeping through and co-sleeping but I'm pretty sure that DS would never have done the two together. Maybe when he's bigger. The NCSS suggests putting them in their own bed until sleeping through is secured and then having them back in with you if you really want to co-sleep (which I do). Although I am just getting used to having DH back in with me. Maybe we'll just have to get a king size bed

Argh, Feral. Why are our DSs in cahoots? 4:45 the last 3 days. He will faff around in his cot for a bit, but by 5:15 he is definitely ready to come out. But I try to remind myself that I'm not complaining if he mostly sleeps through until the 5s - except last night he was up 3 times before my bedtime and then again at 1 am...hmmmm. Still miles better than he used to be though!

Teeth are a major misery here. The top ones have taken ages to actually cut through, and I think there must be other ones on the move somewhere because he has flaming red cheeks, dribbly, more fussy than usual during the day, etc.

But I swear today he has started saying "hi" everytime he sees a picture of a human in any of our books. Is it possible or am I just an overexcited first time mum?!

Staines - It sounds like you are doing fine. No need to DO anything as long as you're chugging along. Co-sleeping has never worked for us, since DS was about 3 weeks old (he gets too excited and keeps playing), but it sounds lovely!

It's getting darker in the mornings these days so why are the DCs waking earlier??

Hello!! Sorry I've disappeared, we're moving house and it's an absolute nightmare. Last night DD slept from 10pm til 7am...aaaaahhhh!!! Amazing but...that was the last night in our house. Now I'm sat on the hotel bed with her in the travel cot grinning at me. We're not getting any sleep tonight and we've got another night in a hotel tomorrow before settling her into our next house. [sigh] what a waste of a night's sleep. DD has been waking at midnight since we got back from the holiday and one night of sleep and we're back to the nightmare...
How cute MoM!! I love it when DD says 'hello' it's sooooo sweet

for you Chulita, hope DD is better tonight and settles in nicely for you once you've moved. And congrats on your new house btw!

MoM, weird isn't it? The parallel lives that we lead! I convinced myself that DS had mimicked me saying hello the other day. And that mamamama means me and not the cat, a toy, his dinner, the washing machine etc. Today's babble is dadadada which DH was v excited about until he realised that DS was doing it to everything in sight

Re the early waking, I followed some advice I read on here and put DS to bed at 6.30 last night and he slept through until 6ish this morning which is a huuuge improvement. I'm going to try it for a week and see if it was just a fluke. It means making sure he's up from his afternoon nap by 3.30 though which is a pita.

Glad to hear some are making progress with sleeping and thanks for all the welcome and encouragement. Feral - sounds like a great night last night. Baby Whisperer does say, early to bed does mean a better night. Do you mind if I ask - how old is your DS, how bad was the sleeping and what have you done to improve it?

Well, DD had rubbish nap this afternoon and is sooo tired, she's in bed already, but was so tired by feed time she almost fell asleep feeding and didn't have a great feed, so I don't hold out great hope for tonight, we will see....

Just DS to get into bed and then I can relax for a bit (I hope I haven't jinxed that now).

Starshine, feralbaby is coming up for 10 months and has been regularly sleeping through (if you don't count the early waking) since I stopped feeding him at night 3 weeks ago (pretty much on his 9 month birthday).

He was HELL before that though and at six months - like your DD - was only just beginning to improve on the thorough crapness that had gone before. I think those of us whose DCs are a similar age have seen a very similar (and painfully slow) improvement, no matter what we've done.

For me what made a big difference was moving DS out of my room when he was about 7 months because we used to wake each other up all the time. Also doing a bit of controlled grizzling to get him down to one feed a night helped. Right up until this he would religiously wake 3 times to feed - sometimes more - often waking just to have a play for an hour or so

I definitely wouldn't have done the CC before 7 months (we had to have regular breaks for teeth) and I wouldn't have stopped the night feeds until 9 months becasue we're BLWing and I was never really sure how much solid food he'd eaten.

It's been bloody hard going and my sympathies are really with you, especially since you've got 2 DCs which must make catching your breath during the day nigh on impossible. I honestly don't know how you manage. I really want another DC but I am absolutely petrified that it will be as crap at sleeping (or worse !!) than DS has been and I don't know how I'd cope with a toddler and the exhaustion from no sleep.

It will get better though. If you had the time and the energy you could scroll back through the desperation that was us on the 4-5 month sleep thread and you'd see that we are much more normal now than we were just a few months ago!

Hi Starshine! Yes, hold out hope. My DS was 9 months on 16th September and he has slept through 90% of the nights since I stopped feeding him at night just before he was 8 months. I did lots of stuff from the No Cry Sleep Solution to reduce night feeding in the months leading up and then finally did cold turkey on night feeding once I felt he was eating lots of other food (BLW as well). Just sent DH in to do the settling for 3 nights.

We've had some bad nights in the past couple of weeks as DS had a cold and just found out today also an ear infection/fever () but even a bad night is a couple of wake ups in the evening and 1 or 2 after my bedtime (and early wakings, yes....but he goes to sleep by 6:30, so wake ups in the 5:00s are pretty inevitable).

I don't plan on leaving this thread anytime soon as between illness/teething/early starts there is still a lot of room for improvement!

Thanks Feral - that's really reassuring. Am thinking I may only bf until she's 9 months old anyway, as I am pretty sure she's dairy intolerant as her sickness and squitty nappies stopped when I stopped taking dairy, so what with all the foods I couldn't eat when pregnant due to sickness and heartburn and then all the things I can't eat now while bfing, think I will cut myself a break and stop bfing when she's 9 months old and just in time for Christmas - probably sounds selfish to some, but each to their own. Am sorry to hear you've had it so tough. I would add that each baby is different and with DS I got so caught up with the books, which told me I should never feed to sleep and teach him to feed to sleep on his own that I was really going by then when he was only 8 weeks old. I was so convinced that this contributed to my lack of success with bfing - he was really (I mean REALLY) skinny that this time I swore off the books. It probably had a lot to do with his severe reflux now. He was however going down to sleep by 7pm every night from 3 months old and although he woke regularly until 5 months old, he then started going longer and was sleeping through by 6 months old and has been a pretty good sleeper since, so I haven't got that to contend with. My DH works shifts, so he's often on a late and therefore around in the evening, so if I've had a particularly bad night, I can sometimes go back to bed when DD goes for her nap (my payout for being the only one to get up to her in the night).
Have to say if I had another, I would probably pay far more attention to the Baby Whisperer book from day 1 - get into bedtime routine from day 1 and going for naps without feeding to sleep from day 1, but would not necessarily go with their frequency of feeding, as in my experience, babies of 1 or 2 months need feeding more regularly than they suggest if they are bf (but I only have my own babies to go on).

Anyway, we are where we are - I do feel a bit stupid being on this board when I've got 2 - you'd think I'd know what I was doing - but all babies are different

Have slept in DD's room last two nights from about 2nd waking onwards. Last night was an improvement, as she went down (after Calpol - she is really struggling with teething) at 7.45. Woke at 9.30 (but as I hadn't fed since 6.30pm, I fed her then). Then apparently, she woke at 11pm and I went in and settled her really quickly - I don't actually remember doing that . Woke again at 1.15 - so I changed and fed her then am pretty sure she went through to 5am, but may have disturbed for a quick reassure ca. 3ish - am so confused by looking at my clock at night then up at 6.15ish. She has napped horridly this afternoon, so was in bed by 6.10pm, so let's see what happens. think Holby City and ironing is calling me....

Am so glad to hear it is improving for you Feral - We're doing a combination of BLW and purees here, but DD prefers finger food, so that's good, am just adding a bit of purees while she gets used to finger foods, as she's really hungry! Also, is slow going as am being cautious with all allergenic foods as we have lots of intolerances/allergies in our family.

Right - wishing all a good night's sleep!

Thanks MoM - if it's of any reassurance, DS was an early riser once he started sleeping through, but given that he was then doing 10.5-11 hours a night, it was bliss after the wakings! IIRC he started sleeping 11-11.5 hours a night from about 9 months I think - I was back at work then, so he was with a childminder and I think the days wore him out - plus I was up at 6.15 to get him and me ready, so couldn't really complain at him getting up then too! At the moment, DH and I laugh at the fact that we bemoaned 5.30/6am starts - would gladly trade off there for a sleep through the night!

When he was 2.5 we bought a bunny clock, which allowed us to move his getting up time forward from 5.45am/6am to 7am, slowly over a couple of weeks - he needed it, as he dropped his lunchtime nap the day before DD was born and he goes to bed by 7.20/7.30pm, so needed a decent night's sleep. At least I have a goal that by the time DD is 2.5/3 we hope to have both sleeping 12 hours a night and getting up around 7ish - ah bliss!!! (Hopefully the sleeping through the night will be solved long before then )

Starshine - Don't tell yourself that if you had done the Baby Whisperer routine from Day 1 you would be anywhere different. I have read every book on sleep out there, had the luxury of dedicating my life to making him sleep (first DC and 12 months mat leave!) and we still have had a long and bumpy road! I think some babies figure sleep out easily and others need more help and time. I religiously made sure he didn't feed to sleep at naps and bedtime and he still ended up addicted to the boob for middle of the night wakings. I walk him in the buggy every afternoon to make sure he gets a second nap, and it is still often only 30 mins.

They all have their strengths and weaknesses, right?? My DS strengths = eating, smiling, babbling, standing. My DS weaknesses = sleeping, rolling, crawling.

Hi star, we were doing the 5, 10, 15 min check and reassure, pat on the back, but not taking him out of the cot. Except I went more slowly than they said, so the first night I went in every 5 minutes. It seems to be working in that he now settles again for the night on his own and sleeps until around 3am, rather than being uo every hour, which is sheer bliss. I've given up on the night waking because he started teething and I refuse to do it then. I also stupidly started feeding him in the night because he finds it really hard to settle when teething. mom has given me the inspiration to stop it again but we're off for to centerparcs next week so I'll wait until we are back. One wake up is more than manageable until then anyway.

chulita hope you're in the new house and everything settles down soon.