if they fall asleep bf-ing should I wake him to put him to sleep? (training)

[kalo12]

My nearly 9 month ds wakes every hour in the night, has been doing since 4 months, I bf to sleep and put him in his cot..

He obviously thinks night time is for feeding and he doesn't hardly eat during the day.

I want to start gentle sleep training and they all say put them down awake, but I feed him and he always falls asleep.

Any advice? When he wakes I have tried many ,methods other than feeding but it can last 5 hours regularly, so i always give in and feed.

DH works nights so only me to do anything.

Help

bump please, its nearly past my bedtime

He's waking because he's falling asleep at the breast and when he rouses himself a little he realises he isn't there and so needs it again to fall asleep again. You need to stop letting him fall asleep whilst feeding him, wind him and then take him to bed while he's still awake so he learns to fall asleep on his own. At 9 months he is not too young to do this. It'll be hard work at first but if you're feeling strong and confident then you'll get there. A book that helped me when training DD1 (who was 5 months at the time) was How to Solve your Child's Sleep Problems by Dr Richard Ferber

thanks.

when i put him down awake he cries of course, but in all the methods i've read, it says it will seem like hours, but for me it really is hours. he is often awake between 12.30 am and 4 or 5. and then i always feed him cos i'm so tired.

Mmm I tend to disagree with this Disco. At 9 months he is still a young baby. He may be waking up because of separation anxiety, genuine hunger. I fed my ds to sleep every night til 12 months and he slept through from 10 weeks. I admit I was lucky but I don't think that using Ferber's idea will work. It doesn't work for every child and is likely to just make him more insecure and scared of being alone. I say this all the time but I really do believe that self settling is a developmental stage. They all do it eventually but forcing it before he is ready will only add to his sleeping problems. My friend encouraged her little boy to settle himself by using controlled crying and he has still never slept through at 22 months old. He is just not ready to sleep through yet, he needs his mummy for reassurrance.

but waking ebery hour every night since 4 months?
i really feel he is mixed up days and nights and thinks nights are for feeding, he won't bf hardly much in the day and mostly refuses solids.

i just don't know how to break the cycle, and i'm suffering pnd from exhaustion.

i do agree with you meandmyjoe, and am not bothered about sleeping through but three hours would be nice.

i average about one hour sleep a night myself

DD1 was 5 months and awoke 3 or 4 times through the night. I was recommended Ferber's book and started applying his methods. Within 5 days she was sleeping through the night and we have had no problems since. DD2 was 13 weeks old when she managed to sleep through and although I didn't apply his methods quite like I did with DD1 because she was so young, we did still implement some of his strategies. I have also had 3 or 4 friends all with differing sleep problems, the borrowed the book and they agreed that his methods had helped their children sleep through. Obviously no method is suitable for every child but I do not think that 9 months is too young to try an alternative method. Waking every hour after falling asleep at the breast each time suggests a routine problem. I think the OP needs to change something in order to establish whether it is routine or separation.

Afraid DD is right.

You could try the Pantly method in the NCSS book. Am I talking double dutch?

Basically, do it as normal, but rouse LO a tidy bit as you put them in the cot so they are not totally asleep. Repeat at nauseum, every now and then making them a little bit more awake than the last/assisting them to sleep a little less. Its slow progress but it worked for us recently when 8.5m DS "forgot" how to get himself to sleep (groan) and the only method left to help him settle was patting him to sleep on shoulder (not good with 22 pounds of baby and a dodgy back).

i'm surprised you're typing coherently with only 1 hours sleep per night. Poor thing.

I agree with DizzyDisco. DS was an appalling sleeper until 9mo and the root of it in our case was his BF-to-sleep association. Breaking that association was the key to improving his sleep.

We did do controlled crying (worked in two nights and no ill effects) but if you're uncomfortable with it there are other ways to break the BF/sleep association. The No Cry Sleep Solution book has lots of gentle methods that you can try, have you read it?

i don't think it is separation anxiety, he doesn't really seem upset. i will look up ferber, but have read many sleep books NCSS, HSHHC, a bit disallusioned, and can't try anything to hard core.

Mega post cross!!

Meant it is prob sleep association problem.

NCSS = as MegBusset says. It realls is a good book - thoroughly recommend it.

I have to admit, I have no experience of the utter exhaustion you must be feeling. I do sympathise. Ultimately, whatever you decide to do, you clearly are NEEDING to change something. I really couldn't have done ferberising but I didn't need to, who knows what I'd have done in your situation. I do sympathise. I am just a VERY soft touch but even I would struggle with the nights you are discribing!

D'oh crossed again.

Don't be down. You have got this far - it WILL get better

do you co-sleep? There is a long thread on here by people will similar probs I think, something about "help me with my constantly waking 6mo". Have you had a look? Mind find some tips there if you are not happy trying anything you have read so far.

i did patting and shusing for 4 hurs once, and he was completely hyper active so we got up and started the day.

also tried the unlatching from pantleys method, she says you may have to do it up to five times. i've been doing it since six months at every feed.

he went early tonight cos we were up so early and he did manage to sleep through the whole of strictly so can't complain.

i'm so used to not sleeping now,, some nights i don't sleep at all. look like total shit though, have lost three and half stone!

thanks for advice, keep it coming, will try anything except CIO. he doesn't actually cry, he justs gets angry and hyper active

Whats his routine kalo? What times he waking in the morning (for the day), when's his naps, when does he officially go to bed?

did try co sleeping , but he didn't sleep any better and i slept worse. now he is too manic, he would be off down the road and catching a night bus to leicester square if i closed my eyes for one minute.

usually he has some tea at about 4.30 - 5 ish. then bath at six, roll about on the bed whilst i try and get some clothes on him, quite relaxing, dark room lullabys, then breast feed down by about seven.

in the morning usually last wake up at 5.30 ish bf till about 6 ish play and singing in bed then get up for breakfast at 7.
after break and play about , he is tired, sometimes i bf and put him in his pram to sleep (more reliable than cot and i need that time) or sometimes will walk him round the block.
Then he will sleep for about and hour.

he has another nap after lunch at 12.30 - 1 for about hour and half.

have followed gina ford recently and marc weissbluth. he naps at the right times naturally for the right amount, sometimes i even can put him down awake for these naps in his pram

LOL - slept through Strictly. Nice to find another addict .

If he is hyper, then I think that is a sign of overtired, but I guess you know that already seems as he wakes so much. Does he nap OK during the day?

Sod this "looking fab" supermum business. My hair is falling out, what's left is frizzier than an ape's bum, my make-up has gone mouldy through dis-use and my weight has gone mental through cholcolate abuse (my solution to sleep deprivation/stress).

I know how you feel. Each solution you try you secretly think "this one is it - it will solve all my problems" and as it becomes more and more obvious it isn't going to work you start to think "It's my fault, I must be doing something wrong. The answer is there, I just have to find it".

Then I pull out what hair I have left trying to get the little bugger love to go to farking sleep.

So days sound under controll - have you tried changing his bed-time to see if it makes a difference?

His naps do sound about right but if you can put him down through the day and he manages to go to sleep on his own then he just needs to sort out the evening. What happens if you put him in the cot through the day? Perhaps he thinks his pram is his bed and his cot is a bit alien to him.

gabster, every night when i put him to sleep i think 'i bet he sleeps 3 hours tonight' cos things go okay, sometimes textbook example in the day.
i haven't really tried putting him to be later cos i have had enough by then and am so knackered.

i'm voting for heather small to stay in, i should have married Brian Fortuna really.

baby is crying so going to go, will check back later though

Hang in there Kalo.

By the way, about changing bed-time - meant try making it earlier not later.

My LO used to be on a 7 to 7 routine but kept waking early and could not get to grips with it/was always over-tired/would not nap properly. But then, as if by magic, decided one night could not take anymore (DH never here during the week, and it was a Thursday and had just HAD ENOUGH) and put him to bed at 6.30. As if by magic, he slept until 7.30 next day!! It is definitely his "time" (although of course all completely pants now due to clocks changing).

Hope the night goes OK Kalo.

Sorry, but have to leave you - am off to bed now (don't live in the UK and its 10pm here so am asleep on my feet) but will see how you got on in the morning. Good luck.

G

dizzy, you're right he definately needs my nipple in his mouth to fall asleep.

these fireworks aren't helping, he's woken again!

Fireworks are a bugger when you're putting children to sleep. I remember sitting on tenterhooks on many an occasion. Hope things get better for you