DD10 takes hours to fall asleep - when does melatonin become an option??

[FusionChefGeoff]

DD10 is very emotional at the moment which we're attributing to hormones and it also seems to be triggering a massive sleep relapse.

As a baby she was a dream - used to point to her cot and self settle no problems.

But for the last 18 months / 2 years she's had periods of finding it very hard to get to sleep. Usually it resolves after a few weeks but this latest set back has been months now with no improvement.

We have a very carefully planned wind down routine starting at 7pm screens off, talking about our day, I read to her, she reads to herself. Sometimes we do gratitudes, sometimes she talks about worries but not much.

She can't articulate what's stopping her but repeatedly has said she doesn't want to go to sleep. Not in a stroppy way, but just in a slightly scared / anxious way - but she can't go beyond that to explain why she doesn't want to go to sleep.

I tentatively suggested talking to someone about it and she flipped out getting very agitated / tearful and telling me to "just stop talking mummy"

She's now said that she feels babyish as she has to sleep in our bed, with us, with a light on and with either lullabies, stories or meditation tracks on to fall asleep.

If she's particularly grotty (ie needs sleep!) I will stay with her and she drops off around 9/9.30.

If we've left her to it, I go to bed around 10.30 and generally she's still awake but will fall asleep once I get in with her. But we've often had 2 hours of up and down stairs so I'm getting very despondent. DH and I have no time to talk / watch something and I often have work to do (own business) that I can't even attempt in the evening now.

She's very hard to wake in the mornings so isn't getting enough sleep.

When does melatonin become an option?? Or am I overreacting and just need to wait it out some more??

I've no idea what I'm talking about but it feels like this could do with less pressure. The focus on sleep may well be causing the anxiety. Why are you having to go up to her when she's in your bed (not asking with judgement, just to help think of solutions)

DS has always thought sleep was for the weak, so I have some experience here.

Melatonin access is weird in the UK - GP won’t/cant prescribe it, so you would need to get a referral to a pediatrician. We used to do this and get it dispensed from a pharmacy, until a MN’er told me it’s available online from the US as a food supplement. There is no difference in the effect, as far as I can tell. Both worked well for DS.

I’ve also had decent results from an electric blanket (!), warm milk and lots of lavender oil in the bath.

Just lay down with her until she drops off at 9/9:30. Leave her to read for a little while until 8:00 ish, then go and snuggle. Don't ask 101 questions pre sleep, just quiet music or meditation app. It will pass x

Solfeggio music is great to help get to sleep.

My DD can go through similar phases, although is older so settles herself now (thankfully….i feel your pain, though, and it will pass!) . She’s recently gone through another over active mind phase which has made it difficult for her to get off to sleep. We’ve found magnesium foot cream, put on at bed time, to be really effective.

Magnesium glycinate supplements an hour or so before bed have really helped my teen who struggles to get to sleep.

You need to get her into her own bed OP

Is she physically active outdoors many times a week? Long walks if she doesn't enjoy a specific sport? Natural light and exercise endorphins would be my approach over medication.

I have a 10 year old DD and I could've written your post. She procrastinates sleep until we are exhausted! Some days it worries, sometimes it's worrying about not sleeping and other days it's lack of being tired. I have no answers, I'm taking one day at a time and sometimes sit with her until she's asleep, hoping this passes soon..

Wow thanks so much. This is so reassuring / helpful.

She's very active - basketball squad, rugby, school PE, yoga, gymnastics, dance (the last 2 are just short after school clubs. Some days the amount she's done is bonkers and yet she still can't sleep.

We tried kids magnesium gummies but I'll look at the variation mentioned above and also the foot cream

We've tried to take the pressie off and talk about resting not necessarily sleeping so I'll try to focus more on that. But you're right - it's become a THING which isn't helping.

Will also look at the music

Have a hardcore non/sleeping DD here so I might be able to offer sone suggestions

I'd say that you're starting the wind down a bit too early. Yes, take the personal screens away at 7 but maybe start to C25K together or do a workout together on YouTube. Talk about it being fun and how you just want to be more healthy.

Sunlight really helps with sleep so try and get her outside at least once a day. As well as the magnesium a Vit D supplement might help her too.

Exercise is also really important.

So Sunlight, exercise, Vit D, Magnesium, maybe a walk or bath or shower before bed as the change in temperature can help induce sleep.

I'd also try a weighted blanket and some Sleepy cream from Lush and a later bedtime, maybe 9pm?

And if all of that doesn't work then try the Melatonin

It's common to have periods of insomnia, one of mine was particularly bad at times, 1, 2 in the morning but it does pass usually and I found letting her stay up a bit later helped so she was more tired going to bed

Weighted blanket?
My DD was a rubbish sleeper for years but has got the hang of it now.
Telling her resting quietly in bed is a good way to prepare for sleep and a good thing by itself was surprisingly helpful.
We have all tended to go to bed at the same time for years though. Us being still up and awake did keep her awake too.

My Dd was like this for years, could lie there for up to 7hrs before falling asleep, Dr prescribed her piriton to take before bed, after a few weeks. She didn't need it Anymore and got into the habit of falling asleep without it.

My DC finds the slow release Melatonin works the best for them.

Talking about worries before bed doesn’t seem like a good idea

If you need melatonin, you can just order it online from Chronodorm, it's sent from France in a few days and I've always found it very reliable. DD used to take several hours to fall asleep and then waking again through the night - we were all on our knees. It pretty much saved us. I would never be without some in the house now.

I agree with not making it a 'thing'. If she feels babyish maybe that's the opportunity to agree that she's a big girl now and you will help her sleep in her own room now. Then breezily give her the tablet at bedtime with no fuss, just as something to help her sleep, no big deal.

The melatonin tablets are tiny pills that dissolve under the tongue in a minute or two, and bring on a sense of drowsiness 15-20 mins later, so you need to get the timing right, she needs to be in bed when her melatonin levels rise otherwise she'll be able to power right through. They don't actually sedate her, just create the condition for sleep. We found it took all the stress out of bedtime. DD had them nightly from age 2 to about 5/6, and now doesn't need them anymore.

I sometimes travel for work and use them occasionally to synch up when jetlagged - they're fabulous

Link to the ones I use if helpful:

https://www.sanareva.co.uk/product-chronodorm-melatonin-30-tablets.html?srsltid=AfmBOopxJOsZ5_gMVNINckuEF9SGaoVGH_eonJZyI1NUYTIvKzq9lrmc

She's very active - basketball squad, rugby, school PE, yoga, gymnastics, dance (the last 2 are just short after school clubs. Some days the amount she's done is bonkers and yet she still can't sleep.

Maybe she's just too wired, with so many activities? Could she take a break from a couple and just have a leisurely walk instead, If you or her dad can go with her? How much real downtime does she have, where her routine isn't planned out?

@DesparatePragmatist that's massively helpful thank you. I've got some on order.

I think I will use her latest feeling "babyish" comment to try for a move back into her bed and keep with the resting not sleeping message.

Talking about worries was trying to get them out of her head as I think that's what's keeping her up sometimes - and I know she overthinks stuff so I'm trying to nip that in the bud rather than letting her spiral into unfounded worries. But agree I shouldn't be actively looking for worries - just creating a space to share / get things off her chest really

Her weekends are pretty relaxed; yoga for an hour on Sat am and rugby for 90 mins approx on Sundays.

In the week, the only 'real' club is basketball; the others are basically instead of after school club for childcare and done by 4pm so can't change those. I think she has a good amount of downtime.

We went for a lovely family walk Friday evening to the pub for dinner, I walked to the shops with her on Sat and we also went swimming in my gym (mainly diving for sinkers!) so we do general activity as well as her clubs.

It’s simply not true that GPs can’t prescribe melatonin and you have to order it from overseas. My daughter has a repeat prescription for it from our GP. You could visit your GP and ask.

My sister is at her wits end too. She starts bedtime process for nephew at 7pm. He is 7 years old. Has a bath each night. He will still be running around the house, jumping on sofa/beds, shouting at 2am then can't get up for school. GP can't do anything. School won't support a referral to secondary care. Stuck going around in circles with everyone tired and grumpy

Stop talking to her! Bath, supper, teeth, in own bed with white noise and a night light. If she comes down, take her back up and put her in her own bed. Think of it as sleep training a toddler. Keep communication to an absolute minimum.