Sleep training - do you feel it affected your baby?

[abitfunny]

Just that really. My second son is nearly eight months old and sleep is pretty much non existent. He goes down fine (breastfed) but from the time I go to bed until morning he usually wakes hourly/every other. It is so bloody hard. We’ve fallen into the boob to sleep habit so he has no way of knowing how to self soothe.

I feel like our only option is to try some method of sleep training but am really worried that it might affect him long term. I hate the thought of them just giving up and going to sleep. But then i also hate the idea of me becoming so sleep deprived that I end up depressed.

Would love to hear of people’s experiences?

This is a very useful article summarising all the studies on sleep training and what they show about effectiveness and the effect on the baby. Summary essentially is that is works and doesn't appear to cause any harm, but does bring benefits to the child emilyoster.substack.com/p/sleep-training-is-it-bad

You have to be persistent and briefly grit your teeth, but it should work. No negative effects I can see. Everyone gets more sleep.

@oneglassandpuzzled oh it did, from 3-4 ish. It’s not at a pathological level, just definitely lacking in confidence in areas her sister never has. But it’s likely she would always have been that way; we’ll never know.

And the sleep training meant I was a better mother to both my children than I would have been otherwise. The first year with my second was one of the happiest I’ve ever had.

Sleep makes everything easier!

I sleep trained both DS 1&2 at what MN would describe as an extremely young age. I could not cope with lack of sleep and at the time DH was working away most of the time. Was tough for a couple of nights but that was it. They are now perfectly well adjusted teenagers achieving at the top level academically and have shown no signs of problems whatsoever.

I carry no guilt about this at all.

I think the concerns over a couple of sessions of controlled crying which is all it takes for most people have gone too far and mothers are loosing out by not being trusted to take sensible decisions.

It massively affected my baby.

She got way more sleep and became happy and calm instead of grumpy and whingey. Her mother and father also had way more energy for her having a positive knock on effect on the whole family.

HTH

We did Jo Frosts controlled timed crying technique at 10 months after we had 4 months of hourly wake ups. It took less than 10 minutes on first night then 5 minutes the second night then straight away 3rd night and slept through and she's been an amazing sleeper ever since (apart from illness etc). Happy, well rested and secure child.

@Tee20x I would definitely second the sleep consultant recommendation - yes, the method we used was freely available on the internet but for me the sleep consultant was worth it for two reasons: someone to hold your hand through the whole process, making it much less likely that you'll cave and change course - because it works so much better and faster if you're consistent and see it through once you've started; and also someone to answer questions when it doesn't go quite how the internet described - we tried to do some gentle sleep training ourselves before we went the sleep consultant route and I struggled massively with information overload - it was such a relief just to outsource the whole process of formulating a plan to someone else.

Hmm...
I was very swayed by the gentle parenting narrative and was desperate to give my daughter the secure attachment that I think my 80s childhood didn’t offer me.
On reflection, I think it might have been better for my mental health and my marriage to go through the pain of a few nights of crying for the reported following better nights’ sleep.
Both my DH & I ended up in therapy and on anti depressants because we just didn’t sleep for 3.5 years. We couldn’t really cope now I look back and I still feel bad about how angry the tiredness made me towards colleagues, family members and friends.
If I were to do it again, I would make a plan before giving birth and stick to it. I’d call in more resources and I would go back to work full time after a year. Working part time and having no money but no energy and always doing all of the domestic labour, made me resentful, miserable and very sad.
Saying that, my DD is extremely confident, well-behaved, secure and bright and I do wonder whether putting all of my eggs in the mothering basket for a few years contributed to this.
It’s hard and I love all mums for battling through this tough terrain. Mainly silently.

What approach did you take to do this my little girl is the same age and I’m really struggling atm

It's impossible to tell op. Most people who do it say there are no negative effects. How would they know? Most of us will get mental health problems and we can't trace it back. There are so many variables. I think ideally you don't do it, but if it's affecting your mental health then it's better than a depressed mum.

Just be don't someone who does it because you're feeling pressured to or told your situation is abnormal. Only do it because its right for you.

@Bunnybunny1

Hmm... I was very swayed by the gentle parenting narrative and was desperate to give my daughter the secure attachment that I think my 80s childhood didn’t offer me. On reflection, I think it might have been better for my mental health and my marriage to go through the pain of a few nights of crying for the reported following better nights’ sleep. Both my DH & I ended up in therapy and on anti depressants because we just didn’t sleep for 3.5 years. We couldn’t really cope now I look back and I still feel bad about how angry the tiredness made me towards colleagues, family members and friends. If I were to do it again, I would make a plan before giving birth and stick to it. I’d call in more resources and I would go back to work full time after a year. Working part time and having no money but no energy and always doing all of the domestic labour, made me resentful, miserable and very sad. Saying that, my DD is extremely confident, well-behaved, secure and bright and I do wonder whether putting all of my eggs in the mothering basket for a few years contributed to this. It’s hard and I love all mums for battling through this tough terrain. Mainly silently.

This is the thing. We didn't sleep train and my ds is the most lovely, attached and happy boy. But we have also struggled. So it's a real toss up!

But it does make me angry when people pretend it is acceptable to sleep train a 5 month old when research shows it DOES negatively affect their development. I've had a paediatrician confirm this. 🙄

Just to be clear, there is no evidence that gentle parenting techniques foster secure attachment more than more traditional but still loving and attentive parenting. The guy who developed 'attachment parenting' theory just gave it that name because he thought it sounded like a good fit, but there is literally zero research to show that sling use/not sleep training etc leads to more secure attachment than other standard approaches. I can see how people who have suffered through the martyrdom of gentle parenting want to believe that their child's happy, secure, confident demeanor is the direct result of all their suffering but if you're just starting down this road, maybe pay more attention to the science? (If gentle parenting works for your family unit then great, but I've seen first hand how it can ruin lives and I hope no-one would go into it feeling like they had to, to do right by their child)

@Etherealhedgehog as a gentle parent who almost fell off the edge of sanity in the first few years, I agree.
You have to look at your family resources and decide how to stretch them out across everyone.
I applied the same expectations of myself that women I used to Nanny for (wealthy, well resourced) had.
I had very very little money, no family support, a depressed and old husband with little energy, no close friends and lots of my own personal losses to deal with not to mention a DSD with SEN who school refused, self harmed and whose mother made my life hell.
I now look back at my life’s landscape at the time and don’t know how I got through feeding on demand through the night every night for 3.5 years and giving every resource I had to my DD.
Next time round (which probably won’t be) I will be much more pragmatic.

All babies are individuals. There is no one sleep training method that will work for all of them. I made the mistake in thinking that it would, that the "experts" knew all babies. A couple of people who have posted on here (@Tee20x and someone else, forgotten who sorry) had exactly the same experience as me by the sound of it.

DS was about 11 months when I tried controlled crying. He got more and more hysterical, not less, every time I went into him while increasing the time gaps. I did it exactly like you're supposed to. Exactly. I was calm and determined. All it resulted in was a clammy vomiting, terrified, shaking mess - him not me lol. I am a stubborn cow and carried on for 2 hours with him getting worse and worse till I copped on and realised that actually, no, he didn't fit the stereotype of what is supposed to happen and I hadn't been doing it wrong. It just wasn't right for HIM and for him it was bordering on child abuse. It took me a further hour to calm him down enough for him to go to sleep - by this time it was hours after his usual sleep time (the irony...)

I researched other things and did gradual retreat. It worked a charm, but I grant you it did take about a week and and a half, and a lot of extra effort. Was so worth it.

With DS2 he was a different personality. After colic finished (and that was hell!), it seemed that he was a baby that loved his cot and his sleep. He would get sleepy in my arms, I'd put him down in his cot and he would do a little sleepy smile and just relax straight away and off he went to sleep. Not a problem.

He's 15 now and still loves his bed, goes straight to sleep the minute he gets in usually. My eldest tends to lie there pondering life (so probably no different to what he tended to do as a baby, only when they're babies and they're the "lying there pondering" types none of their thoughts make much sense yet so no wonder they feel all confused and upset.

They are ALL different. There is no mould that they should all fit.

How does it negatively affect their development? Can you post a link with the literature? Not at all doubting you, just trying to work out what best to do.

Yes I do think it affected her. For the better

Gradual retreat method, reducing night feeds and getting a cot nap routine led to my son having massively improved sleep and happier mood so it benefited him for the better and of course me. Absolutely consistency is key with regards to bedtime routine and nap time wakings.

It really depends!!!

Some kids are ok others aren't.

I 100% regret doing any kind of sleep training on DC1. My stomach turns when I remember the HOURS of crying.... 😔 I felt like it was expected! Everyone did it! My child had to be sleep trained like everyone else! My child had to sleep like everyone else! And that is BS!!

DC2 was much easier :) but either way them and DC3 just slept in our bed until 2yo and were breastfed on demand 🤷🏻‍♀️ yes I woke up a couple/few of times a night but very briefly just to put the boob out

I have 3. Eldest 2 were sleep trained at around 8/9 months throught controlled crying (eldest) or PUPD (second), both sleep incredibly well now and did as children. They are 16 and 14.
I also have an 11 year old who slept in my room for first 2 years of life (small house) and wasn't sleep trained. He's a terrible sleeper and still often wants to cosleep with me or in one of his siblings rooms.
I think you have a great window when thru are 8/9 months and not mobile - if you miss it, it's much more distressing and difficult later when they can get themselves out of bed/consciously keep themselves awake.
Really wish I'd put my foot down with DC3 but exH didn't want to sleep train him and I'm still paying the price.

I only have one child so what do I know but it was very apparent with mine when she needed to sleep, and if we missed that moment, she went in to adrenalin overdrive, so from that point of view it affected her for the better.

I just wanted to say thanks to everyone who contributed to this thread. It gave me a lot of confidence to start sleep training our 6 month old, whose sleep had got progressively worse over the last two months, and in just six days we have seen HUGE improvements! I know these things aren’t necessarily linear and it might go up and down a bit, but I don’t think it’s being dramatic to say that my life has changed in the last week and I’m so relieved we’ve given it a go!

I’m always surprised how many people are willing to ignore the guidelines re: sharing a room until a year old to reduce risk of SIDS. Surely sleep training just isn’t worth the risk.