Lucy Wolfe's sleep solution

[kate288]

Hey! Just wondering if anyone is currently trying this or has used the book previously? I've always been a bit anti 'sleep training' as I know babies are meant to wake during the night as it is developmentally normal. However, I'll be going back to work soon and my 9 month olds sleep is still difficult (waking every 1.5-2 hours during the night) and will only feed back to sleep and I just don't feel I'll be able to function at work! Luckily her naps have really improved recently.

One night during night feeds I decided to buy the book on Amazon and it arrived today, but from giving it a quick skim through it looks quite intense! Just wondering if anyone has used it or if about to start maybe we could use this as a support thread haha.

I hate the idea of my DD being upset but I also need sleeeeeep!

I did consultation with her for my first rather than the book and best money I ever spent. If you make decision to sleep train then you need to give it 3 weeks and 100% stick to it otherwise unfair on you and baby

Hiya, I did this a few months ago and had a lengthy support thread on here! I’ll paste the link and maybe actually post on it again as I wonder how the others are getting on now.

So, it’s been amazing - DD2 was waking pretty much hourly and feeding and rocking was taking ages to settle her. I was dead against sleep training with my first but it was becoming impossible to parent both kids on that little sleep. She slept through the night after 3 or 4 nights, and has done ever since, only wakes if teething or something. And in the outset, there were not nearly as many tears as I anticipated, and because you are there and can comfort and soothe, I didn’t feel too bad about it.

But - it is intense - I’ve become so obsessed with the timings of everything, because she now really struggles to fall asleep if overtired and going to sleep even 10 min late can cause loads of crying. Maybe this was always the case and I’m now more aware of what’s going wrong. So this means naps are a bit of a lottery and several times a week we will have horrible screaming nap refusal, but she’s exhausted, and now her sleep anywhere other than the cot is really poor. But when timings are right she will have two beautiful 1.5hr naps in cot and it all feels worth it!

I should also add that we have still not gotten to put down and go, due to things getting in the way, illness mainly - she has nasty colds constantly! But she lies down and falls asleep quietly within 5min if well timed and is lying silent in corner of room. I think she could cope with us leaving but I’m too exhausted to try it out with all my stressing over naps!!

So I’m not sure what you’ll make of that. I’m would recommend it - sleeping through the night is amazing- but it’s not a magic bullet and we still have other problems

Thanks so much for the feedback! I was (and still am kind of) against sleep training for me personally but I also know that I'll be a better mum with more sleep!! Strangely enough my DD naps really well in her cot now and we pretty much already stick to the nap gaps outlined in her book (accidentally). Although she will be going to nursery soon so I'm sure all of that will go out the window 🤦‍♀️ its so difficult because I really love feeding/cuddling her to sleep and will really miss it but at the same time I know that's what's waking her up so much I think! I'm also sad to night wean entirely, not sure how I feel about that. But definitely going to give it a try. I look forward to reading the other thread!

Sorry I forgot to paste the thread didn’t I! Here it is www.mumsnet.com/Talk/sleep/3598253-how-to-start-self-settling

You’ll see in that towards the end a couple of the mums talking about keeping one or two night feeds so it’s there as an option if you feel more comfy. I like that about her method, and watching her instagram videos (they are useful), that she really encourages you to honour what you feel is right.

We night weaned gradually before starting the method at around 9mo, I didn’t find it a wrench as feeding to sleep wasn’t doing it’s job anymore, but with my first I’d have never been able to do it at that stage. You could argue though it’s less confusing for them. I’m happy to dot in with any thoughts once you’re doing it if you do give it a go, I’m sure there will be others too and I really found the support helpful.

Thanks for the thread @merename it's been really helpful. Tonight's night one of trying and she's currently screaming the house down with my dh upstairs, have taken the dog for a walk to escape for a bit. Starting to feel terrible now but may as well give it a try now that we've started the process!

Hi OP. We are a month or so in to this and its been fantastic. DS still feeds during the night (endless teething) but our naps and bedtime routine are revolutionised. I have got to the point where I put DS in the cot, and then just lay on the bedroom floor until he's asleep, and that works for us at the moment.

Hopefully your DD has fallen asleep by now. It does get easier, but the first week or so was tough going for us. Totally worth it though.

Great to hear that @loladisco and nice to hear you're still feeding as I hope to still feed once/twice through the night. DD went down quite easily (20 mins) but then woke up half an hour later and screamed heartbreakingly for an hour 😭 so awful. But she's back asleep. I keep having thoughts of whether we're doing the right thing but we need to keep going now. Hopefully it gets easier soon!

How has it gone this past day OP? Dreadful here as DS had his 1 year jabs today so has been very much out of sorts. I'm bracing myself for a disturbed night. Never mind, tomorrow is another day!

@loladisco thanks for asking! last night went ok, she prob woke up the same number of times as usual but my DH was able to settle her without boob so I suppose that's a bit of success! She went down after only 15 mins of crying tonight but woke up 3 hours later and wouldn't settle so I had to feed her. Im finding the night weaning bit too strict, don't think I can do it as strictly as in the book! Going to try and not feed before 3.5 hours. I still feel so awful about it all but my DH thinks we should keep going since we have started the process, just hate hearing her upset.

Sorry to hear your little one has been out of sorts because of the jabs, I'm really dreading the 1 year ones. Hope you don't have too much of a sleepless night!!

I've just bought this book. My 5 month old has been waking every 1-2 hours (sometimes less) since 3.5months and I am completely exhausted. Daytime naps are also suffering. I've found the book a bit overwhelming, not quite sure where to start!! So far the only change I've made is to try and not feed on every wake and move the last feed of the day to an hour before bedtime. I've not seen any improvement yet, its been about 4/5 days. I'm still rocking/holding him back to sleep though...

Have you seen any improvements yet?

Were only on day 3 but have seen some improvements but some things have gotten worse unfortunately! Her naps which are usually good (only since she was 7 5 months- sure your LO will get there!) have been really good but today she's only slept 2x40 mins. and she's usually up at 7/7:30 but has been wakening at 6 since we started!! Really hoping it's just because there's been a change and it'll settle soon.

It's taken almost an hour to get her to sleep tonight with lots of tears, not very nice at all! But last night we only had 2 wake ups (between 7:30 and 6) which I fed her for which is much better than the usual 2 hourly. Not sure how tonight will go though as technically going by the book she should have went down at 6 but we didn't get her down until 6:30 and then she cried for nearly an hour.

Hope you have more luck, it's so hard but your LO is still so teeny so there will be lots of time for things to improve! X

Hi @merename and @loladisco. I was just wondering when you first started putting your LO in the cot awake, did they get really upset? We are almost 2 weeks into it now and she still screams and cries for atleast 20 mins (but often 45+ mins) when we put her down. Her night time sleep has improved (2 wakes/feeds as opposed to every 2 hours) but she is just as upset now as she ever was! Feeling terrible. How long did it take your little ones to adjust? X

Hi @kate288 yes my DS did get very upset to start with at being put in the cot awake. Bedtime was easier because my DH would do it. Naptimes were worse because I would do them and he just wanted me to pick him up and feed him. I cant quite remember how long it lasted, certainly a good few weeks though. Sometimes the distraction techniques worked wonders, other times it just took a lot of persistence with them to calm him down. He still will mess about in his cot every so often but I remind myself that I dont just fall asleep as soon as I lie down, i mess abouttoo getting comfy etc.

Its great that your DDs sleep is improving, but it is hard to see them be upset. The best thing you can do, in my opinion anyway, is to just continue being consistent so it gives her a chance to learn to settle. She'll get there. And although she is upset you are with her and you know shes safe. Are you following the suggested routine? I am loosely for sleep/wake time and I have found that helps alot.

its so tough but it sounds like you're doing a great job

Thanks for the reply @loladisco ! I'm definitely going to keep going with it as I think it would be unfair to stop now and all the tears be for nothing! I've been roughly following the nap schedule and that's really helping, although her morning nap is always her longest nap. Although shell be starting nursery in a few weeks so sure all of that will go out the window! She still feeds much more than the 3 times specified in the book though. It's good to hear that your little one stopped getting upset at bedtime, I can handle the faffing about in the cot without tears! Hopefully she will get used to it in the next few weeks 😊

Hello @kate288, I remember the second or third week being particularly hard, as I expected it to be a lot better than it was by then. Also, my DD started sleeping through very quickly, so I felt why I am I struggling with this so much even though I’m getting sleep?! It was all I ever wanted!! It was mainly because the put downs were so unpredictable, sometimes she’d cry for ages, other times not at all. And like you I found the tears so stressful, and always felt responsible. I found for us that the timings were everything, going even 10 min too late sometimes made all the difference. And we learned that if ever in doubt, take her up in the early side, I never regretted going too early and having a longer routine, than too late = loads of tears. Mine never showed signs of tiredness, that I could tell anyway.

Due to one thing or another, it took us 3 months to get to ‘put down and go’, and things have vastly improved since we started leaving the room about 3 weeks ago. She now rarely cries on being put down, and if she does it’s not intense, for a few minutes. I think she’s now just so familiar with what to do, and now that she has well developed going to sleep skills, she can do it even if a bit overtired, which she definitely couldn’t at first. Hang in there, and make sure you get breaks - it’s tough going against your instincts in this way, but I do feel it’s worth it for us all.

Thanks for the reply @merename ! Feeling a bit more positive today as although she took 30 mins to settle last night, that's the quickest I've managed to get her down. And she slept 7:30-12(fed) and 12:30 to 6 which is the longest she's gone without a feed, baby steps! Think we definitely need to find the best time for putting her down when she's not over tired, the 4 hour gap seems just a bit long for her just now. Hopefully things continue to get better 😊

That’s good a bit of progress. I can’t remember now but wasn’t it 3.5hr gap for bedtime, 4 being absolute max? Or maybe that’s what we’ve ended up going with, as 4 is definitely too long for mine. Actually now I think, I’m sure we started going really early as when we had to do an extra 3rd nap days due to short naps, she was going down really well in the evening after only 2.5hrs, it seemed to work so much better as she was all chirpy and happy through the routine, only getting yawny towards the end, and that seems a better environment for learning the skills. Hope going earlier makes it nicer for you all.

Hi Kate,

I feel so bad for you! You must be so exhausted & as someone who is also going back to work (& have a 9 month old) I know how anxiety provoking the whole thing is!

My LO was never the best sleeper & was still waking up three/four times a night up until last month. People kept telling me to try her on water instead of milk during the night, but after 10 minutes of fussing, I would just cave out of tiredness/feeling bad!

But then she started teething (second set) and was waking every hour but refusing her bottle, so I just persevered with her over three nights (it was rough). But then when her teeth came through - she slept from 6pm - 6am for the first time ever & has done so ever since... so she effectively night weaned herself!

My baby has always fed to sleep & I still do it now when I put her down at night & before naps. But if she wakes in the night now (once in a blue moon), I just give her a bit of water and she just goes back down straight away.

Could be worth a try - as out situation seems really similar!! Good luck! X

Oh! Also we have always done a dream feed at 10pm (before we went to bed) that also helped a lot! We still do that now... and held off the next feed.

Also, is there any chance your baby could have silent reflux - we tried LO with a gaviscon infant & she slept SO much better after that. She's now on the right medication and since we nailed that, her sleep has gone strength to strength. It was misdiagnosed as colic until she was 5 months, the poor kid!

It could be worth trying it if you suspect that? 3/7 kids in my parenting group have it, so it must be very common!

Thanks for the reply @Hamster85 ! That's great to hear your little one weaned herself! We've managed to get down to 2 night feeds which is soooo much better than the every 2 hours she was feeding before. I could try water for one of those to see if that helps, although I can imagine that I'd have a really angry baby haha. When she was a newborn I think she had reflux but it seemed to get better, but still might be worth thinking about! Tonight was probably the worst put down since starting the sleep training as she screamed inconsolably for an hour non stop. I think we're moving too fast for her just now so will go back to stroking/singing etc for now. Trying hard not to start feeding to sleep again as I feel like we've come so far and her night sleep has really improved! I'd be totally happy with 2 wake ups per night at the moment if she wasn't so inconsolable when put in her cot awake. But we will persevere!

We've had a really rotten bedtime tonight. My little one cried/screamed for 2 hours and has only just fallen asleep. I don't know if she can manage this approach but i really don't want to go back to feeding to sleep as I feel it's a step backwards and her night time sleep has really improved. But we also can't have her inconsolable for so long and it's not getting any better. Unsure what to do really! Part of me wonders whether us being in the room with her makes her worse as she can see us but we're not picking her up, but then leaving her to cry on her own seems even more cruel!

@kate288 Ho Kate, sorry, as I've not read the book so have no idea what I'm talking about but just read the bit where you said leaving the room may actually be better and it reminded me of my DS when he was a similar age.
He never would feed or rock to sleep and used to scream a lot if kept up too long so I did have him in quite a strict routine but he was difficult to put down for a long time. A couple of things I think I learned that may help: his most hysterical put downs were usually following fairly intense days, not necessarily bad nap days, but maybe days where we'd had visitors and stuff like that, so more stimulation before bed than usial, or a rushed bedtime routine. Secondly I began to feel that me hovering over him shhhing, giving him his dummy etc was just upsetting him even more, so I ebded up what is, I guess, controlled crying. I would put him down following the usualy routine etc then leave the room, when he started crying I would wait a minute (tried to wait 3 mins usually) to see if he sounded like he might be settling (pauses in his crying etc), then if still crying I'd wait for a quiter moment, go back in, do some shhhing (he usually then cried more), I didnt stay long, each time I went out he would settle bit more and each time I went in I would stay closer to the door doing my shhing and usually I didn't have to go in many times. I think it worked because he understood 'mummy has gone now, time to sleep' whereas when I was there he was thinking 'why is she hanging around, is she going to get me up? Why isn't she getting me up!' He's still a bit like it now at nearly 3 - if I don't say the exact right words and start dilly dallying leaving the room he gets upset because he's confused and the other week actually asked me to leave, haha.
We probably had a couple of months of going in and out to him every few mins at bedtime (usually for max 15 mins?) and then he was great after that at going down and has been ever since.
I'm not trying to say you should change your technique, but your gut might be right in telling you she's a bit confused about you hanging around. You have to do what you're comfortable with. It's so hard being a mummy!xxx

Sorry about the typos! Doing everything in a rush as usual!!!!!

@pleasetellmeIwillsurvive thanks so much for your message. I definitely think she's wondering why the heck I'm standing there just looking at her and not picking her up. It must be quite confusing for her! I think 2 weeks is enough time of trying our current approach and to know it's not quite for my DD. I've decided I'm going to try leaving the room and going in every few mins to soothe tomorrow. I always said I wouldn't do controlled crying but I feel we need to give it a go or else we're back at square one and that's not fair on my DD either. Thanks for sharing your experience it's really helpful.

Oh that’s horrible for you all Kate, poor wee thing. Just to chip in as the Lucy Wolfe fan, lol, she talks about some kids being ‘all or nothing’ kids and that interval visits may suit them better. I read that bit recently but can’t remember what part of the book now. But it was because we got stuck at lying in the corner of the room and everything had become so unpredictable, sometimes she’d go down perfectly, other times loads of crying, and we’d be lying in there for ages. Anyway one day I couldn’t take it anymore, lying in the dark with her crying and feeling that there was nothing I could do that helped, and I left the room and returned at intervals. Kept doing the same thing from there on in and now she goes down without a peep 90% of the time. Hope things start to improve soon.