So tired.

[Nosleepforthewicked]

Hi,

My baby is 5 months next week and has never been good at sleeping. Ever. I've come to terms with his day time sleep. He naps for 30 mins and usually gets around 2- 2.5 hours day time sleep. Last nap is USUALLY 4.15/4.30 and lasts for an hour. He always wakes up screaming from this but I think it's because it's the witching hour!

My problem at the minute is nighttimes. He has a bath at 5.45. Can't push him back any longer than that because hes exhausted (BECAUSE HE NEVER SLEEPS) he is usually being fed by around 6pm and will fall asleep on the breast anytime between 6.20 and 7pm. My husband feeds him a bottle of formula at around 11pm. But DS is often up and down between going to bed and last bottle. This used to take him to around 3am and then he'd be up hourly but he's now getting up between 12am and 2am and up hourly. He's breast feed the rest of the time so I end up bringing him into bed to feed him and he generally feeds all night. I can't rest as some women can when laying down feeding. The times he does stop feeding i get about half an hour before he's wanting to feed again. When he falls asleep i try to put him back in his cot but he wakes up and screams. He has an unbelievably loud screech which I can't leave to go on and on (not that i would anyway) because my husband is working and I think my face would burst.

I don't want to do anything like controlled crying or cry it out.

He generally feeds 2 hourly in the day and sometimes more frequently.

Not that it makes a difference but he's not a huge baby. He's between 9th and 25th centile.

This is making me miserable. I regularly cru though the night from sheer exhaustion. My breasts can be in agony some mornings.

I'm not sure whether to move him to his own room in case im disturbing him. Just no idea.

Co sleeping was never my plan and I would be happy to go ahead with it but it's doing me no favours. He sees it as an all night buffet. My skin getting bad and I just want to eat rubbish because I'm so tired.

Please can someone give me their magical cure?

I'm trying to think of any other info.... He he usually wakes about 6am. Although recently its been earlier! I could cope with this if he actually let me sleep. He sleeps in a travel cot in our room in his grobag. For naps ive only just started to not swaddle him because he wouldn't sleep without.

I've tried not feeding him in the night when he wakes up. He sometimes falls asleep. I would then either put him in his cot and he pings awake. Or lay him in bed with me and he wants to feed.

Sorry for the long post.

and .
You’ve got some really strong sleep associations there. If you can afford it I would get a sleep consultant in.

5 months is still quite young. and for you as a non sleeping baby is hell. Sorry I don’t have much advice as mine were awful at sleeping too - my first didn’t sleep all night until he was 16 months. And only had half hour naps in the day. And would regularly wake at 5am. Even now at 12 yes he often wakes (but doesn’t disturb us). We tried everything. I mean everything. I was desperate for some magic cure but never found it. Apart from a sleep consultant. If you could afford it maybe try but not convinced it would work. Give more bottles so your husband can share - maybe he could do until midnight and you could sleep from 8pm and then you do the second half? All I can really say it it is hell at the time but it does pass relatively quickly. Just do what you can to get through!

Sorry should have said we never tried a sleep consultant.

Hi OP - I have a crap sleeper too, also 5 months! Has he always fed all night when co-sleeping? Or is that new? Reason I ask is - could it be teething? DS woke up crying last night an hour after bedtime and really chewing frantically on his hand like he was hungry. I put him to boob and he wasn't feeding, just chomping down. Popped some teething gel on his gums and gave him a dose of Calpol and he did a 5 hour stint, which is brilliant for him! After that he woke hourly but those first hours did me the world of good. Good luck, I hope it all improves soon.

I’m so sorry, it sounds really rough for you especially if you can’t feed lying down comfortably it sounds like you got hit with the 4 month sleep regression a bit late like I did. Do you have the wonder weeks app? I know you say he’s always been a ‘poor’ sleeper my 10 month old has always been a frequent waker, but all the regressions etc have been the worst.

Honestly, it will pass. The best thing to do is to ride it out, I know that’s difficult to hear. But he’s really little and sleep is bumpy for the first year. In the meantime do whatever you can to maximise sleep, go to bed early if you can (even if it’s 8pm). I know this might sound a bit depressing as you lose your evening but it isn’t forever x

I don’t put my 5 month old to be until 10.30
I just sit on the sofa with him and he feeds and naps all evening. After 9.30 I keep him awake until 10.30. He also started getting me up hourly throughout the night, this phase has passed but it took about a month. We co sleep mainly so I get more sleep, DP is not in the same bed. I spent weeks resisting co sleeping and just got more and more exhausted with hindsight we should have started Co sleeping earlier. I do fall asleep easily while feeding

Thank you for all your replies. It really does help having some reassurance. He just really seems to have stepped it up a notch these last few days. Usually i can make a joke out being sleep deprived, but as I say, he really means business.

We've really got good at naps despite it taking so long and them being very short! Was hard slog though. I'm hoping we get there with night sleep too.

Lapin- Unfortunately we cant budget for a sleep consultant. I may reconsider in the new year however! At the moment I'm considering selling my soul for sleep!

Friendless- There are times I do go to bed at 8 but he'll wake at 9... I'm going to retreat to the spare room instead I think.

He's going through quite a clingy stage at the moment too. He screams at people of whom he doesn't approve (grandparents mainly). He loves his dad but will often not settle for him and waits for me!

Katniss- my mind is a bit blurry at the minute... He has mostly fed through the night but not as intense as this! He used to wait until 3am to get up so if I went to bed at 9ish I'd be pretty refreshed come 3am! But you're spot on about the teething. He's been showing signs since he was 3 months but the last week he's been miserable. He sometimes spots your hand and then lunges for it like a dog and chomps away. Hes been having Calpol but mainly through the day as he'll usually doze off at bedtime and then gets up after. Definitely trying that tonight.

Crazycatlady- I do have the wonder weeks app and book! (On permanent loan from the library!) I felt quite relieved that he'd "skipped" a leap but it's now biting me I the backside! I do get mild anxiety when it pops up on my phone "DS is entering a leap".

Thank you for the flowers coffee and cake!

Aww bless you, this is so hard.

I honestly think this bit is worse than the newborn stage because you are so worn down already. Is he doing anything new like rolling or crawling? My honest opinion is sleep is developmental and for some they are so wired/alert and developing so quickly it's hard to switch off.

My first slept through at 14 months - I tried lots and she got there in her own sweet time.

My second is 8 months - very similar so far to the last one in terms of sleep and decelopment. This baby is calmer so will self settle and has a dummy. Still never slept through and is up several times a night and likes to get up at 4.30.

I think you can work on the feed to sleep association but to be honest I think it will be baby steps and you will probably need to be aware that you will have disturbed sleep for several months yet.

Weaning might help you but for me it didn't make any difference either time.

It's really hard Op - hopefully Fatedestiny can give you her tips as she is very knowledgable.

I am following crazy cats lead and am just riding it out. I don't co-sleep as I do t get any sleep that way so I can't advise on that.

Completely get how hard it is on you though xx

Thank you chosenbyyou I think the next step is not feeding to sleep as you say. He doesn't do this when napping anymore.

He can roll from front to back but hasn't done this again since about 10 days ago. He's a really active baby though generally. Need a lots of entertaining. Even in his bouncy chair he's kicking constantly and swiping at his toys. He's getting a jumperoo and a walker for Christmas do i hope to god it'll tire him out a bit!

I can cope with some disturbed sleep and early rises but last night I got 1 hour and 30 mins sleep in around 10/15 min chunks. I'm a broken woman !
Even when I tried to use his dummy last night he went berserk. I even tried breast feeding them slipping the dummy in-this work twice. He needs lots of help getting to sleep, cuddling, swaying, shhing. I tried the shush pat and everything that goes with the baby whisperer but there was no winning with it.

I think it'll be a case of riding it out. I think He's going to be one of those kids who never stops and is very active! However, we go down south to visit mu family this weekend so if anyone has any tips etc then I'll power into them on Monday!

Please excuse my awful typos!

Hi Nosleep, we are exactly the same here. 5 month old DD who’s sleep has gone from pretty bad to downright diabolical! Sounds very similar to you, not really settling until 10.30 or after and then on a good night we get a 2 hour stretch then up hourly. Like you I’ve ended up with her in the bed which I’m okay with but not when she’s so unsettled! She’s an angel during the day but like your DS only naps in half hour bursts so “sleep when baby sleeps” isn’t an option.
My DD will settle with her Dad and often wakes with wind so just needs a shoogle if you know what I mean. Every nights different some night she wants to hang out on the boob, others she’s not bothered. My DP is coming home tonight after being away with work and we are thinking of trying shifts, so he will have her say 8-2 then we will swap. She’s doesn’t usually feed at this time so worth a try.
I also have a DS who is 2 and wasnt a great sleeper either but DD has taken it to a whole new level! DS always fed to sleep and eventually it stopped working at 15 months and he quickly started sleeping through so I do believe it’s developmental but I can’t wait 10 more months.
Anyway sorry for blethering on but I can’t believe how similar you situation sounds. Sorry I don’t have any better suggestions I’m loosing my mind a bit with tiredness but yes hope someone has some good ideas soon x

Ooh also very active, rolling over, trying to crawl etc. Maybe we having budding althletes on our hands!

Mega hugs for you! I thought I had it bad with hourly wake ups but like you I wouldn’t be able to rest while feeding (ds was extremely peed off last time I tried to get him to feed lying down!) my now 8mo had a phase of having long chompy feeds in the night when he was teething and I ended up quite sore. I haven’t tried it but anbesol liquid is supposed to be brilliant for sore gums and I wish I had given it a go as calpol just doesn’t cut it! Again I am sorry I have no more suggestions for you I am also on the ride it out train, really hope it reaches its destination soon! X

Aww we're all poor souls aren't we!? Feels good to write it down and actually see what's happening though rather than just having a long screamy disaster all night!

Gannetseatfish- it's so tough isn't it. Is your little one teething as well? He's started to plonk his head down n stick his bum in the air like he's about to crawl off! Not through the night though. He comes to life about 4am so I have to feed him to get him to go to sleep for even just 15 mins!

BorahT- I've been to 2 chemists in the last 2 days and they haven't had baby anbesol! :( I've got some ibuprofen though and the pharmacist told me i could give that then paracetamol 2 hours later and keep alternating as long as you dont exceed the doses within 24 hours on the box. X

I’m not sure she’s teething. There’s a lot of drooling going on but no signs on the gums. I’d like to think it was teething but it might just be the way she sleeps arghhh. Abesol is good stuff but the way!

On my baby's guns you can see the shape of the teeth on the front of the guns but nothing poking out underneath yet! However one of the mum's at one of our groups told me that even if you don't see anything the teeth are moving around which is painful in itself! X

I've no idea if this has been previously mentioned but is your baby only unsettled after the formula? It could be a dairy allergy. Although if he's been having formula regularly then you would expect the disturbed sleeping to start to show through the day time too.

Is he showing any other signs of distress or is it just his sleep which is affected? Does he have regular pain free bowel movements?

My son used to wake up screaming for hours. I thought it was normal but he was extremely upset and only bf would make him quiet. He still does wake up with a scream at 18 months but it passes quicker than when he was having an allergic reaction.

If he seems upset or distressed don't be afraid to use calpol/nurofen (not sure on the recommended age for nurofen) he could be teething!

Hi PonderLand, I don't think it is an allergy as on occasion he will have a bottle of formula with no issue.
He has been "off it" for a couple of days but is particularly miserable today. As am i due to lack of sleep!

I think its partly sleep associations, partly teething and partly naturally not being very good at sleeping! I'll need to work on them all separately. I just don't want to leave it too late and also an not too sure where to start!

He's having a poo most mornings at the moment. Which is great because he has an antibiotic every day due to a kidney issue and it was previously constipating him. Definitely will keep giving him Calpol. Poor little guy x

Sorry didn't read the whole thread but just wanted to say nurofen is much better than calpol for teething pain as it is an anti inflammatory. Also anbesol liquid is great. Try keep on top of the pain and that will help x

Also do you give probiotics? Biocare do one which can be used from
Birth. Really important since he is on antibiotics.

Hi purpleviolet. No I don't give him proviotics but will speak to hv and his consultant because I didn't know that! So thank you. He's been on them since 4 weeks old x

There is growing evidence that probiotics should be taken with antibiotics. It really depends on the consultant and their thoughts as I've met some who have pushed for them but others who think they don't make. Difference.

You can google and have a read yourself as well!

Thanks for flagging that up! I'll have a good read (when im not blind from tiredness ) x

He naps for 30 mins and usually gets around 2- 2.5 hours day time sleep... will fall asleep on the breast anytime between 6.20 and 7pm... usually wakes about 6am. Although recently its been earlier

By my working out, that's averaging 2h awake time between daytime naps.

That's too long. A lot too long given naps are short. I would start getting baby to sleep after 1h awake time (in which you'd baby has a feed) with the aim that baby will be asleep after 60-90 minutes of awake time.

naturally not being very good at sleeping

Give lots of help to get to sleep.

• dummy for comfort sucking. Use consistently at every deep time. If may take some work to get it established. It will be worth it. Dummies are AMAZING!

• full tummy. You are never going to get a baby who's taking in low levels of calories to deep well.

• warm. If baby is cold, he's not going to sleep.

• Movement. Preferably hands off (so not rocking in your arms). Be rhythmic and relentless about it. Maintain tempo throughout. I'd recommend food bouncing a bouncy chair for this.

He sleeps in a travel cot...

In a bassinet? If you're trying to lower baby giant to the bottom of the cot then you are setting yourself up to fail.

Get the main cot in your room. Set the mattress height to the highest setting do no lowering down.