Controlled crying...what was the longest your LO screamed the place down?

[Tinks15]

1.5 here...she just dont give up!

Smart. You're a bully. You need to get it together.

Thank you cotton, long, giles, duck

I have seen how much happier my baby is now on decent sleep.

I tried all the gentle methods. I would have loved to sit in a chair and gently rock him to sleep but he isn't that sort of baby.

Thank you cat

On another note u actually find alot of this "it's normal its what they do"

"What did you expect"

Stuff very worrying. I've lost count of how many times I've read a sleep thread and thought that something sounded quite badly wrong.

And there people are telling them to swaddle and Co sleep and missing the point that the child physically isn't sleeping and it's not normal to not actually sleep.

Rather than suggesting maybe exploring medical reasons as to why sleep just isn't happening

Info on the stress hormones:

www.aap.org/en-us/about-the-aap/aap-press-room/pages/Infant-Sleep-Training-is-Effective-and-Safe-Study-Finds.aspx?nfstatus=401&nftoken=00000000-0000-0000-0000-000000000000&nfstatusdescription=ERROR%3a+No+local+token

The cortisol argument that she refers to is a popular one against CC/CIO, but it's not a particularly good one. Did you know that they have done multiple studies that indicate that babies with high cortisol levels have better mental performance?

A Pennsylvania State University Study:www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15892778

A study by the British Columbia Research Institute:www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16122876

Did you know that there have been studies of breastfed babies having 40% higher cortisol level then their formula fed peers?

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19874763

What I mean is something like cc usually works pretty quickly.

Where's it often seems on the more gentle parents side that over time more amd more props and "conditions " seem to end up being added along the way and realising somethings actually wrong seems to take longer

My goodness, mn used to be a place for robust debate and people had thick skins. I had my arse handed to me on a plate many times. Seems to be partially populated by the kind of people we used to send over to net mums now.

I've found it a place where people have generally been supportive without being deliberately unkind actually.

I've been here for many years.

Studies that I've read about the stress hormone thing were conducted on newborns too, I could never find one relating to older babies/toddlers. What they also showed was that cortisol is released when babies are crying but plenty of babies cry even when their parents are with them and trying to comfort them. Does that mean my son who had awful colic as a newborn but was always comforted is now damaged somehow?! Is my dd who used to scream in her car seat also damaged mentally?!

That's a good point actually long I hadn't thought of it like that before

People are so judgemental! My niece is 8 and still sleeps in her mums bed and wakes 5 times a night because my sister was too scared to ever let her cry it out! I was determined not to make that mistake and did the same as you from a young age. First night was at least an hour and it got less and less each night. She's 3 now and has slept through the night 12 hours every night since I did this at 6 months. I'm a much better mother for it too.

Your doing great op, persevere your DC are not going to end up mentally scarred!

Controlled crying worked well for us. Daughter would not sleep and it was wrecking all of our lives. I was given a book - can't remember the name as it was nearly 20 years ago - It worked like magic and we were all so much happier. The longest I left her was 20 minutes. I put the timer on and hid myself at the other end of the house, sobbing and feeling horrifically guilty. The first night I had to go back twice, the second once. After that she went straight to sleep every night.

I may have been lucky; that she 'gave in' so quickly. I found it very hard to ignore her cries - it broke my heart and so still remember it. But it changed our lives and we never looked back. The second and third were much easier as we knew what to do from the beginning.

Btw, Our children have grown to be normal, well adjusted adults and nearly adults - No ill effects or resentment/abandonment issues.

Good luck OP - take no notice of the judgemental perfect parents. Trust your instincts.

At 20 months my DD decided she didn't want to go to sleep, I rocked, sung, drove her (for miles!), read to her, you name it I tried it but she point blank refused to be put to bed. She would sit up with me and DH and eventually drop off on the sofa from sheer exhaustion at which point we'd sneak her upstairs and wait for the inevitable point when she'd wake in the night and we'd have to start the process again. In desperation we tried 'controlled crying'. She cried for 40 mins the first night but slept through till morning, 20 mins the second night and again slept through and 5 mins for the next 3 nights. After that she would be laid in her cot and go straight to sleep. She regularly, although not always sleeps right through the night now and (barring illness) if she does wake all she needs is a bit of settling and she goes back off. I hated letting her cry, it was just horrible but I genuinely believe I did the best thing for her and the rest of our family (I also had a 4 month old at the time). If you have made the difficult decision to try controlled crying op then good luck and I hope it's as successful for you as it was for us. If other people don't agree with it that's entirely their decision, it doesn't make them right and you wrong.

One hour was the longest ds cried for, twenty minutes the second night, five minutes the third. It worked brilliantly for him, and here's the most important bit, he was much happier once he was saying getting a good night's sleep. I did CC for his own sake as he was constantly tired and grizzly from broken poor quality sleep, its also we worth noting how much important brain development takes place during babies sleep.

Good luck OP, hang in there!

She's 3 now and has slept through the night 12 hours every night since I did this at 6 months. I'm a much better mother for it too.

Including teething, illness and mental leaps?

Yes, including all of those she has only ever once woken in the night when she had a sickness bug at around 2 years old.

I did controlled crying with both mine. DS was a very difficult baby, he was very hard to please, didn't like feeding much, Hated the sling, tolerated his pram for 5 minutes or so, lost interest very quickly in toys, books, washing machines, light switches, TV etc etc. He was like this until he could walk. He would not be put down in his cot, he would doze in my arms but wake up screaming if I moved, he would sleep in my bed but wake up screaming if I so much as twitched in my sleep.

Controlled crying got him sleeping in his cot by himself all through the night after 3 nights. The first night took about 1.5 hours but he was NOT abandoned for all that time, I went in every 10 minutes so he knew I was there. Next night took about 20 minutes, 3rd night 5 minutes of grizzling then miraculous sleep through til 8am.

Whatever works for you, I still think I did the right thing for all of us. The baby stage is so short but can feel like forever when you're in it.

The lack of sleep and despair sounds horrific. I don't have any DC yet but it's harrowing to hear what some of you have gone through just to teach a baby to sleep. Makes me appreciate what my Mum must have done for me when I was tiny.

25 mins was longest.
to be honest their cortisol levels would've been far more fucked up by me being driven insane through lack of sleep, and then failing to be in anyway a decent parent for months on end.

I know loads of parents that have refused to do any form of controlled crying and they have non-sleeping three plus year-olds that they constantly snipe at during the day. One in particular says very helpful things like' I wouldn't be so cross at you if you just slept at night.' Despite letting her three-year-old breastfeed throughout the night. Poor kid doesn't know if it's coming or going. Think my 20 minutes all those years ago didn't causr nearly as much upset as years of shit sleep would have done.

About 5 minutes. Then I came to my senses and remembered he was a baby and gave him a cuddle.

One thing that I always find a bit weird n these debates is the idea that mothers/parents should just 'suck up' sleep deprivation. Fine, if it's only happening to the adults, but if your baby is waking up every hour or whatever, chances are that he/she is not getting enough sleep either.

The effects of raised cortisol levels on babies left to cry is still very controversial, but afaik, the effects on babies and children who regularly do not get enough sleep is not at all controversial- it's been proven to be really, really bad for their development.

Given that, surely whatever method you use to get your child to get your child to go to sleep is better than that child not sleeping?

I'm not coming at this from any angle, btw, as I was lucky enough to have a good sleeper from about three months on, so I didn't have to employ CC or any other particular method. But my heart does go out to others who are being made to feel bad about using Cc, when that was most likely the best thing they could have done for their babies in a bad situation.

I should add that ds1 was a pretty good sleeper and got on with it all very well ds2 was a different kettle of fish altogether. We decided to co sleep after many sleepless/disturbed nights. By 2.5 he slept just fine. I'm glad we chose to co sleep, CIO felt like a punishment he didn't deserve and by 2.5 he was settled and sorted.

2.5 years is a long time. And unfair to expect siblings to be disturbed for. They have school etc after all

Bloody hell OP you got a crop of them replying tonight didn't you! Must be the super moon! I think you sound like you're trying the right things if she's 15 months and never slept through - I'd also be thinking it's time to crack it. It's bedtime and as long as you're going in and re-settling her then it sounds right to me. Is it an option for you to get a night nanny / sleep trainer in? Can be very helpful and takes the high octane emotion out of it.

I know tell me about it jellycat! I wasnt expecting all these replies - i'm so grateful for the positive responses though. Thank you to those of you. Not really an option to get a night nanny in i'm hoping i can try & crack it myself. Tonight wasnt as bad as last night so there is some hope there but i'm not expecting miracles i know it doesnt always work or it can take a good few days but its worth a try in my eyes. Fingers x it works.