There must be something we can do?!

[ppandj]

DS is 17mo and has never been a "good sleeper". He has gone through phases of sleeping through 8pm-5am, but these have lasted weeks at the most and didn't start until he was about 13mo.
He has one regular nap in the day usually 10.30-12 ish, eats well and still has milk so I don't think it can be hunger. We have a good bedtime routine and he goes to sleep between 7-8pm in his own room and gets put down awake. He has never slept in a cot so has a mattress on the floor as per HV advice with baby gate at the door. This way, if he is really unsettled there is the option of one of us co- sleeping with him.
Without fail he has been waking up at 12-2 and been awake for a good hour or two every night. Rarely, he seems to just be babbling so in those cases we don't go in, more often than not he cries out and gets more and more distressed if we don't go in. However, once in there, he tries to play or is just unsettled still. It's almost like he needs to tire himself out to go back to sleep?
What would you try? I've never wanted to do CIO but would it work?

Will a warm milk help, make him feel content & drift back off?

Have you tried the advice in "The baby whisperer"? It worked for us.

Now I am the only insomniac in the family!

Oh I could have written this!! Same here - 16 month DD never a good sleeper but she was getting better...and now she's getting worse again! Being back at work means it's actually killing me. I have no advice I'm afraid but we can get through this! Could it be the 18 month regression come early?

Curtains we tried milk last night, he had a bit but was still awake for an hour afterward. In the end I took him downstairs so that DP could have a bit of sleep and he fell asleep at 2, so I put him back in his room and he slept until 6.50. It's very strange.

Itly I have the baby whisperer, time to revisit it I think, thanks!

Purple I recognise your username I think I may have seen you on other threads about sleeplessness? It's so hard. I'm pregnant so finding the sleep deprivation difficult to cope with. Fingers crossed for us that it gets better again!

That sounds like the 18 month sleep regression where DS would wake up at night (between 12-2) and find it hard to fall back to sleep. I just left him to it, or just do the whole 'it's night time, go to sleep' ad nauseum. It did get better- almost as if it was a developmental thing.
We kept a sleep diary though and noticed the oddest thing. If he was in bed by 7-7:15 he was fine at night. If that went to 7:25, then he would have an unsettled night. We kept a sleep diary for over a month and it was a really obvious pattern. We then got really strict with our bedtime routine and really had it timed down to perfection and it was one of the changes that made a huge difference. There was obviously a sleep window I was missing somewhere and then he would go to sleep but it wouldn't be the same restful sleep.

Interesting luchi we'll try keeping a diary and see if we notice anything. Thanks :)

DD did a similar thing at 8 months where she was wide awake for 1-2 hours in the middle of the night. Maybe it's just developmental and one of those awful phases you just have to wait out? I'm a bit worried to read there's an 18m sleep regression as that's how old DD is now and she has also become more unsettled recently.

I wouldn't try CC or CIO. I really think it's good for babies to learn that if they cry and need you, you will be there for them. But at the same time they need to learn to sleep on their own. If he's crying I would be tempted to lie down with him and repeat "its sleepy time" ad nauseam until he drops off. This way he's not on his own but hopefully he'll realise that it's not the time for anything but sleeping.

We also never did CC/CIO but the v gentlest form of gradual retreat. Incidentally for complex reasons at this point DS was sleeping with us. So it meant that because he could see us from his cot in the room while he would be twisting and turning and grunting, at least he wasn't screaming. And everyone got more sleep. I am not suggesting that you bring him into your room, just that in his room if someone can sleep at a distance where he is reassured but doesn't need your input that might work well.

The nap seems quite early, have you tried moving it after lunch?

I would say his bedtime is a bit late for his get up/nap time. He's probably a bit overtired. Mine is a similar age and gets up somewhere between 6.30 and 7.30, naps 12-2 ish and goes to sleep 7.00-7.30. If he's tired from nursery and hasn't napped well I'll put him down earlier. 8ish hours from nap to bedtime is a long time.

I reckon you need to try pushing the nap later (which might help with morning wake ups too) - 15 mins per day till you get to 11.30/12 (that's what we did when we transitioned to 1 nap) - and/or aim for bedtime about 13 hours tops from wake up time. Even if that seems ridiculously early. A super early night is like a reset button sometimes. Good luck!

luchi I've noticed the same thing with mine - there's a window and if you miss it you're doomed...

Interesting about the nap time. We have tried to make it a bit later but it's sometimes impossible. On Saturday I thought he was going to be awake until 11.30 because he woke at 7am, had made all these plans and then at 10 he was just sat on the sofa and nodded off! He must have been shattered. Thanks for all the replies. I think we will still
Avoid CC/CIO as we have never wanted to do it.

If he was sleeping 11 or 12 hours per night then my advice would be push lunchtime nap later so that the awake time from naptime to bedtome was shorter.

But your DS is not getting a full nights sleep. So rather than push it later, is make it earlier and add a second nap

I think your problems are all down to chronic and prolonged over tiredness. It's so ingrained that it may be hard work to break the cycle, but you can do.

At 17m my youngest (now 25 months) was sleeping 9.30-11.00, 1.00-3.00 then 7.30/8-7/7.30 without waking. She didn't move to 1 nap says until 20 months old, and that can be 3 hours easily.

I would say let your DS sleep at 9.30 and if he's not awake by 11am wake him. Then go for another nap 2pm ish and wake at 4pm if not already awake. Then go for 8pm ish bedtime.