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Original poster

Over tiredness and baby waking every sleep cycle at the beginning of the night

27 replies

Winehound84 · 08/08/2016 20:29

Nobody seems to have this problem.. My daughter is 6,5 months and up until 4 months I never heard from her until 3-4 am when I fed her. At 4 months I stopped feeding her at night with some controlled crying and for more or less a month she slept from dream feed until 7-7:30, maybe with some minor noises around 6-6:30. Anyhow at 5 months there were some changes.. removed sleepyhead and swaddle, travelled etc etc, she didn't sleep well at all. Recently all in all the sleep improved BUT after i put her to bed she is almost certain to wake up and cry for a minute or two 40 minutes after the bedtime and then 40 minutes after again and likely another time or two. After the dream feed she usually sleeps ok until 7-7:30. Everyone talks about babies waking up second half of the night or in the morning (and she does sometimes) but soon after going to bed?? Its supposed to be the deepest sleep?? My only explanation is that she is overtired. She has been refusing to have the nap around 4:30, even for 10 minutes or so and now she is awake between 2:30 and 7:30, today even worse - she woke up at 1:45. 2 days ago i managed to get her to sleep between 5 and 5:30. She still fell asleep ok at 7:30 and didn't make a peep until 7:30 the day after. Maybe coincidence but why then is she waking up so often? Another possibility that the dream feed is not letting her sleep well and she is waiting for it? Similar experience anyone??

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Sparrowlegs248 · 08/08/2016 21:00

Not any experience from me, but wonder if you could put her to bed earlier if she is over tired? Ds was asleep by 6.30 at that age. I wouldn't think she's ready to drop the dream feed yet.

Original poster
Winehound84 · 08/08/2016 21:31

I would put her to bed earlier but then she would wake up at 6:30 and I can't deal with that... Im thinking about moving her naps later.. So that at least she wakes up at 2:45 - 3 from her afternoon nap. Will try to drop the dream feed today too.. Lets see how it goes.. Hmm

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Tatlerer · 08/08/2016 21:37

Winehound you could be describing my now 2.5 yr old to a tee. She would wake and cry for 10 seconds up to a minute ( in which case I would go and pat her, ssssh etc.) 2-3 times before the dream feed/ we went to bed. Almost every evening. I wondered if it was down to over tiredness but tweaking the nap timings didn't seem to make much difference. Anyway, she did it less and less as time wore on and then grew out of it. She's a very expressive and emotive toddler so I think it was her way of expressing rage and discontent that she'd woken up!

Tatlerer · 08/08/2016 21:42

What times and for how long are her naps?

Original poster
Winehound84 · 08/08/2016 22:07

40 minutes in the morning and 1,5 in the afternoon. Used to be 20 minutes or so also Iate afternoon but no more. She often seems to want to sleep longer I the morning but I wake her after an hour max. Cause apparently longer naps may mean early waking.. But maybe should let her sleep then..what were your daughters naps like?

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Gillian1980 · 08/08/2016 22:36

My daughter went through a phase at about 8 or 9 months of waking after the first couple of sleep cycles each night and would need me to resettle her each time.

It was definitely worse if she was overtired - at 6.5 months she was having 3 naps a day on a good day. If she missed one or they weren't long enough she would get in a terrible state and be very hard to settle.

I'd try to get more daytime sleep in and see how that goes as what you have described doesn't sound like much daytime sleep for a baby that age really.

Sparrowlegs248 · 09/08/2016 07:24

Ds has never been a great sleeper but did go through a similar phase. It didn't happen every night but was definitely happening when he'd not napped enough. He's not a great napper either.....

It stopped after I spent a few weeks really concentrating on naps.

He's 1 now and still has one night feed. I feel he needs this as he wakes, big bf then sleeps again. If I Co sleep he will want to feed more which I don't think is necessary, it's just comfort.

How'd it go without the feed?

Original poster
Winehound84 · 09/08/2016 07:49

Not feeding at night was not an issue at all. I had a consultation with a sleep trainer who was an absolute dragon but she gave me a good routine and pushed me to stop feeding her at night cold turkey. After three days she also wanted me to drop the dream feed as apparently it sends a wrong message but I didn't bring up the courage to do it. She is not big, ebf etc. I'm thinking now is the time though.. She also said they absolutely don't need the 3rd nap after 5 months and even before that she was saying it has to be 10 minutes tops. Shock anyhow.. for the past 2 days I walked around with her in a pram between 4 and 5:30 with no effect - she didn't sleep. Hence will try to put her for the morning nap a bit later.. And a bit later for the midday one.

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Original poster
Winehound84 · 09/08/2016 07:53

Maybe you meant dream feed? She woke up a few times before the dream feed time and 3 more times during the night. But always for a minute or so, repositions herself screams and falls asleep again. Walked in her room at 7:10. Seemed hungry but nothing extraordinary. I topped her up with expressed breast milk before bedtime so technically she is getting her dream feed earlier..

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Tatlerer · 09/08/2016 09:01

Winehound I honestly can't remember DD's nap times at 6.5 months (not very useful to you I know!) but we followed the Gina Ford routine so it was in line whatever she suggests. I think it was 30 mins at 9ish, 2 hours at 12.30ish and 15 mins at 4.30 although I think that afternoon one was very hit and miss. Tbh it sounds like your sleep consultant was broadly in line with GF when it comes to day time routines and night feeds (most of them are). Mine was a dragon too! Are you in London by any chance?!

Timetogrowup2016 · 09/08/2016 09:09

6 months olds still need feeding at night most of the time...
Sorry if this sounds harsh but unless she's fully weaned with three meals a day and snacks I doubt she can go through a whole night.?

Tatlerer · 09/08/2016 09:13

I think we dropped the DF when DD was around 8 months and yes, on 3 meals a day. It wasn't an issue at all. In fact from around 6 months she was taking less and less at that feed, but then we did start weaning early at around 4.5 months.

Original poster
Winehound84 · 09/08/2016 09:27

Tatlerer yes Im in London! You had a sleep consultant? What was her name..? Her routine was very similar to Gina Ford's.. although reading Gina Ford I feel like the consultant was worse!! She was saying I have to wake my daughter up after 30 mins in the morning although she would wake up on her own after 40 mins.. I never did that, seemed somewhat cruel. She never sleeps 2 hours midday though.. mostly 1,5. sometimes less :( In that case the afternoon nap is probably more doable. Will work on the naps today..

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Original poster
Winehound84 · 09/08/2016 09:34

Timetogrowup2016 There is no way for me to tell why my daughter wakes up. She wakes up and cries for a minute or two and falls asleep - I don't intervene. Thats the thing coz she cries wolf so many times I just ignore it. I imagine if the wolf really comes she won't just fall asleep after a minute of crying. But I know many many babies ebf who sleep through the whole night from 6 months. I don't think it is unrealistic and was told that the dream feed can actually be counterproductive. Lets see how tonight goes..

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MYA2016 · 09/08/2016 09:35

Op my 6.5mo has this routine:

  • 6.30 wake up
  • 9am nap (1/1.5 hrs)
  • 1.30 nap (1/1 5 hrs)
  • 7pm bed

He still has 1 or 2 feeds overnight. Usually 1 about 3am but if he wakes at 12 we feed him then too

Tatlerer · 09/08/2016 09:44

Winehound her name was Annette. Plus I worked with a lady called Nicola, one called Rozanne and an army of night nannies. I was desperate and desperate times called for desperate measures!

Original poster
Winehound84 · 09/08/2016 09:54

Hahaha. Familiar situation. Mine was called Brenda. Brenda The Dragon.

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Original poster
Winehound84 · 09/08/2016 09:58

MYA2016 thats pretty good.. i should leave bigger gap between first nap and second nap looks like. I was putting her to bed between 12:30 and 12:45.Ideally:

7:30 wake up
10 am - 40minutes - 1 hour nap
1-1:30 PM - 1.5 hour nap. Ideally 2.. but not sure how to get there..
7:30 Bed

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Sparrowlegs248 · 09/08/2016 10:01

I did mean the dreamed. My little boy was feeding such a lot at night at that age, plus ate well from the start of weaning. But, they are all different aren't they.

Its good that she settles herself again. If you don't have to intervene I'd be inclined to leave her to it, I'm sure it will pass.

Tumtitum · 09/08/2016 12:12

If you don't have to intervene and she settles herself back I wouldn't worry! I'd be ecstatic if mine did that Grin
MYA I've seen your other threads and it seems like your little one is sleeping really well now, pleased for you :) I'm hoping our time will come! ;)

Tumtitum · 09/08/2016 12:12

If you don't have to intervene and she settles herself back I wouldn't worry! I'd be ecstatic if mine did that Grin
MYA I've seen your other threads and it seems like your little one is sleeping really well now, pleased for you :) I'm hoping our time will come! ;)

Alyof · 09/01/2019 20:50

Hi winehound84 I have a daughter with exactly the same sleep pattern as yours, for both naps and nighttime. Did the crying every cycle ever go away? I’ve been dealing with it several weeks now after she dropped her third nap. And she does exactly the same as yours did (1.5 max at the lunch nap) until I stopped waking her at 1 hour for the morning nap and just let her do her max at the morning, which was 1hr -1hr 20, and her max 3hrs 40 minutes to 4 hours later, which was 1hr- 1hr 10. If you remember, please let me know. Coincident with dropping the third nap we started solids and she had a bit of constipation which has since subsided. I’m dying to know. I feel awful and can’t sleep knowing she’s in some kind of discomfort so often, even though she technically STTN.

jessstan2 · 09/01/2019 21:41

Bless you. She is still very little.
Mine grown up now but I used to just cuddle in bed with us (fed, changed if necessary until outgrew night feeds), and he slept OK there. It was cosy, we got used to it and weren't bothered but 'back in the day' co-sleeping was frowned upon so we kept it secret :-). Seems so stupid now. When he was older he and his friends were talking and they all co-slept and kept it quiet, they came to the conclusion everyone in the world did it but kept quiet about it!

There's nothing like a cuddle with your baby/toddler. It doesn't last forever, cherish those times. She'll soon be in her cot, then in bed in own room and shutting the door on you!

crazycatlady5 · 09/01/2019 23:27

I actually can’t believe someone would have recommended cutting out night feeds for a 4 month old. I would report someone who told me that. My almost 2 year old still wakes for a feed. Jeez Sad

jessstan2 · 09/01/2019 23:38

Crazycatlady, it is unusual for a two year old to wake for a feed. Usually, if they wake, they just want a drink of water but I would be a bit concerned if a two year old actually wanted to eat! A four month old, no, of course they will sometimes feed and drink but at two, they are eating.
Very odd.