Misery Loves Company...nope. Still not sleeping.

[ElphabaTheGreen]

Long-term sleep deprivation getting you down?

Join us here for and plenty of sympathy.

Ride the mo-fo out or something must be done - the choice is yours.

And remember the First Rule of Sleep Club - do not mention that things are going well or you will PAY.

hi everyone. back after a bit of an absence to commiserate. i will have to catch up and rtft when DD gives me a chance. currently pacing our hallway with her in the sling and singing in the hope she'll drop off.

Teething and a mega snotty nose are the current sleep enemies. DH has been permanently consigned to the spare bedroom so that DD and I can cosleep. weirdly, we were away for a few nights a couple of weeks ago and DD had her best ever sleep stretch of 5 hours from 9pm to 2am. like a mad scientist I am still trying to work out why!

Felkov I imagine you were stressing about her not sleeping at all while you were away. Therefore she decided to confound by sleeping really well. It's one of their little games - always do the unexpected to keep mummy on her toes

Hello Pebble, make yourself at home and grab some (or if you prefer - I certainly do now I've given up night feeds ). How old is your DC?

Elph swaddle ups are fab - have you got the zip off sleeves one? DD2 loved hers and looked so cute in it!

We had a lovely start this morning - 3.30 am! So clearly the stopping the last 'night' feed is going really, really well.... DD2 was ok, she got to go back to sleep at 5.30. I had about 10 minutes in my own bed before DD1 woke cold having kicked off all her covers so I had to get into her bed and cuddle her.

One day this too will pass...(please?!)

I honestly think that I would find defusing a bomb less stressful than getting the DCs to bed by myself when DH is working away.

He works in IT, FFS. You'd think he could sort something out over that Internet doo-hickey rather than traipse off to the opposite end of the country and leave me alone with the Amazing Non-Sleeping Siblings.

X-post with Chocolate

Your life always sounds so much more shit than mine, it makes me feel better

No, I got the basic model. Wish I'd got the zip-off sleeves one though because I can't do the half-step of releasing one arm. I think he looks slightly creepy, like a thalidomide victim, especially when he's trying to bring his toy dog up to his face with these little stumpy arms...

chocolate you must be right. we were away with friends (12 adults and 5 children so lots of extra pairs of hands which gave me a much needed break!) none of them believed that DDs sleep us usually so abysmal as she only woke up 3 times both nights we were there. i felt amazing! of course normal service resumed once we got home and has deteriorated to waking up about every 90mins the past week.

did make me wonder what would happen if I was away on holiday more often... the elusive 12 hours straight..?

Hello everyone! Just out of interest, how old are all your DCs? My DS2 is 11 months and still waking 4 times a night. The longest he has ever done is 7 hours but only done this twice and not in the last 4 months! I'm starting to worry there might be something wrong with him, like a dietry thing. I breast feed but he doesn't feed at night, he falls asleep in his cot with me sitting next to him, not touching and he eats three huge meals a day with two snacks in between and four breast feeds between waking up in the morning and bedtime. We never bed share or pick him up at night. What am I doing wrong??

Hi needsweets

My original non-sleeper, DS1, is now 2y9m. My current non-sleeper, DS2, is 7mo.

At 11 months, a 'good' night for DS1 was six wake-ups, but more often it was 8-10, and I was working full-time. I had to bed-share or I'd have collapsed.

Four wake-ups doesn't sound dietary to me. It just sounds like a baby who needs a bit more support to stay asleep. Could it be because you sit next to him while he falls asleep, then when he wakes up in the night he wonders where you are? Maybe try a few nights of sleeping on his floor just to see how he responds and take it from there?

Its so dark in his room that he can't actually see me but I think he senses I'm there as if he sits up and cries I lay him down and tuck him in then sit away from him again until he is asleep. It's only recently gone down to 4 wake ups, before now it was up to 6 times and every hour when teething. I think his molars are moving around atm so no chance of any rest soon. My DS1 was a bad sleeper too, he is 6yo now and a brilliant sleeper so I guess they get there in the end! Hence the long are gap though, I couldn't do the sleepless nights again very soon, you are brave to have yours so close!

Hi, I'm new to this thread but so tired I feel the need for a sleep deprived rant.
My baby is 6 months old and pretty much has woken every couple of hours since he was born. I had a week or two when he would sleep for a bit longer, but then it all went downhill again to the point where I was only getting 30-40 min stretches of sleep.
I hate what I have become. This sleep deprivation has turned me into a grouchy snappy loony. I snap at people I love all the time. I can't string a sentence together. I have lost all higher level function of my brain - I tell people things I've already told them and forget everything. I feel like I'm really stupid. Yesterday I actually was so tired I fell asleep whilst eating!! I woke up an hour later with a mouthful of food! I didn't even know that was possible!!
Oh yeah, and I eat to try and keep myself awake. I may be breastfeeding a very big active 6 month old (who hardly takes any solids) but despite this I am getting fatter! Caffeine upsets my baby and makes him cry more, so food is my stay awake drug.
I just wanted type these words on my keyboard. It's therapeutic. I haven't even read this thread, I just needed to rant first, but I will read it later when I've calmed down.

Ha at Elph - I always think the same about you . That's the joy of this thread I think...

BTW the getting the two of them to bed does get so much easier. Now, I don't mind at all if OH is out and I don't worry if I'm out either and OH has the two of them. But oh I do remember the hellish stress of doing so when DD2 was smaller...

I thought DD2 looked more like a little wriggly bug than a thalidomide victim... But whatever works, right?! The zip offs were also useful when the weather got warmer but she wasn't ready to ditch the swaddle so I just put her in a sleeveless vest and armless swaddle.

Needsweets, they are totally aware of you being there (or more importantly not being there) when they wake, darkness really doesn't make any difference to that. DD2 always settles much more quickly if I'm on her floor I seem to spend most of my nights there rather than if I just go in when she wakes.

Mine are 3 (tomorrow!) and 14 months.

Hooray for a 5.30am start today, that's a whole two hours more than yesterday! And DD1 slept through after more adjustments to duvets/blankets etc to attempt to find the right temperature for her to not be too hot but also not wake up at 6am because she's cold (this is where MN needs a praying icon no?!)

Sweets are my stay awake drug, hence the user name!

My 5:20am start to the day after multiple wake-ups was made far more tolerable by the piece of chocolate Nutella cake I hade for elevenses Omits the bit about the accompanying flat white in deference to Missingcaffeine

This is rant-central Missing. I am honestly, genuinely concerned that my long-term sleep deprivation has done me permanent brain/health damage. Every day there seems to be a new article or study about how appalling poor quality, inadequate sleep is for you. It just doesn't make sense that nature would make some babies such hideously awful sleepers that they could do their parents long term damage, does it?

Oh, and, Needsweets - maybe try a nightlight? Needs to be red or orange so it doesn't affect melatonin. It is possible for a room to be too dark, partly because it may be upsetting for a child when they wake up and find they can't orientate themselves.

Elph - a friend of my mum's always jokes that "Alzheimer's is hereditary. You get it from your kids!"

It would be funny if it wasn't true (at least in my case). After three years of next to no sleep (not even counting pregnancy insomnia) I have no memory, cannot do even basic maths, walk into things constantly, cannot park the bloody car in anything less than a football pitch and...shit, I'm sure there was something else. See what I mean?!

On the upside, long term breastfeeding is supposed to have positive health benefits for us isn't it...?

Missing, there is a lot of lack-of-sleep eating to survive around here...Green and Blacks is my weapon of choice!

I used to have a brilliant memory, would never lose anything and was always on time. I've only been a mum for 6 months so I dread to think what I'll be like in a couple of years if this carries on.

My company keep asking when I'm going to be back at work and I keep delaying it, even though we could really use the extra money as we're trying to move house. Currently in a 3rd floor flat with no lift but that's a rant for a different thread!

How was everyone's night? I sat in a dark room from 8 till 9.30 trying to get DD to settle and despite being apparently fast asleep she woke up screaming about 3 seconds after i put her in her cot. DH took over for 15 min so i could have dinner, then I found them with all the lights on playing games together!!! at 10 I gave up, fed her to sleep and conked out next to her.

I'm supposed to be going out for dinner tonight with some other mums but i think I'm going to have to cancel as Dh has no idea how to get her to sleep. all their husbands (and other relatives) are able to put their DCs to bed so I feel like a total failure when i speak to them.

Don't worry felkov, at 15 months I've still not managed a night out as DD generally just screams for DH. This week he had to start bedtime routine without me as I was late home from work and she was very unimpressed. It was getting better but think we are entering another bout of separation anxiety as she has been surgically attached to me this morning.

YY to memory being nowhere what it used to be, I'm now especially bad at birthday cards, which has not been helped by everyone's birthday being on a Sunday this year so they need posting earlier. I used to pride myself on being organised so I'm not enjoying feeling like I'm playing constant catch up.

I clearly broke the first rule of sleep club when I mentioned up thread that DD wasn't a super early waker - I've had three 5am starts this week! Think this is the flip side of less broken night sleep but there's something quite depressing about arriving at work at 9 having been up 4 hours already!

I am the similar to you Raspberry and Felkov - supposed to be going out this evening, but 2 out of my last 3 attempts at an evening out have resulted in me being called home. DH losing confidence as her separation anxiety goes on. DD also had 12 month jabs yesterday so intermittently feverish and not quite right. I also feel like a failure when sat with a load of people whose partners / mums / dads / sisters etc....can get their babies to sleep. Reading up on the solution only seems to suggest that the mums go out and leave the dads just to get on with it!!! Well, tried that, didn't work. To be fair on him, he has a hellish commute so he is tired himself and tends to mainly get home after bed / at bath time so it's not straightforward. And DD is such a lovely cheerful little thing except at bedtime!

hi all, can I join? ds is 5 and a half months and sleep has been rubbish for 2 months. As in 1-2hrly wake ups, or 2-3hrly, if we are lucky. he also likes to throw in a 2 hr awake stretch some nights. it's been several weeks since he slept a stretch longer than 2.5 hrs. he is b/f, we are sort of Co sleeping (cot against bed with side removed) and started weaning a week ago. he usually needs boob in mouth to fall asleep, although sometimes can self settle at bedtime and needs to be pushed in pram at nap time. we r trying ncss but ann sounds interesting. dd is 2yrs 4 months and, thk god, is a good sleeper. bedtime for me, good night all, good luck tonight

Felkov, Raspberry and Lillipot - DD1 was exactly the same, and it was months before I dared leave the house in the evenings. What worked for us in the end was when I was heavily pregnant OH started taking over duties bit by bit. First he started bath, then I'd take over, then he did all of bath, then bath and pjs and so on until he was doing the whole thing. DD2 was 20 months by then and no longer BFing which also helped. But any regular involvement in bedtime helps I think rather than just when you're out and it's all strange anyway.

Thankfully DD2 has been much easier, not sure if it's because I left her earlier or she was just easier for OH to settle and he has learned to be a bit softer. OH just used to put DD1 to bed as usual then sit and cuddle DD2 in front of the TV until she fell asleep. Didn't really help with self-settling but they were both happy and I was out so I was pretty happy too! They also have a better bond than OH and DD1 did at this age.

I've been following this for a while and might tentatively stick my head around the door.

I worked out recently that, in the last 6 years, I've had 12 months of good sleep. Once you take out the pregnancy insomnia, pregnancy exhaustion (some nights in the first trimester with DS I was sleeping 10 hours straight and barely able to drag myself out of bed as I was so exhausted), and babies and toddlers who don't sleep. 12 months of my entire 30s so far.

I have two DD's, who do now sleep. DS is 10 months and is slowly breaking me. A good night he'll wake every 2 hours. A bad night he'll be up for two hours and wake every hour or less.

I am too exhausted to contemplate what to do. He's still in with us and co-sleeps a lot. I know that probably isns't helping and keep saying I'll move him. But then I have to be prepared for radical sleep training as I can't get up to the other room on that timeline.

So hi. I'll lurk here for a while now you're on my TIO.

Thanks Chocolate, that sounds like a good method. Until recently DH always did story and saying goodnight to toys but this week she has totally refused both. I think probably we will only see the change when we stop BF but she's having loads at the moment so that feels a little way off yet. May just have to bite the bullet and organise something one night...

Penguins, my DD is still in with us for much the same reason. She has improved enough recently that I am seriously contemplating moving her in a couple of weeks. I don't think beings in with us really disturbs her to be honest - it's what she's used to after all. I just want a bit more space back in the bedroom! When she was your DS's age we co-slept every night from midnight or so.

Hi Penguins - I've clocked you and your non-sleeper on other threads

5:20am is the new 6am here. He's discovered that babbling is AMAZING so he needs to practice it with the larks. It's a good job it's cute and that he clearly takes so much joy from it. I don't think anyone but me would put up with being woken by an alarm clock that goes thus:

'BAH! Bababababa-BAH! BAH! Guh-GAH! WUB-wubwubwubwubwub '

He's currently having the second nap of the day in his cot. I'm lying on the floor because that's about all I have the energy for.

Elphaba That is so cute! Maybe not so early though.... I'm feeling a bit crap after reading some other threads with other Mums insisting babies waking at night is abnormal after 6 months. My 11 month old waking 4 - 6 times must be because of my crap responsive parenting, maybe I should have let him cry before now like all the advice I get from EVERY healthcare professional has told me. Sorry for the woe is me post, just thought I would be getting more sleep nearly a year down the line. When/how did your older DC's sleep improve? Is sleep training needed or will it get better eventually?

Oh god Elphaba. Do I whinge that much?

Very cute. But very annoying! DS has a happy noise that goes DA DA DA DA. And a whiny noise that goes mmmmmmum.

Chocolate thanks for the glimmer of hope - I am hoping that next time round it will naturally be easier for DH to be involved more as when we move he will be around more, plus with two tinies both of our attention will naturally be divided.
I did right not to go out as poor DD was not well with high fevers and spent half the night screaming and not settling for either of us. Hoping if she has a nap now we can all sleep.