Misery loves company: anyone want to join me on a support thread for those desperate and demoralised by their 8/9/10 mo sleep?

[Suchanamateur]

Bloody sleep regression. It's like 4 months all over again but worse because it felt (briefly) like we were getting somewhere. Feck. Anyone else want to share tales of woe or is it (a) just me or (b) way too depressing to post about..?

Well the past two nights here pretty dismal - not every 45 minutes thankfully - but she still woke up 6/7 times since we went to bed (a few more before that).

Saw my GP yesterday for an unrelated matter and mentioned the osteopath; he agrees it probably won't have any impact but can't harm, so off we go on Tuesday.

Apparently my nanny used to perform some Amazonian tribe rituals on me when I had trouble sleeping, so might try that next

Laughing and nodding at all the crazy brilliant intentions we have before we give birth! Mum always says "I was the perfect parent before I had children" and it's true.

I was going to be the 70's style educator; present and loving but with a healthy dose of benign neglect. HA! Instead I'm this pathetic over-thinking ball of hormones who co-sleeps, does BLW and generally frets just about everything. Plenty of Ella's pouches here too though, she snatches them from my hand and eats them happily so I think it's integral to the BLW philosophy.

We also have bastard creaking floors and I feel all tense during the early part of the evening when I'm suposed to be relaxing, because I just know she wakes up (and more often than not, she does).

I'm so obsessed with sleep that I fear I'll never recover. Bizarrely, I love to hear people describe a good night's sleep; it's like a form of self-torture.

Anyone thinking of trying any new routines/approaches?

As I understand it, you need them more if you're BFing. FF babies don't actually need them at all as long as they're still getting over a pint of formula a day as it's fortified with vit D (among other things). That's the advice from the NHS anyway. I take BF support vitamins myself which are meant to boost vitamin D, but not quite enough. I know the risk is very low for rickets but we're in't north which is rather dark and rainy and not really conducive to prolonged exposure to sunlight! I think the drops are also important for iron intake, but I'm not quite so worried about that.

We have to fight DD to get vitamins/ medicine into her. Usually requires one of us holding her arms down and the other one forcing a syringe through closed jaws. A long way of saying no tips. I thought the same about increased need for vitamins because of bf - and DD is just catching everything at the moment so I'm religious about the vits. Fat lot of good it's doing her.

She's been really off colour the last few days. Yesterday she fell asleep on me in a bright room (unheard of) just half an hour free she woke from her nap. But she seems much better today. We've been getting some decent stretches still so I think we're back on the sleep training wagon now she's better, to try to consolidate. Am really hoping the longer stretches were the sleep training paying off, rather than because she's been getting ill.

Quick question - we've pretty much night weaned as she hasn't had a feed between 6.30 and 6am for the last 4 nights. However, she often wakes 5/5.30ish and we can often get her back for another 40 mins if we bring her into bed and feed her. Do you think I need to stop this as it might confuse her/ undo all her/our work? Would love to hang on to the morning cuddles but not at the expense of sleep

Oh bottoms. I take vit d but didn't think dd would need it as well. Not fussed about iron as she is a super eater and so I'm pretty sure she gets plenty in her diet.

Just a thought...Could you put the vit drops on some food?

Might try that Hear although DD already fussy so no doubt would sniff out at 100 paces

Well i have finally cracked. I have come to the realisation i can no longer call my dd a 'good sleeper'.
She is now a crap sleeper. Has been for last 8 weeks ish. She is now 9.5 months old. Always slept really well bar teeth or illness up until 8 weeks ago and its just getting worse and worse. I went back to work last week and i am exhausted.
Last night was horrific. She went to sleep about 7ish woke about 11pm then didn't sleep again till 3am. I brought her into bed with me where she proceeded to kick,pinch and fall asleep for 20 mins then wake up, root for boob and repeat. I had to get up for work at 6.30am. Fucking shattered.
Every night is getting like this. Sleeps till about 11 then either won't go back to sleep or does then wakes up half hour later. We sometimes co sleep but she thrashes about (likes sleeping sideways) roots for boob a million times and snuggles in so close to me i literally cannot move all night.
She used to self settle, sleep thru and maybe wake once in 12 hours to feed. Now its just a nightmare. Its been like this for months now. Its not going to pass is it.....

The vit drops my DS had tasted of banana so I would stir them into yogurt and he never noticed. But they ran out and I haven't replaced. Must try harder.

Not sure at all re night weaning/5.30 feeds such, I have never really tried to night wean DS, since food always got him to sleep I was scared of losing it's power But he has gone beserk last few days, feeding for ages and not settling, so am thinking of trying it to increase his day time intake. Has the weaning worked in the sense of reduced wakings between 6.30 and 6am?

DS is so hit and miss with food I couldn't mix it into anything and be confident he'd actually eat any enough of it. We use your technique suchanamateur. Hate it, and he STILL manages to spit most of it out.

I'd have thought waking for a feed/cuddle at 5/5:30ish was reasonable. It's within the spectrum of a 'normal' waking up time and if it's for less than an hour...or would it turn into chronic early waking? Dunno, sorry.

Hello feekerry. Do you suppose the sleep deprivation is worse when you've never had a good sleeper, or when you've got a good-sleeper-gone-bad? Probably the latter since those of us in the former category have had months of toughening up and no allusions shattered

We're definitely getting longer stretches. DD only up once last night albeit for 45 minutes but more whinging than full blown crying. Then woke at 6 and I bf'ed her in our bed back into submission till 7.30! Definitely not what the sleep trainers tell you to do!

dd now has 2 shiny new front teeth! Yay! Still waiting for a right fang though so she's a bit wonky.

The morning cuddles are one of the best things about cosleeping for me. I think even if dd started sleeping right through the night tomorrow I would probably keep her in with us just for that, all waking up together is so lovely. So, such if i was you i would keep the morning cuddle routine as it sounds a lovely way to start the day...but then I am a big softy really and think sleep trainers can go and shove their opinions up the proverbial shush/pat. :o

dd slept great until 3.5 months and the first month was definitely the worst as we just didn't know what had hit us. Also once I accepted it was just the way she is and her waking wasn't a symptom of any terrible parenting failure it got much easier to deal with it.

attempted administration of vitimins today and dd now has a day-glo yellow mouth...oh well

Just catching up. Hope all the babies are ready for a good night's sleep tonight . Since (sort of) night weaning we seem to have a couple of good nights then a couple of crap nights. Generally whenever I tell someone about a good night, the next night is truly dreadful. I think DD does it just to spite me!

To mix things up a bit, DD was ill yesterday with a fever - really the first time she's had above normal temperature. She slept well at first - exhausted probably - but then awake lots later on in the night. She's better today, but v tired so already tucked up in bed. Very early nights tend to mean she wakes early on in the evening though so we shall see what tonight brings.

hear isn't it a relief when those teeth finally show themselves? We waited forever for DD's 4th tooth which caused us weeks of misery! feekerry hope you've had a bit of sleep over the weekend. I'm back at work a week Tuesday and can't quite imagine how I'm going to cope. it'll be the early starts that kill me as quite often me and DD lie in till 7/7.30 at the moment. Such I've basically said that if she wakes 5am onwards I'll feed her and she often comes in with me then. We all get a bit more sleep that way. Also talking to others whose babies sleep more, it sounds like quite a few get to 5/5.30 before needing a feed so it seems like a reasonable sort of time.

I'm not sure elphaba but things have been getting gradually worse over last 3 months and now, quite frankly, its fucking awful. Its hard as i know she can sleep well but don't know why things have gone so wrong.
Last night was pretty bad. Went to sleep about 7 then did the usual stretch till 11am then the fun starts. At 1am after trying for 2 hours to get her back to sleep i brought her in to our bed where we had 4 hours of broken sleep then pretty much awake for the day at 5.30am. Crap.

She has been great today, napped okay etc. Then trying to get her to sleep tonight has just been awful. I am at the end of my tether. I have just let her scream for 10mins but don't have he guts or energy to see it thru

That sounds pretty similar to some of my nights recently feek, it is horrid. I hate it when she just won't settle, its so exhausting, so you have our sympathy. You say its been getting worse for 3 months and I am wondering if it coincided with weaning? Could there be something she's eating that's causing her problems?

I have learnt 3 things from this thread that have helped me through. I shall now share them with you like some wise elder statesman passing on secret knowledge (puts on top hat and chews cigar in statesmanlike fashion)...

1. some babies just aren't very good at sleeping. There is no one cause, nothing has gone wrong, waking in the night is crap but it is also natural. It is almost certainly not something you have done to cause it and unfortunately there probably isn't a magic bullet that will stop it.

2. there is no right or wrong answer, its OK to try different things and do what works for you. Everyone else with their opinions on what you are doing wrong can go and screw themselves along with the sleep training police. If cc works for you that's fine, if giving up on all sleep training, taking up fulltime cosleeping and feeding back to sleep makes it all manageable than this is also fine. You will find people of both types on this thread living in harmony.

3. Sometimes, when all else fails, 'you just gotta ride that mo fo out'

That is all for tonight. Thank you and goodnight.

Yes well said hear
I am the give up,bed share,feed to sleep type but whatever you choose to do is always hard. Hey ho. I am getting used to functioning on few hours sleep.

She doesn't really eat much solids as bit of a boob monster however thinking about it she slept thru 12 hours ish on breast milk only. This did all start when she started solids even tho uptake is slow. Hmmmm. Ponders.....

Hello

DD is 8mos (and 1 day) and sleep at the moment is horrific. She's night weaned herself but she now won't sleep more than an hour at a time and not unless on or next to an adult. She screams if we put her in her cot awake and even if we transfer her once asleep 9 times out of 10 she will wake up and we'll have to start all over again. Only way we get any sleep is to cosleep.

Naps are the same - must be with mummy or daddy. And I can't leave her in our bed to nap; it's too high and she is an enthusiastic sleep gymnast.

She's never been a great sleeper and she's teething as well as in the throes of separation anxiety but I am losing it. I can't bear the thought of CIO so I bought No Cry Sleep Solution and it made me feel more reassured... but I just don't know how to help her.

And I'm so horrible - I really resent her at night and I properly yelled a torrent of abuse at my own mum on the phone the other night. I'm no fun to be around and awful to my husband too who is trying so hard to help.

She at least used to reliably go from 7 til about 10.30 before waking up so we had an evening to ourselves but she's fast asleep on me now, at 9.55, and this is the third time tonight I've had to resettle her. And as soon as I move her three steps to her cot she'll wake up and dissolve into hysterics before I've even stood up.

I just want this to end and for her to be like my friends' babies who go 12hrs without complaint. I don't get what I'm doing wrong.

Excellent post, Hear.

DH is currently trying to settle her after I spent 2 hours lying with her and being poked in the eye with a dummy/pushed/yelled at.

We've gone through the misery of 8 teeth but she teething again (I think it's the molars) which is pissing her right off and turning her into a pocket-vampire who bites everything aggressively.

I can hear her crying through the monitor and need to go rescue DH.

Commander I don't think you're doing anything wrong, I know it's horrendous, but it's just the way it is and it will pass!

Suchanamateur what's the name of that concealer please? My dark circles have their own postcode these days.

commander have you thought about mattress on the floor for DD or some other safe place? Think it is suggested in NCSS. I can totally relate to what you're going through as it is so similar to me. I nap with DS in morning (much needed by all concerned) and take him out in his pram in the afternoon or even hold him and read a bit or something. Have given up on trying to 'get things done' at these times and made peace with the long list of chores. At night I nurse him to sleep in our bed and have rails and pillows and a video monitor nanny cam type thing so he is safe. Far from ideal but I was loosing my mind spending hours and hours trying to put him in his cot only for him to reawaken 30 mins later. This too shall pass...

Elphaba hope you managed to get constipation caused shut eye too, IYKWIM...

Commander to echo the others' - you have done nothing wrong. Babies are random, frustrating and wonderful in equal measure. Hear's manifesto for our sleepy band sums it up perfectly.

Poppy its called By Terry and its their under eye concealer. Spenny but has lasted me through DS and now DD induced eyebags - so three years.

We seemed to have stalled a bit to one wake and up at six and into mummy's bed. Only the one wake last night lasted an hour and a half. Can't work out whether we should just decide we've got all we can from cc and jack it in or persevere and be more consistent than we've been what with illness and early mornings. I've promised DH we'll see it until the weekend and then assess. I think I need to stick to this agreement because DH and I argue so much about sleep and are generally not in a good place at the moment. Having children may have done wonders for our family, but nothing for our relationship..

Hi there, hope you don't mind me joining in, but I'm at the end of my tether because of lack of sleep. I have 2 DC, one is 2.5 and the other 9months, neither have been fantastic sleepers. My 9month old has now stepped up the number of night wakings, I know that he is teething but even when I give him ibuprofen he'll last a couple of hours and then wake up, if it's early on in the evening he'll go to sleep on my husband or I but not back in his cot, during the night he'll sleep with me and wakes up every couple of hours and thinks its a great joke, sometimes he'll go back to sleep bf'ing others he doesn't, often hubby will take him so I can sleep (and vice versa). Then the 2.5yr old wanders in normally between 12-6am (6am great, 12 not!). She suffers from night terrors and nightmares, so will sometimes toss and turn all night. Even when I put her back to bed she'll either come back in to me an hour or so later or into her dad (whose now resorted to sleeping in another room, which I can't say I blame him for doing)....
We need sleep because tempers are frayed with each other and the kids, there's been lots of yelling lately.........

Worst is I feel like I should know better or have been tougher second time round but it's been the total opposite

Hello taten,welcome :)

I have a similar situation to you in that I have two of 10 months and 3.5, but the older one has nightmares and night terrors too. My DH does such a physical job that he rarely wakes and as I am SAHM I get up,but juggling the two is hard.

Things that I have found helped dd1 were story tapes to get back to sleep and a rabbit nightlight. Also not to talk too much to her or touch her in the middle of a night terror, just quietly and calmly say 'mummy's here, go to sleep. Also she used to toss and turn and wake a lot until we got rid of some faulty electrical equipment on the other side of her wall, which was humming and because it was quieter at night it was waking her up,worth a check.

With the younger one, I just try to remember it is a phase and ride it out between teething episodes catching naps or lie ins on the weekends to survive .

To be honest we are thinking of doing controlled crying with the younger one, just don't know what else to do, my hv recommended we do it and we did it with the 2.5yr old (which was amazing - she did a 5hour stretch first night)

Well, we've managed a 90 min nap and an a 60 min one so we're doing better today. Last night was horrible though and I just lost it which upset DD even more.

I know I'm not the only one with a crap sleeper - not even in real life - but I felt like shit this afternoon when all the other mums at swimming said their babies sleep through consistently. They all did CC/CIO though - the Estivill method? - and I just can't bear the thought of it. But there's a very strong inference from people that she won't sleep otherwise and NCSS doesn't work. Back, rod for, etc.

Next person who tells me to put her down awake is going to get a kicking. It. Is. Not. Possible! Not unless I want hysterical baby.