Banned for calling out dogwhistling posts

[DebbieHurry]

Yesterday, there was yet another dogwhistlng, vague post on the lines of " Should I send my kids back to school in September? Social media warns of a terrorist attack". This is about the 5th such post in the last 10 days. All by posters spreading panic and fear. I have reported in the past and MN has ignored it. Posts continue to mushroom.

Yesterday, I posted telling people not to get news from Tiktok and pointed out that there have been a spate of such posts.
My posts were deleted, and then my account was banned. My previous username was @KateMiskin.

Could @MN please explain why they allow blatant scaremongering and dogwhistling on a parenting site when the police commissioner has urged people not to spread rumours? And why my account was deleted? I said nothing offensive or that broke the rules. I have been a member for over 20 years.

I agree. Media is full of "I'm not a racist but . . . " haters, both presenters and contributors, stirring up trouble for this weekend. It's absolutely sickening.

I didn't see the posts/threads in question but your activity may have come under the banned behaviour of "trollhunting" if you were repeatedly calling out other posters. Your initial reaction of "reporting" threads that concern you was correct. Mnhq then decide whether the post is in good faith or not. If you aren't satisfied what happens there, starting a thread in sitestuff to ask about their policies should be the 2nd step. Taking matters into your own hands should not be.

I’ve reported those posts. According to @mnhq they don’t break talk guidelines.
Unbelievable really but that’s where we are .

It would be better for you to liaise with MN over email rather than set up a new account as strictly speaking, you are not allowed to open another account once banned. Rightly or wrongly, and it sounds wrongly, you are now a PBP.

And PS - agree there has been an influx of dog whistling / faux naive posts recently. I’ve spotted them too.

It sounds like you fell into the trap of troll hunting.
Better to report and not engage. Engaging just fuels the threads

Or if you don't mind fueling the threads then comment In a way that isn't troll hunting

So is troll hunting a greater offence than racism and scaremongering ?

Of course not.

But troll hunting is banned in MN. And the best thing to do with awful posts is report them - or if you want to engage then find ways other than troll hunting

You could argue- and probably should- that this is a reasonable, rational site. People posting here will generally get a kick in the pants from posters like you which spreads the message that this is misinformation.

Otherwise there’s no counter argument to whatever crap is spreading on TikTok.

I don’t think stopping people talking is ever the right course, to be honest. How will they ever hear a different opinion if they aren’t allowed to raise it? Just leads to more conspiracy nonsense.

Not the point if the thread, but I didn’t know this was called Dog whistling. I thought this thread maybe about dogs (and wondered why it would be banned).

I agree, your thread shouldn’t have been banned. There’s definitely been an influx of these posts recently.

I have reported those dogwhistling threads numerous times. The country is a tinderkeg anyway. MN should have zero tolerance towards posts that spread rumours.

If MN wants to ban my account for being a previously banned poster, they can 🙄 I will just open another email account. Exactly like all the bots are doing.

I think it’s time for MNHQ to seriously overhaul how they deal with posts like the ones you’re referencing @DebbieHurry

There are so many of them right now, it’s both alarming and very dispiriting, especially as they are probably also not being started by genuine MNetters, but are deliberately placed to stir up discontent.

Mostly they steer very clear of outright racism, so they don’t get banned. And when they’re reported, all we get back is that the post(s) haven’t broken Talk Guidelines, which really isn’t good enough.

On here, yes.

I havent seen posts on here, but if they're like the ignorant social media ones then agree they should be dealt with. Not sure if the creators are purposefully stirring an agenda or genuinely a bit...not clever, but referencing the terror threat scale as if its new when its been in place since 2006 is wild. Sadly people do read/watch and believe it and ultimately their children suffer by parents making uninformed decisions about their future based on scaremongering.

Yeah it’s an interesting term, and one that is now widely misused (a bit like ‘gaslighting’).

I think the OP has it right though - it’s a form of messaging via threads/posts that are designed to ‘subtly’ alert and attract the attention of those already potentially predisposed to that way of thinking, while not strictly speaking breaching any rules.

Owen Jones (mis)uses it a lot, I think, as do some Labour politicians facing criticism on social policy. They use the term ‘dog whistle’ for example to accuse women of being horrible bullies for simply saying ‘I am concerned about women’s rights and children’s safeguarding’.

Replace dogwhistling with " spreading incendiary rumours" if you prefer. The name doesn't matter.

I saw your posts as KateMiskin and they were only pointing out misinformation and that social media is being strategically seeded with false rumours such as those in that thread. We can’t know whether a particular poster is on the level or not, but you did not troll hunt that I saw and I’m disappointed that MNHQ have seen fit to ban you. They keep telling us to report, but it seems if you report too much you get banned. If you take their alternative suggestion of “challenging on the thread” you also get banned. I can’t understand their reasoning in the febrile atmosphere of society at this time. Mumsnet doesn’t stand apart from any other social media site in its duty to ensure misinformation isn’t spread. They manage it for antivaxx posting (not discussion about vaccines, as it should be) so I’m mystified as to why they can’t manage it for this issue.

If this sort of posting doesn't break talk guidelines, then perhaps it's time that the talk guidelines were reviewed?

The way that [dis]information is deliberately and rapidly spread over social media and fora has changed a lot in the last couple of years.

It's completely unrecognisable from the way that news etc was shared when I first joined MN 18+yrs ago, which itself had a much smaller reach.

I remember it from Brexit and it was clear there were Russian trolls on here and MN helped the country do exactly what Putin wanted by not shutting them down

But I don't think getting ourselves banned is going to help either. That said if as people are saying you weren't troll hunting then that is more perplexing and does need explaining

MN needs to be way faster at dealing with these. I don't bother even opening lots of threads now because the title alone tells me it's a faux naive shit stirrer or an outright disinformation spreader. I do sometimes report them and they sometimes get removed. But there was one in the last few months that was allowed to run and run.

I don't know if they have but, if not, they need some dedicated content reviewers to pick up bad faith posts really quickly. We know people only read headlines so those alarmist/fake headline threads need to be tackled. It's not new though and MN seems, to me, not quick enough in dealing with it.

I agree with you OP as well. It’s concerning that it’s tolerated.

I think social media today is a powerfully dangerous tool because so many believe what they read. It is capable of pitching people against each other and creating massive polarisation within countries. I worry about the long term effects of it.

Hello @DebbieHurry

Thank you. We emailed you last night so we please check your inbox - we see that you have not read the email we sent at 6:47PM. But just to be clear you were not banned and the only reason your posts would have been removed would be because they went against our Talk guidelines.
MNHQ

Agree about the influx of dog whistling/"just asking questions" shit stirring on here. It is depressing.

Yes, my bad. I missed that mail for which I apologise. Apparently I have just been suspended for 24 hours for troll hunting. Not happened to me before so didn't realise posters could be suspended.

Still, I find it disturbing that troll hunting is so tightly moderated, but endless racist and shit stirring threads go unchecked. I expect more such threads before September. I have no issues with people discussing terrorism if they provide facts and links to news reports. But all this disingenous " I am just an anxious mum worried about my kids" is just vile.

It's a Farage favourite practice. "Who me ? You could not be more wrong. I'm just standing here mentioning that our country is . . . It's not my fault if others agree, this is just Free Speech. And this is not a weapon, its just my gigantic wooden spoon."