Racist thread

[ThejoyofNC]

There is a thread running in AIBU where people are being openly and freely racist. You've already deleted several posts on there so you're aware of it. Why are you allowing it to run?

Also why do you allow racism against travellers on here?

What you seem to be saying is that you have racist views and you want other people to show tolerance and resilience to them. You reject the idea that issues can be aired without racism and you're being censored if asked to keep racism to yourself.

What have you moved on from?

The council I used to work for did something rather interesting. Because they had also been "plagued" by "they’ve all left a whole lot of mess and criminal activity behind". Multiple times in a year they had the same problem and the same complaints. So they did some "experimenting".

In terms of "mess" they looked at the sites that travellers used and came up with a fascinating insight. There was no bloody place to leave the "mess". So they did a completely ridiculous thing. They put in skips for the mess and travellers used the skips, so no mess left behind.

They also worked with the police and found something else interesting - despite comments to the contrary there was not a single increase in actual local crime whilst they were there. Lots of complaints about things that were not crimes, but no increase in crimes.

The problem is that "lived experience" also includes "lived prejudices". You can believe something that isn't true. Yes there will be some travellers - as with every single group of people - who are not nice or good people. But when you can find nothing good about a group of people, then you need to wonder if the problem isn't you.

Yes I am. But I have experienced censorship in my professional life and seen others endure it.

Do you realize you are throwing around the word racism with no objective fact?

What I value above all else, and I think is a strength of a healthy community, is the ability to speak freely.

The thread is about racism and I provided information on what racism is, so we're both clear about what we're talking about.

problem is that some people are allowed to speak freely whilst others are not - funny that

Woah! Maybe worth scrolling back to the definition of racism given by a pp.

That's interesting. What I value above all else, and I think is a strength of a healthy community, is the absence of racist and hate filled speech, lumping people together and believing the worst of them.

A healthy community is not a community that others people who are different based on bigotry and prejudice. When you apply a negative characteristic to a group of people, or most people within a specific group of people, based solely on their ethnicity or skin colour, that is racism. It's really simple.

If people keep "censoring" you and people you know, it is perhaps time to wonder whether it isn't you that is the problem.

This 💯 👏👏👏👏👏

You're cherry picking Western values which I see a lot. People loudly proclaiming their allegiance to Western values don't seem to believe in the rule of law, human rights, tolerance or equality. Free speech seems to involve braying to anyone who'll listen about their bigotry.

I wish some people would take a step back and actually think.

That you’ve had to post the bleeding obvious is a very worrying sign of our times.

Though I imagine that’s what many sensible people have known and said, going back to the year dot when Grunt got together in the corner of the cave with Og and said, “know what?, I’m really not too sure about Ug because, you know, look at him. I mean he looks a bit different from us. So off went Og and told Stig, who told Grog. And so it went on and here we bloody are. Millennia later. Have we learned? No, of course we haven’t. Obviously.

It’s bloody tragic. We all came from the same f*#king place.

The irony

That was also my response!

Just to be utterly clear, YABVVVU, because we all know that Ug was seen hanging around with those Neanderthals, and Grog told me that (don't tell anyone) Ug's dad was a Neanderthal. Or was it Australopithecus? One of those things. I get them all very confused, but Flint told me they rape homo sapiens females and implant them to make hybrids, which is something very different from working from your cave apparently....

Those of you on the right, especially Reform voters, who wang on about wanting ‘freedom of speech’, and objecting to anyone here who is saying that MN shouldn’t allow racist posts - you need to understand that we do have freedom of speech in the UK, but it comes with certain responsibilities. You simply cannot say anything that you wish, and then defend it by saying it’s freedom of speech.

What does the law say about freedom of speech?
The right to freedom of speech is protected under common law in the UK. It is also guaranteed under Article 10 of the European Convention on Human Rights (ECHR), where “everyone has the right to freedom of expression”. This right is incorporated into UK law by the Human Rights Act (HRA) 1998, where the HRA requires the courts to interpret legislation in a way which is compatible with the Article 10 ECHR right so far as it is possible to do so.

Under the Article 10 right, freedom of expression includes the right “to hold opinions and to receive and impart information and ideas without interference by public authority”. This means that both the public and the press are able to share what they think, feel and believe without censorship, even where the expression of their views may shock, disturb or offend the deeply-held beliefs of others.

This is not, however, an absolute right. It carries with it duties and responsibilities, and can be “subject to formalities, conditions, restrictions or penalties”. Still, any limitations on the right to free speech must be both “prescribed by law” and “necessary in a democratic society”. These limitations must also be proportionate.

Subject to these conditions, Article 10 goes on to specify the limited circumstances in which the right to free speech can be legitimately curtailed. These include where it is in the interests of national security or public safety; for the prevention of crime and disorder; for the prevention of disclosure of information received in confidence; for the protection of health or morals; for the protection of the rights and reputation of others; as well as for maintaining the authority and impartiality of the judiciary.

From: https://www.lawble.co.uk/freedom-of-speech/
What is Freedom of Speech in the UK? - Lawble
Freedom of speech forms a fundamental part of our democracy. The UK public and press enjoy some of the greatest freedoms of anyone in the world to express their opinions and ideas. The following guide on the rules relating to freedom of speech in the U...
https://www.lawble.co.uk/freedom-of-speech/

I saw a jokey looking thread about an hour ago, is it against talk guidelines to make silly threads ? (obviously not related to OP concern)

Good man who called one of his constituents a bigot 😉

You need to check with MN @Ashley911 I can’t keep up with the moderation rules these days so I mainly stick to threads with posters who I’ve been chatting to for years on here. It’s safer that way. Posting anywhere else, even on this thread, is fraught with uncertainty.

Freedom of speech, innit.

P.S. he wasn't wrong. Also, she wasn't his constituent.

Eta: this is the exchange below.

Duffy said: "We had it drummed in when I was a child … it was education, health service and looking after the people who are vulnerable. But there's too many people now who are vulnerable but they can claim and people who are vulnerable can't get claim, can't get it."

Brown replied: "But they shouldn't be doing that, there is no life on the dole for people any more. If you are unemployed you've got to go back to work. It's six months…"

Duffy interjected: "You can't say anything about the immigrants because you're saying that you're … but all these eastern European what are coming in, where are they flocking from?"

Brown said that although there were 1 million immigrants to Europe from Britain, there were also 1 million Britons who had moved to Europe.

At the end of the exchange Brown said: "Good to see you. Thanks very much." He got in the car and seconds later is heard saying: "That was a disaster," before calling Duffy "bigoted".

😂
The idea that we were “working” caves has made my night!

You are probably correct!

Well, it sounds nice to find a social media forum where you can safely talk to the same people for years, anyway.

Thank God for those lovely people

I have no idea why those quotes appeared in my reply @PhilippaGeorgiou .🥴

I suppose those Neanderthal genes will out.