Urgently need to contact a moderator

[Palace13]

I have serious concerns for another member's safety.
Need to speak privately to someone about this.
I believe the person requires an urgent police welfare check.

[NoCauseRebel]

Well, let this be a warning to anyone who feels vulnerable and requires support here. Not the suicidal, but anyone who e.g. posts that they’re in a violent relationship, he’s still in the house, there are small children, safeguarding issue right there. Anyone who posts that they lost it with their kids as a one off.... safeguarding issue right there. Anyone who has an abusive ex who could sign up as them and post that they want to harm the kids. Safeguarding issue right there.

In short, only post on AIBU because everything else puts you at risk of being reported to the authorities, although one can only hope that the authorities will get fed up of it pretty quickly.

[NoCauseRebel]

Oh and how does calling the police on the assumption that it’s a safeguarding issue and therefore potentially identifying someone fit against mn hq’s Policy of deleting threads on request because they could be outing/identifying?

And I wonder if the daily mail have got hold of this yet.... let’s hope so eh?

This is a serious, serious failing on mn hq’s Part. Support my arse.

[ClosdesMouches]

Well, this has been an interesting read. I didn't see the original thread so only have the information that I've seen here on this thread, but I think we need to hear more from MNHQ.

[ShittensAndKittens]

Duvet Over "Also, the emotional hooks that he threw out that were the key to me".

Yes, I agree with this. He was talking about having reached out to a couple of friends who didn't offer himsupport and (paraphrasing here) wondering how they'd feel 'after'. And how he kept picturing his ex sobbing by his grave.

If it was a genuine post, it was posted by a person in crisis, who MN posters aren't equipped to help. It's putting the OP who needs genuine RL help, and the well-intentioned posters who reply to them, in a situation where damage can be done. To the OP and/or respondants.

If it was posted by a troll, it's allowing posters who reply to be manipulated by somebody with ill intentions.

Either way, it's also open to leaving a thread to be used by the emotional vampires who thrive on other people's drama, usually not caring if it's real or not. Throwing out trite 'helpful' statements in order to keep their 'in' on the thread.

[ShittensAndKittens]

Also, as an example of another reason that I believe such threads should be deleted. So a suicidal poster gets oodles of support. Great. Then a few days later, another suicidal poster posts. This time, due to the time of day of the posting, or because the posters who might reply aren't online, or because their thread slips too far down the 'active' list, nobody replies. When I was suicidal, that would have absolutely seemed to me like confirmation of my worthlessness. That the other person got hundreds of supportive posts, but I'm so shit that no one could be bothered with me. Which is obviously irrational and unfair. I was probably pretty irrational at the time. Which is exactly why there needs to be consistency with how these posts are handled

[DuvetOver]

If it was a genuine post, it was posted by a person in crisis, who MN posters aren't equipped to help. It's putting the OP who needs genuine RL help, and the well-intentioned posters who reply to them, in a situation where damage can be done. To the OP and/or respondants.

It's not like this is the first time. I can recognise a post like his/hers a mile off now (and contacted MN about this person). Several years ago a troll on here went as far as sending out suicide notes to myself and several others by pm (we had talked between us and sussed by then he was a troll so weren't upset, but could easily have been (the poster even came back a few months later to talk so didn't 'die'). We had told MNHQ our concerns and been ignored and yet the policy still seems wishy washy and inconsistent.

Same thing happened with the thread last year with man and ill wife.

[DuvetOver]

Also ... it was coincidentally very close to the very sad death of Michael Thallasitis which post people had heard of even if they aren't reality TV viewers - which meant mnetters were more likely to be hooked into it.

[NoCauseRebel]

Yes, I agree with this. He was talking about having reached out to a couple of friends who didn't offer himsupport and (paraphrasing here) wondering how they'd feel 'after'. And how he kept picturing his ex sobbing by his grave. what the actual fuck? And this was left to stand? Seriously?

MN hq’s Silence on this speaks volumes IMO.

[ColeHawlins]

I thought suicidal threads were usually deleted. There was long and heated discussion about the appropropriate course of action a couple of years back. Wonder why/when that changed.

This is true. That's when specialist advice was sought, I thought. (From the Samaritans?)

But it's also true what @ReanimatedSGB says. I deregistered after that lovely episode of Jeffrey being a dick and SGB being raided by armed feds and haven't given MNHQ any traceable details since. It's much safer that way.

[ItsAllGoingToBeFine]

^So we've spoken to Mind and the Samaritans about this and they both suggest that we continue to allow threads in which users talk about feeling very low and having suicidal thoughts but remove threads that are clear statements of intent ('I am going to kill myself'), suicide notes, 'live' suicide threads. ('I have taken an overdose and am waiting for it to take effect'), or anything that involves a description of methods.

Looking at the this thread, this chimes with what the majority of Mumsnetters want us to do also, so henceforth that's what we'll do.

In cases in which we remove threads, we will post to explain to the OP that we are going to delete it, and signpost the Samaritans; PM the OP (supportively, obviously) to signpost the Samaritans; and explain our actions in the deletion message.

In cases where we leave the thread up (the feeling low threads) we will post links to our mental health webguide and to the Samaritans' online and telephone support.

We know there are some who feel extremely strongly that threads that express suicidal intent should be allowed to stand, and we do understand your reasons, but the consensus was so strong on this one - from both MNers and from experts in the field - that it really did feel there was only one way forward.^

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/site_stuff/2216573-OFFICIAL-MNHQ-THREAD-on-posts-about-suicide-troll-hunting-and-related-matters

Rebecca Mumsnet 31/10/2014 17:36

[ColeHawlins]

Well found @ItsAllGoingToBeFine

[Smotheroffive]

Good grief??? What on earth happened!!

I have to say I was very about the fantasies of his ex stood by his grave and everyone balling their eyes out, well that showed them, kind of altitude.

Also, that he described being wholly consumed by his love for her. He sounded abusive, and like abusers who do this to cause the ultimate pain to those they are supposed to love.

Thank the lord she got away is all I can say!

Yes,loads of ignoring of the actual advice offered, and persistence in pm'ing,bit that doesn't give them anything.

I guess it makes sense now the whole pm'ing thing. He's either in extreme distress or has criminal intent, either way its a job for the police, and tbh more trolls should go that way.

They deserve arrest trying to mess with others emotional and mental well-being using threats of suicide for harmful purposes.

[SparklyMagpie]

I felt quite uncomfortable with his insistence regarding the PM'ing and how he completely ignored advice but wouldn't drop it with the messages.

Anyway, I'm actually a little shocked MNHQ haven't come to answer ANY of the questions raised on here.

[ColeHawlins]

I think it's one of those "MNHQ fucked up" situations and soon they'll get round to saying they fucked up and all will be well.

[SparklyMagpie]

Yeah I agree with you actually @ColeHawlins

Brush under the carpet again springs to mind

[Smotheroffive]

So this thread should fall under the same ruling/policy although it's another poster saying they will,not the OP

[NoCauseRebel]

Sounds like the ex had a lucky escape.

All that imagining people sobbing by one’s grave shite is pure manipulation. Would love to be a fly on the wall if the police turned up at his workplace though. Sounds like the tosser got what he deserved, even if I do disagree with how it came about.

[ReanimatedSGB]

Hmm, maybe his ex recognised him from the posts and shopped him herself, because he sounds like a prize wanker.

[Namechangeforthiscancershit]

There must be more to it than we know. Otherwise it does not seem like the policy has been applied consistently.

[Josiebloggs]

I only read his first post and he sounded like a narcissistic abuser.
Contacting police sets a dangerous precedent as now people crying for help instead of having serious intent can post here in the knowledge that help will be sent.. or will it?
Its also stopped vulnerable people from feeling safe to post on here which is unfortunate as an anonymous forum may be the only place they can safely get advice.

[DuvetOver]

Contacting police sets a dangerous precedent as now people crying for help instead of having serious intent can post here in the knowledge that help will be sent.. or will it? . I think the problem is that the two are very similar. OP, whoever they are has a serious MH problem and needs to see someone qualified to help.

[DuvetOver]

To me, this indicates a bunch of moderators with no proper training, and poor recruitment practice. That's not acceptable in a site with this turnover.

[Josiebloggs]

@DuvetOver
But it can't be relied upon, the fact they have now done it once means people may rely on it in the future. That means they DO now have a responsibility to report for these people.
If that is the case where does it stop? They have the means and capability to send help to vulnerable people, they have proved it but safeguarding with zero training means the rational for calling emergency services will differ from mod to mod.

[TheLoupGarouCrew]

Just because MN passed the poster’s details over to the police does not mean that the police actually visited them. Has there been any confirmation of that apart from the poster’s word that they did? The police wouldn’t confirm this, I assume.

@MNHQ, please can you confirm whether you think it’s likely the police would have been able to track him down from the information you gave them? Was it just an IP address? Because it all seems too easy and convenient, and if the poster was lying it raises some serious questions about the well-being and safety of any women who may have PMed him with personal details.

[Bluntness100]

I strong,y believe if mumsnet or anyone has a genuine concern then it's right to intervene if it may save a life.

If it was someone you loved, wouldn't you want them to?