Suicide threat, distressed poster

[picklemepopcorn]

In chat, just posted.

Given the Samaritans just this week have been advising that any interaction is worthwhile when dealing with potential suicide attempts at railway stations, I fail to see the ‘untrained’ logic here.
Engaging someone in small talk conversation can be enough to get them out of a thought pattern. The Samaritans themselves said this

www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2017/nov/15/commuters-urged-to-make-small-talk-to-help-prevent-railway-suicides

Then the responses would help them too

Well, no, they don't - due, again, to the fact that most of the responses come from people who simply aren't qualified to deal with such serious issues and may actually make things worse.

* Because they give a fuck.*

What and you are suggesting that because I’ve said posters in distress should be redirected to the appropriate service that i don’t? That’s a rather large assumption you’ve made there.

Mn can’t entire boundaries, can’t monitor and ensure quality of responses. So actually yes these distressing threads should be deleted

Right. So if they can’t ensure quality they should just slam the door in a suicidal persons face? Just say, hey try them, they won’t resoond via email till tomorrow, and the phone lines might be engaged, but sorry, we can’t help, bye???? For you that’s ok? It’s not for me.

* You can really see who has used these services and who hasn't on this thread.*

Being as I’ve been having suicidal ideation for the past 20 years I really don’t think you can make assumptions about who has used services and who hasn’t.

It’s very common for forums to delete these threads to protect the poster. The policy was made in line with leading mental health charities. Some MNers, as usual, think they know better and are just using this as a stick to beat MNHQ. I am finding myself disagreeing with HQ more and more these days but even I can see that this policy is safest for all involved.

There absolutely are resources for suicidal individuals, the Samaritans being the most accessible and well known. MN is troll central at the moment. All that OP needed was a troll starting on them or even just a bog standard twat goading them at their most vulnerable.

I would imagine HQ are trying to keep a line of communication open with the OP. Talking to someone in a deep and troubled mental health crisis isn't something that should be done on a public forum no matter how well intentioned the advice. But it was upsetting to read and little wonder it has provoked such a reaction.

Biwi that is why they should consider having trained psych professionals on the paid team.

They don't even have 24 moderation.

And how would a psych professional work on the boards, anyway? You'd still have to close the thread and engage one to one. Then what if several people were actively at once? Then none for several days?

Realistically, signposting is the best practice.

I've said numerous times that there is no such appropriate service. The gaps in services are miles wide. There is nowhere for people to go.

There is nothing i haven't tried in 10 years being bipolar. Now I just stay at home in hell and hope i survive, because it's better than being let down.

You don't have to be trained to help a person with mental health problems. If your child or partner came to you and said "I'm going to kill myself now" would you give them a number for the Samaritans and then not say a word to them in case you got it wrong?

Ah mumsnet, the only place you'll be told to ignore the desperate plea of a suicidal mother.

If your child or partner came to you and said "I'm going to kill myself now" would you give them a number for the Samaritans and then not say a word to them in case you got it wrong?

Can you honestly not see that that’s a totally different situation?

Nancy do you not understand the complexities of communicating between face to face and online?

I’m going to bed anyway. I have work tomorrow. Night all x

pay a psych to intervene? they would likely end up wasting hours with trolling idiots!

This thread is a perfect example of why lay people should not be giving advice such as; “duty of care” which is a legal term and totally inappropriate and not applicable to a social media forum. I have been a suicidal individual before, I nearly died as a result of my attempt, I am not without more than my fair share of mental health experience. Lay people can actually say the wrong thing and make it worse, hence why the professionals tend to do a teensy bit of training on the matter. For those who are genuinely wanting to help and don’t just want to shout the odds, Mental Health First Aid courses are brilliant.

I agree that the threads have to come down but surely further support should be offered.

I've just been trained as a first aider at work. I now have a duty of care to provide first aid if something happens at work.

I am grateful for the training because I now feel more confident to help should I encounter a situation in outside life. Although there is no duty of care. Other than being a decent human being.

I'm not a Dr or nurse so would at best be making a ham fisted attempt at helping. The trainer said doing somethi g is always better than dpi g nothing.

Mn make ££££££from this site. We as posters have made mnet what it is so legally there no doubt is no duty of care but as empathetic human beings I would hope there would be a safety net.

And in that situation, you’d be seeking trained help ASAP, surely?

Untrained Posters on mn aren’t able to differentiate suicidal ideation from suicidal intent, or decide if it can wait til morning or needs an intervention now. Or take a psych and social history to determine risk. Or triage who to respond to first. Emergency care isn’t mumsnet role,it really isn’t

If someone said they had crushing chest pain, posters would advise call 999. They wouldn’t sustain a convo about treatment options and underlying causes. But because we all have a familiarity with mood and emotions it can add to the can fix this of the situation. And that’s a problem. Correct advice is seek professional advice

No troll started on them, sure, delete if it happens, but it didn’t. Sure one poster said a two year old was fun, however it was one response in many,

The poster was responding. When they are responding they are alive. That’s it. When they are responding they are alive. When you stop them responding, then you simoly don’t know.

Maybe they called the samaratins and they were engaged for an hour.

What then? At least on there the poster was interacting and as such alive.

You don't have to be trained to help a person with mental health problems

The point is that, particularly when you are dealing with a total stranger you cannot see or hear, the untrained person can say something very damaging. And that's even more of a danger on a public forum when you may get idiots coming on to troll-hunt or goad.

Ah mumsnet, the only place you'll be told to ignore the desperate plea of a suicidal mother.

That's ridiculous. Not to mention offensive.

The analogy really is someone in cardiac arrest and 100 people of variable training and superstition, elbowing each other out of the way to "try things" from proper CPR, through poultices to self-invented potions.

Nancy91 why don’t you have a chat with the leading MH charities and let them know that you think their advice is bull? It is not just mumsnet, it is an Internet wise policy to protect vulnerable individuals. Giving advice face to face is categorically not the same as online!

a public forum when you may get idiots coming on to troll-hunt or goad

Ffs, what is it with this fantasy scenario, no one did that. Did you not read the thread?????? No one goaded, no one troll hunted.and if they do it can be dealt with.

(And some other people rubbernecking. And some trolls taking notes.)

No troll started on them, sure, delete if it happens, but it didn’t

By the time it’s reported, especially at night when most of these threads occur the OP would have read the trolling post and damage is done. Deletions are never immediate.

MN say they have sent suitable links to phantom. It is right that they follow the policy devised with the help of mental health charities. It’s hard though.